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ASR burning the wrong witches?

JJB70

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To be honest I don't have an issue with honest snobbery (noting that inverse snobbery is also snobbery). If people enjoy spending $$$$$$$$$$$$s on stuff that's their choice. What I object to is claiming it is all about better sound, when good sound quality was commoditised years ago. Spending $$$$$$$s on the basis of build quality, industrial design, feature set and well, hell, I just like it, is fair enough. I've done that many times in my life and see nothing wrong with it. What annoys me is trying to justify it on the basis of golden eared subjective claims to better performance. And sneering at those who opt out of it all annoys me (though I also don't especially like the inverse of sneering at people simply because they spend a lot either, at the end of the day we're all free to make our choices). It really is no different in other hobbies, although audio is a little different to other hobbies I am familiar with in the extents of some of the craziness (cables, cable lifters, magic rocks etc). I find that in most hobbies those whose passion is genuinely grounded in the hobby tend to be pretty open minded and do not just chase 'more expensivest = bestest' or promote 'anything costing more than $100 is idiocy'. I am into watches, I have several pretty pricey watches and one which most would consider utterly stupid (a 50 fathoms), but I also have G-Shock, Vostok Amphibia, Seagull 63, old Strela etc watches which are hardly expensive and which I love just as much as my more expensive items. Live and let live, but be honest about things, if people like nice things then there's nothing wrong with that, nor just valuing good performance for minimum cost.
 

DanielT

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What annoys me is trying to justify it on the basis of golden eared subjective claims to better performance.
I do not know if it in itself irritates me. People can believe and justify (for themselves anyway) what they want. However, those who try to make subjective claims into objective facts. But even then I'm not really annoyed .... yet. I mean if my friend says he makes the tastiest Spaggeti Bolognes there is, he thinks so. Quite ok that he tries to convince me about it BEFORE I taste, he can spice up (so to speak) his description of how good it tastes with as much superlative as possible. ...... For a while anyway, as long as he finally gives up with his self-praise and has self-insight and realizes that maybe it's just him who thinks so. If that does NOT happen, I will eventually get annoyed. With that said, I love people with passion, so ... well ..that's the way it is.:)
 

DanielT

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Rgarding DACs. Given the enormous development in data/computer technology/IT. My guess, within a few years there will be no need for external DACs. The ones in the computers will be so good that external DACs will be obsolete.

At present, there are slightly different views::)

 

Trell

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Rgarding DACs. Given the enormous development in data/computer technology/IT. My guess, within a few years there will be no need for external DACs. The ones in the computers will be so good that external DACs will be obsolete.

At present, there are slightly different views::)


For desktop usage I like an external combined DAC/headphone amp as there is a volume knob and an easy way to switch between headphones and active monitors. My PC is the floor under my desk making switching between headphones and monitors inconvenient, unless I use an external DAC or some other gear. Moreover, I greatly prefer to not change volume from the PC.

So, I’m going to continue to use an external DAC/amp for desktop usage.

I also have an audio interface for microphone duties on video meetings and that was my DAC/amp until I bought the RME ADI-2 FAC FS.

To conclude: for me it’s not about the quality of the internal DAC of a PC (that is already good today) but usability.
 

DanielT

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For desktop usage I like an external combined DAC/headphone amp as there is a volume knob and an easy way to switch between headphones and active monitors. My PC is the floor under my desk making switching between headphones and monitors inconvenient, unless I use an external DAC or some other gear. Moreover, I greatly prefer to not change volume from the PC.

So, I’m going to continue to use an external DAC/amp for desktop usage.

I also have an audio interface for microphone duties on video meetings and that was my DAC/amp until I bought the RME ADI-2 FAC FS.

