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ATC SCM19 Bookshelf Speaker Review

richard12511

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Yikes, I went away for a day to do some boating, fishing and outdoor stuff and missed all of the excitement. So ATC makes great speakers, EXCEPT for the one Amir tester? I look forward to the next ATC speaker he tests. This could be an anomaly but I’ll wait until the next one performs well before I believe it.

We’ve seen it before with Schiit, some products measured well and others didn’t measure as well. The last few items from Schiit performed very well. Let’s hope the same will be true of ATC. They are a premium priced product and performance should be in the top tier to justify the asking price.

These actually don't measure terribly by the Olive score, though their worst offense is in a critical range, so the Olive score may overrate them a bit. The biggest issue is the price. If these were $300/pair, they would be a fairly good value.
 

Sonny1

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These actually don't measure terribly by the Olive score, though their worst offense is in a critical range, so the Olive score may overrate them a bit. The biggest issue is the price. If these were $300/pair, they would be a fairly good value.

Good point. Unfortunately they are very far from that price. There was a time when speakers like this would have been a pretty good value. It’s hard to justify this price when you can get the superior ELAC Reference, new JBL monitors or a much better performing speaker from Revel at half the price. I’m secretly pulling for ATC! Okay, not so secretly I guess because I just stated it publicly.
 

Xyrium

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Regarding ATC's line-up. Hifimaailma had an interesting blind test comparing 14 speakers in the +-1000€ range. ATC SCM7 ended up in last place.

The winner was Heco Celan Revolution 3 followed by Revel M16 and Focal Aria 906.

The only problem with the Heco's is that I can't place my beer on top of one....
 

Frank Dernie

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As a more universal point, we adapt to sounds and we eventually become habituated to a new speaker, and this becomes our new 'norm'. The brain does a great deal or processing to interpret an 'reconstruct', this Hi-Fi illusion business. Try putting on an FM tuner and switching fro station to station, it takes a long time for the brain to adapt the the shock of the change, acclimatise, and interpret the noise, as instruments.

This is the key thing IME.
One has become acclimatised to one's own speakers and anything which immediately sounds different may well simply seem worse. I have experienced this many times over the last 50 years.
"Burn in" is simply getting used to the change IMO so a quick direct comparison with a favourite speaker will only show similar ones as good.

Personally I am not convinced by a single score, even if Dr. Olive's research is the most comprehensive evaluation of preference which has been so far published in the USA, but I am completely delighted that the measurements are being done, even though nothing tested so far would suit my own situation.
The results have been fascinating and surprising.
At least a million times more interesting/useful than the DAC measurements IMHO :)
 

Chrise36

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Good point. Unfortunately they are very far from that price. There was a time when speakers like this would have been a pretty good value. It’s hard to justify this price when you can get the superior ELAC Reference, new JBL monitors or a much better performing speaker from Revel at half the price. I’m secretly pulling for ATC! Okay, not so secretly I guess because I just stated it publicly.
These are sold used for 900 -1100 euro.Although i purchased my SCM20 for that money.With a sub or two it would be a decent system.
 

AudioSceptic

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No big mix engineer found I have read about found it great though, it just had 2 big plus points, it was found all over the world so it was good cross-check when being in a different studio and due to its mid peak it would resemble tonally many poor kitchen and car audio systems of that time and therefore was used as a final compatibility check and got also the comment "if it sounds good on NS10s then it'll sound good on anything".

And yes, good and experienced recording engineers will make a good mix even on mediocre equipment but an even better one great equipment.
This makes sense, but why did the NS10 become ubiquitous in the first place?

The other question is, should a studio monitor be "accurate" and "neutral", or should it exaggerate faults? If the latter, that would explain why studio monitors are often disliked in a domestic setting.
 

TimVG

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The other question is, should a studio monitor be "accurate" and "neutral", or should it exaggerate faults? If the latter, that would explain why studio monitors are often disliked in a domestic setting.

