AsciLab speakers are about to launch

[AsciLab]

Can you help me understand the reasoning? You've said previously that the speaker will be approximately 25.4cm wide, 35cm deep, and 56cm tall.

I'm not sure which values to use for the 1/4 wavelength calculation, f=343m/(Lx4). For 10cm there will be a null at 858Hz. For 17.5cm, my assumption for the distance to the center of the sidemounted woofers, the null will be at 490Hz. For 45cm, the distance to the front wall plus the distance to the midwoofers on the speaker's baffle, the null will be at 191Hz, although I doubt the midwoofers will have much output at this frequency.

That’s correct — my earlier calculation was based on the woofer. It was just a simple oversight on my part. Since this band is handled by the front-mounted midrange unit, it makes more sense to base the calculation on the midrange instead. Thanks for pointing that out — I’ll update my earlier comment.

 

[AsciLab]

We are also preparing measurements with the BX8C for the already high-performing C8C, focusing on extended cardioid pattern and further improvements in THD and MD performance.

 

[AsciLab]

Looking at the rear wall bounce, it seems that absorption >300Hz is still required behind the speakers. What's your setup recommendation @AsciLab ?

Can you help me understand the reasoning? You've said previously that the speaker will be approximately 25.4cm wide, 35cm deep, and 56cm tall.

I'm not sure which values to use for the 1/4 wavelength calculation, f=343m/(Lx4). For 10cm there will be a null at 858Hz. For 17.5cm, my assumption for the distance to the center of the sidemounted woofers, the null will be at 490Hz. For 45cm, the distance to the front wall plus the distance to the midwoofers on the speaker's baffle, the null will be at 191Hz, although I doubt the midwoofers will have much output at this frequency.

If you add the 10 cm to the middle of the sides you geht 27,5 = about 310 Hz. Not soure though where the crossovers are in this design?

Hello guys. I’m here again.
Here’s the correct answer.

The acoustic center point is in front of tweeter, at the baffle surface. And the speaker depth is 35cm.

Then the highest SBIR null point from the back wall is around 245Hz If you place the speaker right to the back wall(34400/35/4=245.7). (That frequency is -12 to 15dB at the 180 deg. No need to worry for occurring SBIR)

So you don’t have to worry about that rear wall reflection around 400-800Hz makes strong SBIR. That area can’t make strong null, only a little boost when you out the speaker right in front of rear wall. And even that range is already -6 to 9dB attenuated. If you put some absorbers at the rear wall which is 5 to 10cm thickness, it won’t affect a lot, only will make just 1 or 2dB ripple.

 

[TheKoC]

Hello guys. I’m here again.
Here’s the correct answer.

The acoustic center point is in front of tweeter, at the baffle surface. And the speaker depth is 35cm.

Then the highest SBIR null point from the back wall is around 245Hz If you place the speaker right to the back wall(34400/35/4=245.7). (That frequency is -12 to 15dB at the 180 deg. No need to worry for occurring SBIR)

So you don’t have to worry about that rear wall reflection around 400-800Hz makes strong SBIR. That area can’t make strong null, only a little boost when you out the speaker right in front of rear wall. And even that range is already -6 to 9dB attenuated. If you put some absorbers at the rear wall which is 5 to 10cm thickness, it won’t affect a lot, only will make just 1 or 2dB ripple.

Thanks for the clarification, I'll keep an eye out for when pre-orders in Euroland become available

 

[Curvature]

Hello guys. I’m here again.
Here’s the correct answer.

The acoustic center point is in front of tweeter, at the baffle surface. And the speaker depth is 35cm.

Then the highest SBIR null point from the back wall is around 245Hz If you place the speaker right to the back wall(34400/35/4=245.7). (That frequency is -12 to 15dB at the 180 deg. No need to worry for occurring SBIR)

So you don’t have to worry about that rear wall reflection around 400-800Hz makes strong SBIR. That area can’t make strong null, only a little boost when you out the speaker right in front of rear wall. And even that range is already -6 to 9dB attenuated. If you put some absorbers at the rear wall which is 5 to 10cm thickness, it won’t affect a lot, only will make just 1 or 2dB ripple.

Yes I think Basotect (white absorptive foam) would be attractive and unobtrusive behind the speaker.

 

[90sNintendoKid]

Wow, I'm impressed by the C8C directivity.....I'm guessing they will work well supporting subwoofers in Dirac ART.....

 

[kharan]

Hello guys. I’m here again.
Here’s the correct answer.

The acoustic center point is in front of tweeter, at the baffle surface. And the speaker depth is 35cm.

Then the highest SBIR null point from the back wall is around 245Hz If you place the speaker right to the back wall(34400/35/4=245.7). (That frequency is -12 to 15dB at the 180 deg. No need to worry for occurring SBIR)

So you don’t have to worry about that rear wall reflection around 400-800Hz makes strong SBIR. That area can’t make strong null, only a little boost when you out the speaker right in front of rear wall. And even that range is already -6 to 9dB attenuated. If you put some absorbers at the rear wall which is 5 to 10cm thickness, it won’t affect a lot, only will make just 1 or 2dB ripple.

Do you have any advice regarding speaker height and floor bounce for the bass region?

Also, what is the height of the acoustical centre when the floor and ceiling reflections are calculated in your charts?