To conclude: for me it’s not about the quality of the internal DAC of a PC (that is already good today) but usability.
If, or when, I buy a new computer, I will at least investigate how the different brands / models are regardning the quality of their internal DAC / sound card. If that information is available.But a external DAC with built-in pre amp and remote control is nice and comfortable to have. :)

Or a miniDSP with built-in DAC ... or streamer for example:


There are many options nowadays. Affordable DACs with excellent performance.Fun.:D
 

Trell

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If, or when, I buy a new computer, I will at least investigate how the different brands / models are regardning the quality of their internal DAC / sound card. If that information is available.But a external DAC with built-in pre amp and remote control is nice and comfortable to have. :)

Or a miniDSP with built-in DAC ... or streamer for example:


There are many options nowadays. Affordable DACs with excellent performance.Fun.:D

My PC is soon nine years old. :) Since when I built it I've added more memory, larger SSDs and a new GPU, but I've to prepare to build a new one in a year or two in case of failure. I'm thinking of doing that when DDR5 is more common in usage and AMD has released newer generation of the CPU with new socket, and when the price has come down some on some parts.

I've two other smallfactor fanless PCs built at the same time that are still in daily use and for VPN, video calls, browsing Internet, reading mail, Microsoft Office and watching Netflix they are still more than sufficient. They are getting old and replacement part are hard to get or expensive, so when they break a new one will be built.
 
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Sal1950

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My PC is soon nine years old. :) Since when I built it I've added more memory, larger SSDs and a new GPU, but I've to prepare to build a new one in a year or two in case of failure.
That's a youngster, I built my current in 2008 and with a few of the same upgrades I'm still perfectly happy with it's performance as a audio/video server and general computing duties. I keep thinking over new builds as I also worry about a failure, but been tooo lazy to get into it. I do keep good backups of my files so worst case I'd be down for a few days.
 

Doodski

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I also worry about a failure, but been tooo lazy to get into it.
Keep the dust buildup down to a manageable level and the rest is luck. :D No dust sure helps that's a known. I go in once or twice a year for a dusting.
 

Sal1950

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No dust sure helps that's a known. I go in once or twice a year for a dusting.
Same here, I also keep temp and fan monitors running on the desktop to keep me informed on any potential
problems.
gkrellm.png
 

Trell

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Keep the dust buildup down to a manageable level and the rest is luck. :D No dust sure helps that's a known. I go in once or twice a year for a dusting.

All air intakes have a dust filter which improves the internal problem quite allot. The Seasonic PSU is semi-passive but the fan does not turn on in common usage, perhaps if I play games. Finally, when just browsing Internet, reading mail, just watch Netflix or have video calls, the only fans running are large quiet CPU fans that blows down on the motherboard for cooling that as well.

So, not so much dust problem, but then I don’t own pets either.
 

Doodski

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All air intakes have a dust filter which improves the internal problem quite allot. The Seasonic PSU is semi-passive but the fan does not turn on in common usage, perhaps if I play games. Finally, when just browsing Internet, reading mail, just watch Netflix or have video calls, the only fans running are large quiet CPU fans that blows down on the motherboard for cooling that as well.

So, not so much dust problem, but then I don’t own pets either.
Not me. I don't have a engineered forced air system. Mine is brute force with 200mm fans like 4 of them and 3- 140mm fans too. 280mm water cooler that I hope lasts. Shooter gaming stuff PC.
 

Trell

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Not me. I don't have a engineered forced air system. Mine is brute force with 200mm fans like 4 of them and 3- 140mm fans too. 280mm water cooler that I hope lasts. Shooter gaming stuff PC.

My old PC has an Intel i7-4770K with 4 cores and 8 threads that is undervoltaged and overlocked, but not a monster in any way, at least not anymore. :)

When I put it together almost nine years ago I wanted a silent computer, at least when I was not gaming.

With all the Intel security firmware CPU patches it has become slower, though, and one reason to look at AMD for next build. Another reason for looking elsewhere is that I don’t want a very hot CPU as that makes it harder to cool silently. For me water cooling is not something I intend to do.
 

Doodski

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My old PC has an Intel i7-4770K with 4 cores and 8 threads that is undervoltaged and overlocked
That's fringe element stuff. Not many peeps doing that I think. :D

When I put it together almost nine years ago I wanted a silent computer, at least when I was not gaming.
I like the sound of fans running in the background.