Which faults would those be? What happens with any loudspeaker is that it embeds its own permanent EQ curve on to anything it plays. So it basically exaggerates (or leaves out) whatever the frequency response dictates. When looking at paintings or photographs, we do so under neutral lighting circumstances, when editing video we do so on calibrated screens - we don't emphasis detail/saturation/.. to find faults otherwise hidden. Why should audio be different?
 
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thewas

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This makes sense, but why did the NS10 become ubiquitous in the first place?
One of the reasons was good availabilty world wide.

The other question is, should a studio monitor be "accurate" and "neutral", or should it exaggerate faults? If the latter, that would explain why studio monitors are often disliked in a domestic setting.
My experience is that "faults get exaggerated" only for a frequency region and when that region is boosted but at the expense of other regions (like looking through a magnifying lens and loosing the overview) so a monitor should be also linear to end also the circle of confusion.
 

sergeauckland

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This makes sense, but why did the NS10 become ubiquitous in the first place?

The other question is, should a studio monitor be "accurate" and "neutral", or should it exaggerate faults? If the latter, that would explain why studio monitors are often disliked in a domestic setting.
The NS10 became ubiquitous for much the same reason why Auratones were for a previous generation of engineers. Familiarity. They were 'typical' of what most consumers are using. In the case of the Auratones, simulating a portable radio or small record player, the NS10s typical of the sort of loudspeaker provided with a lot of domestic systems. I can't give a reason why NS10s rather than any other equally unpleasant small 'speaker, but once something becomes the 'norm', it takes on a life of its own as a known standard. Much like Beyer DT100 headphones, not the best but rugged and ubiquitous.

As to whether monitors should be neutral or exaggerate faults, it depends on the function. When mixing, one needs the most accurate monitors so to be able to hear everything in the mix, and in the right proportions. When quality monitoring, for example a broadcast, then a loudspeaker that accentuates common faults is useful, as if it's inaudible then the public won't hear it either, but as long as there's also available high quality monitoring. This is one reason why broadcast monitoring of faults is often done on headphones, as things like hum, odd buzzes etc are more noticeable on headphones without the distraction of ambient noises, whilst good quality loudspeakers give a better understanding of the overall quality.

S.
 

AudioSceptic

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Which faults would those be? What happens with any loudspeaker is that it embeds its own permanent EQ curve on to anything it plays. So it basically exaggerates (or leaves out) anything whatever the frequency response dictates. When looking at paintings or photographs, we do so under neutral lighting circumstances, when editing video we do so on calibrated screens - we don't emphasis detail/saturation/.. to find faults otherwise hidden. Why should audio be different?
I agree, I'm just quoting some of the studio mythology I've read over the years, usually used to explain differences between studio and domestic speakers.
 

richard12511

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This is the key thing IME.
One has become acclimatised to one's own speakers and anything which immediately sounds different may well simply seem worse. I have experienced this many times over the last 50 years.
"Burn in" is simply getting used to the change IMO so a quick direct comparison with a favourite speaker will only show similar ones as good.

Personally I am not convinced by a single score, even if Dr. Olive's research is the most comprehensive evaluation of preference which has been so far published in the USA, but I am completely delighted that the measurements are being done, even though nothing tested so far would suit my own situation.
The results have been fascinating and surprising.
At least a million times more interesting/useful than the DAC measurements IMHO :)

This may help explain why I've always been very disappointed with every speaker purchase I've ever made. Yet, when I switch back to compare a year later, my old speakers sound terrible.
 

GelbeMusik

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One of the reasons was good availabilty world wide.


My experience is that "faults get exaggerated" only for a frequency region and when that region is boosted but at the expense of other regions (like looking through a magnifying lens and loosing the overview) so a monitor should be also linear to end also the circle of confusion.

The other way round? If the speaker is flawed by so and so much, and You still can stand the mix, and possibly enjoy the musical content, the mix is at least safe.
 

vin63

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I have two sets of speakers in my house.
The ATC SCM 19 V.2 and the Triangle Antal EZ. Two completely different speaker designs; one sealed, the other ported; one two way, the other three way; one insensitive the other high sensitivity.
I enjoy both.
This hobby is finding what you like.
I like nothing more then going to a audio store and listening to different systems.
And sometimes finding something new that works for me.
 