 

[Curvature]

Do you have any advice regarding speaker height and floor bounce for the bass region?

Also, what is the height of the acoustical centre when the floor and ceiling reflections are calculated in your charts?

Play with this for answers more relevant to your room and expected setup: http://tripp.com.au/sbir.htm

 

[AsciLab]

Do you have any advice regarding speaker height and floor bounce for the bass region?

Also, what is the height of the acoustical centre when the floor and ceiling reflections are calculated in your charts?

Its acoustic center height is 280mm from the bottom.

Normally it’s too hard to avoid floor or ceiling bounce as a bookshelf speaker.

With BX8C It may overcome the floor reflection.

 

[kharan]

Its acoustic center height is 280mm from the bottom.

Normally it’s too hard to avoid floor or ceiling bounce as a bookshelf speaker.

With BX8C It may overcome the floor reflection.

I see, thank you.

Wouldn't it more accurate for bookshelf speakers to be placed on an imaginary stand when the floor/ceiling reflections are computed? And consequently, we would have a better Estimated-In-Room response?

Also, are customers in Europe for C8C, C8T and S6B expected to go exclusively through Audiophonics? Will they carry your entire range?

 

[Aldo]

On peut au moins résumer que cette configuration cardioïde spécifique nécessite toujours un traitement acoustique à l'arrière et sur les côtés des enceintes, contrairement, par exemple, aux D&D 8C. Les panneaux acoustiques peuvent toutefois être plus fins, comme pour les monopôles. Par ailleurs, les C8C sont beaucoup plus abordables et présentent un meilleur taux de distorsion que les D&D. Elles restent, à mon avis, parmi les enceintes les plus intéressantes récemment sorties.

That's actually the difficult decision* I'm currently facing:
- one that can adapt to everything and includes everything in terms of dsp
or
- another that measures almost perfectly... -> 8C vs C8C!!
(my listening environment is very poor in terms of shape and WAF)

*There are worse problems, right?! We live in difficult times...

 

[Perou]

Looking great. Pricewise, sizewise and otherwise the C8Cs appear to be in competition with only the highly-regarded Mesanovic CDM65s

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/.../mesanovic-cdm65-studio-monitor-review.59353/
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/mesanovic-cdm65

I'm not qualified to compare measurements in detail. Perhaps another ASR member could help me understand relevant differences?

 

[markstein]

*There are worse problems, right?! We live in difficult times...

The more important we do not forget: carpe diem

 

[kharan]

Looking great. Pricewise, sizewise and otherwise the C8Cs appear to be in competition with only the highly-regarded Mesanovic CDM65s

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/mesanovic-cdm65-studio-monitor-review.59353/
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/mesanovic-cdm65

I'm not qualified to compare measurements in detail. Perhaps another ASR member could help me understand relevant differences?

The measurements look really really good, but I also don't think I've ever seen something with a similar directivity. I've never seen a speaker with a narrowing in the 3-6 k region horizontally, and a narrowing in the 1k region vertically followed by a widening around 2-3k. The sound power diagram tells us that all of this adds up very cleanly. But all the same we have no other speaker like this, so it's impossible to say "this sounds similar to X or Y". If someone can think of something, do let us know.

All the same, among bookshelf speakers the question is whether it sounds very good, or excellent, and if if fits your specific tastes.

And for a bookshelf, distortion is spectacularly low. Dynamic compression is similarly impressive, but again, that uniform but very low compression isn't all the way from 100 Hz to 20k isn't something I've seen before, usually it tends to be at more specific frequencies. I'd be curious to see how it behaves at 102 dB even if that level is higher than what I would personally need.

Also, I forgot to mention because it's sort of obvious, but the SPL limits on the C8C seem to be much higher than those of the Mesanovic.

 

[RexrothPigeon]

- another that measures almost perfectly... -> 8C vs C8C!!

you can't lose, seriously. I'd day it's probably down to features and use preferences more than anything sonic.

 

[Grimoire]

you can't lose, seriously. I'd day it's probably down to features and use preferences more than anything sonic.

And price!

 

[AsciLab]

I see, thank you.

Wouldn't it more accurate for bookshelf speakers to be placed on an imaginary stand when the floor/ceiling reflections are computed? And consequently, we would have a better Estimated-In-Room response?

Also, are customers in Europe for C8C, C8T and S6B expected to go exclusively through Audiophonics? Will they carry your entire range?

Yes, sales in the European region are handled through Audiophonics.
Since inventory allocation is determined by Audiophonics, we recommend contacting them directly for more detailed information.

 

[danishchelsea]

One question I would like to ask about C8C is,
1) does it come with inbuilt DAC and Streamer?
2) What are all the connections behind?
3) Is the connection behind made such that no need space for just the wire connection behind? I mean if I want to place the speaker flush to the wall..

 

[Curvature]

It looks like Ascilab achieved a more or less optimal result when looking at a well-known paper on directivity by Earl Geddes: http://www.gedlee.com/Papers/directivity.pdf

Compare to horizontal polars maps and curves:

Obviously the curves are not the same and follow different tilts, but the net result and smoothness is remarkably close. Geddes did his work in the 2000s IIRC, so some 20 years later a result was reached that hits the theoretical optimum.

Big congrats!

 

[AudioJester]

Is there a grille option for the C8C and BX8C?

Are you launching as a set ir will the BX8C only be released later?