It seems to me that UK loudspeaker manufacturers on the whole aren’t that keen on measuring or measurements.
Keith
Keith
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ATC speakers / Monitors
- Thread starter Pearljam5000
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That's what happens when businesses become rent seeking institutions instead of anything productive or useful. This always happens to industries that lose their competitiveness and have to survive on weird nationalism and "heritage".
OP
Pearljam5000
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They do some measurements (not Klippel)
In this factory tour video :
ATC measures every single driver they manufacture in-house, which they pair-match to every speaker pair, and then measures the complete speakers to ensure they all meet the specifications. The same goes for all their in-house-built amplifiers for their active speakers and all their in-house-built crossover filters for their passive speakers. As they manufacture everything in-house, except for the smallest coil in their tweeters, they likely take more measurements than most other speaker manufacturers. 
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If that is true, and I have no reason to doubt it, they're taking meticulous care that every pair of speakers measures as perfectly mediocre as reasonably possible, in the exact same way per pair?ATC measures every single driver they manufacture in-house, which they pair-match to every speaker pair, and then measures to ensure they all meet the specifications. The same goes for all their in-house-built amplifiers for their active speakers and all their in-house-built crossover filters for their passive speakers. As they manufacture everything in-house, except for the smallest coil in their tweeters, they likely take more measurements than most other speaker manufacturers.
Whole-system measurements I think they do take as well but they're not to the standard we expect from a NFS. Probably just axial response vs a "bogey speaker".ATC measures every single driver they manufacture in-house, which they pair-match to every speaker pair, and then measures to ensure they all meet the specifications. The same goes for all their in-house-built amplifiers for their active speakers and all their in-house-built crossover filters for their passive speakers. As they manufacture everything in-house, except for the smallest coil in their tweeters, they likely take more measurements than most other speaker manufacturers.
I know PMC do at least finished-speaker measurements for QC. I think the response on those is entirely intentional...
Yes, but I don't share your thought that they are mediocre in any way; quite the opposite. The pair-matching is also highly impressive, even down to their entry-level passive speakers. Have you ever measured the pair-matching of the loudspeakers you own?
Indeed I haven't. Still funny that for 600-700 the pair, they measure like this:
Isn't it kinda embarrassing that a world famous brand can't even offer that kind of linearity for many thousands? Something a budget brand offering a lot of, in this context, dirt cheap home hifi speakers, seems to have no problem achieving?
ATC really do seem nothing but mediocre considering price and the fact they're supposed to be monitors. All the while you can get something like this for moderate money (~3500/pair):
Now THAT is what I expect from an expensive professional speaker.
Isn't it kinda embarrassing that a world famous brand can't even offer that kind of linearity for many thousands? Something a budget brand offering a lot of, in this context, dirt cheap home hifi speakers, seems to have no problem achieving?
ATC really do seem nothing but mediocre considering price and the fact they're supposed to be monitors. All the while you can get something like this for moderate money (~3500/pair):
Now THAT is what I expect from an expensive professional speaker.
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Thank you, I am indeed, very much so. Pretty much the best 3-way towers you can buy for 1000 the pair or less. Real multi-talents.
DSJR
Master Contributor
They are NOT the same brand in marketing and profit-per-unit terms that they were in Billy and Tim's time. The business has changed a lot and there's still plenty of competition out there on the pro side. Mind you, this niche market may well dictate higher prices as a badge of honour!
Yes, but I don't share your thought that they are mediocre in any way; quite the opposite. The pair-matching is also highly impressive, even down to their entry-level passive speakers. Have you ever measured the pair-matching of the loudspeakers you own?
I have some mechano23 speakers that measure so closely that it basically looks like one measurement, both FR and impedance. Seems like this matching is doable at a budget level, so not even remotely impressive feat at ATC's price range. I don't believe there is anything ATC does that is impressive or surprising, it seems their entire product line has beaten by several other other companies and at lower prices. Actually the only thing that surprises me is how they think a passive speakers could be worth $40k.
Whetever, this thread sucks again as it always will because there's never anything new to discuss because ATC will never measure one of their 3 way and there seems to be no overlap between people who own them and desire to understand their performance.
DSJR
Master Contributor
They may be a vintage and rather expensive design overall, but they're CERTAINLY not junk!!!
DSJR
Master Contributor
I think it's the market (far east?) that decides the existence of such idiocy and they seem to sell to tech-ignorant audiophiles in those parts ('cos the actives are so boring as you can't chop and change amps).
There's a lot of resistance still, to active designs in the higher end domestic scene. Dealers like to swap amps around a passive model as well as cables and they are highly resistent to education sadly...
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Great to hear that, maybe I'll order a DIY kit of those speakers first thing in the morning!
It's time to settle it and send one of their big 3-ways to Amir. Or Erin, doesn't matter.
Costy. Crowdfunding? I'm willing to put in 100 Euromoneys.
That would be Erin, as Amir doesn't seem to be too keen on measuring large speakers. I'm looking forward to seeing those measurements.
I'd like to see the 50s. They're the best sounding set to me by quite a bit.
Seriously though, are there any US-based members owning big ATCs? Shipping one or two speakers back and forth across the country should be virtually nothing, as long as we all come together and actually do it. It's not that much money in total. As a group effort it seems trivial!
It really seems to me this whole ATC = good or bad thing really boils down to a distinct lack of proper measurements. Why not settle it once and for all - at least for one "flagship" model?
Sounds to me like something we could easily do collectively. Isn't this what forums are for, generally, and this one in particular, for science?
Personally I'm very curious about real performance of ATC speakers.
It really seems to me this whole ATC = good or bad thing really boils down to a distinct lack of proper measurements. Why not settle it once and for all - at least for one "flagship" model?
Sounds to me like something we could easily do collectively. Isn't this what forums are for, generally, and this one in particular, for science?
Personally I'm very curious about real performance of ATC speakers.
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