Chrise36

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This is the key thing IME.
One has become acclimatised to one's own speakers and anything which immediately sounds different may well simply seem worse. I have experienced this many times over the last 50 years.
"Burn in" is simply getting used to the change IMO so a quick direct comparison with a favourite speaker will only show similar ones as good.

Personally I am not convinced by a single score, even if Dr. Olive's research is the most comprehensive evaluation of preference which has been so far published in the USA, but I am completely delighted that the measurements are being done, even though nothing tested so far would suit my own situation.
The results have been fascinating and surprising.
At least a million times more interesting/useful than the DAC measurements IMHO :)
Hi Frank i read in an older post of yours that you own a pair of Proac EBS what do you think of them compared to the scm40's?
 

SEKLEM

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I considered buying a pair of these for $700 a few months back. They were in pretty great shape too. My last experience with extremely heavy bookshelf speakers was the Thiel PCS monitor. I don't think I ever hated a speaker more than those. They looked awesome, they were very well made, but they sounded like a panther's butt.
 

Frank Dernie

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Hi Frank i read in an older post of yours that you own a pair of Proac EBS what do you think of them compared to the scm40's?
I haven't compared them directly, so impossible to say.
I bought the EBS on ebay, I had wanted some for years after hearing a demo in around 1980 when I could not afford them. That demo was the best system I had heard by far at that time.
The scm 40 should be better, it is much more modern, though I think the volume and bass driver of the EBS are the same as the old scm50 so a fair bit bigger than the scm40.
One of mine has a resonance I am trying to track down but they are very heavy and my study is too full of stuff to do it properly at the moment. Luckily not many notes on not many records excite it, which means I can enjoy them but the fault is hard to trace.
 

Chrise36

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I haven't compared them directly, so impossible to say.
I bought the EBS on ebay, I had wanted some for years after hearing a demo in around 1980 when I could not afford them. That demo was the best system I had heard by far at that time.
The scm 40 should be better, it is much more modern, though I think the volume and bass driver of the EBS are the same as the old scm50 so a fair bit bigger than the scm40.
One of mine has a resonance I am trying to track down but they are very heavy and my study is too full of stuff to do it properly at the moment. Luckily not many notes on not many records excite it, which means I can enjoy them but the fault is hard to trace.
They come from the 80s i thought they were produced in the 90s or 2000s.
 

Frank Dernie

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They come from the 80s i thought they were produced in the 90s or 2000s.
I remember the demo. I am trying to work out when.
I was in London doing some wind tunnel comparisons with the one I was installing at work and had time to go for a curry at lunch time. Opposite the restaurant was a hifi shop. My colleague and I (he was my tunnel technician then now a bit better known) were both keen on hifi and went in to see what they had. It must have been 1980 because the car we ran in 1981 was the first I developed in the in house WT.
An Oracle TT with Koetsu Rosewood cartridge (years before CD of course), Beard pre and power amps with the ProAc EBS, it was a revelation I have never forgotten.
I don't know how old mine are and ProAc continued to make models with ATC driver for quite a few years, like the Response 5
proac response 5.jpg
 

Chrise36

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I remember the demo. I am trying to work out when.
I was in London doing some wind tunnel comparisons with the one I was installing at work and had time to go for a curry at lunch time. Opposite the restaurant was a hifi shop. My colleague and I (he was my tunnel technician then now a bit better known) were both keen on hifi and went in to see what they had. It must have been 1980 because the car we ran in 1981 was the first I developed in the in house WT.
An Oracle TT with Koetsu Rosewood cartridge (years before CD of course), Beard pre and power amps with the ProAc EBS, it was a revelation I have never forgotten.
I don't know how old mine are and ProAc continued to make models with ATC driver for quite a few years, like the Response 5
View attachment 72290
Nice story and Ross Brawn is keen on hifi what speakers did he like? 1981 would be the Williams FW07 according to wiki.That Proac though with twin domes...
 
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