With all the Intel security firmware CPU patches it has become slower, though, and one reason to look at AMD for next build. Another reason for looking elsewhere is that I don’t want a very hot CPU as that makes it harder to cool silently. For me water cooling is not something I intend to do.
I'm not familiar with the stuff going on with the silent cooling equipment stuff. I bet it's cool though. I went Intel because the faster speed is what is required for shooter games. Not the amount of cores but the speed matters. I have my current temps here. Note that this is with the energy savings multiplier reduction engaged.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.png
 

Sal1950

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I use a little different stuff although they both get the message across.
Holy Cow, look at all those Core and CPU reports.
Makes my eyes hurt. LOL
 

IPunchCholla

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To be honest I don't have an issue with honest snobbery (noting that inverse snobbery is also snobbery). If people enjoy spending $$$$$$$$$$$$s on stuff that's their choice. What I object to is claiming it is all about better sound, when good sound quality was commoditised years ago. Spending $$$$$$$s on the basis of build quality, industrial design, feature set and well, hell, I just like it, is fair enough. I've done that many times in my life and see nothing wrong with it. What annoys me is trying to justify it on the basis of golden eared subjective claims to better performance. And sneering at those who opt out of it all annoys me (though I also don't especially like the inverse of sneering at people simply because they spend a lot either, at the end of the day we're all free to make our choices). It really is no different in other hobbies, although audio is a little different to other hobbies I am familiar with in the extents of some of the craziness (cables, cable lifters, magic rocks etc). I find that in most hobbies those whose passion is genuinely grounded in the hobby tend to be pretty open minded and do not just chase 'more expensivest = bestest' or promote 'anything costing more than $100 is idiocy'. I am into watches, I have several pretty pricey watches and one which most would consider utterly stupid (a 50 fathoms), but I also have G-Shock, Vostok Amphibia, Seagull 63, old Strela etc watches which are hardly expensive and which I love just as much as my more expensive items. Live and let live, but be honest about things, if people like nice things then there's nothing wrong with that, nor just valuing good performance for minimum cost.
Just as a complete aside, my too expensive to buy it, but I keep looking and almost pulling the trigger watch is a GP Sea Hawk (white face). My problem is my mechanicals/automatics don't get enough wrist time since I got my smart watches (Fenix 5 and Apple Watch SE). Not that I have anything as nice as your 50 Fathoms. That is a sexy watch!
 

Doodski

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Holy Cow, look at all those Core and CPU reports.
Makes my eyes hurt. LOL
OH Yeah... she's fast. One must take care of what is clicked because things happen pretty fast. I'm almost ready for Sniper Elite 5. I have all the hardware ready and able and just need to get the software installed. I am deciding if I want the deluxe software offering or the standard version. :D
sniper-elite-5-scaled.jpg
 

DanielT

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I use a little different stuff although they both get the message across.
View attachment 209531
But Doodski what the hell was that !? Impressive control, measuring of the heat in any case.:D

I will buy a new tablet in the near future because the one I have now I have dropped on the floor. Spit plastic, in a corner. Crack in the display and so on. It is a number of years old so nothing I cry blood over. An Androdid because I'm not an apple man..fan. :)
 

Doodski

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But Doodski what the hell was that !? Impressive control, measuring of the heat in any case.
The cool part is that when the PC is not loaded it auto reduces the multiplier to ~600MHz for energy savings. I thought it was 800MHz but it says 600... Tops out at ~4900MHz
 

JJB70

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Just as a complete aside, my too expensive to buy it, but I keep looking and almost pulling the trigger watch is a GP Sea Hawk (white face). My problem is my mechanicals/automatics don't get enough wrist time since I got my smart watches (Fenix 5 and Apple Watch SE). Not that I have anything as nice as your 50 Fathoms. That is a sexy watch!
I am the same, my daily wear is a Huawei GT2 smart watch, once you get used to the functionality it's hard to go back. Yet if push ever came to shove I would keep one of my mechanical watches if allowed to keep one piece.
 
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