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AsciLab F6B Bookshelf Speaker Review

Rate this speaker:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 2 0.6%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 35 10.8%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 288 88.6%

  • Total voters
    325
C has lower distortion.
You may consider intermodulation (including Doppler) also. That would ask for a real three way, means not a 'sub', x/over ~ 250..350Hz, the classic 'tower'. E/g the Wharfdale are very successful with Linton and such, IM lowered by a factor of 10dB and more. A smaller midrange would help with bringing the center to center distance to the waveguide down, which would emphasize your unique selling point of a best-ever vertical dispersion.

Btw.: I recently raised the topic of 'lobing' in the vertical, and I was told, never mind, shut it down. Now people praise a solution to a non-problem. That's pretty much inconsistent, except ... :facepalm:
 
You may consider intermodulation (including Doppler) also. That would ask for a real three way, means not a 'sub', x/over ~ 250..350Hz, the classic 'tower'. E/g the Wharfdale are very successful with Linton and such, IM lowered by a factor of 10dB and more. A smaller midrange would help with bringing the center to center distance to the waveguide down, which would emphasize your unique selling point of a best-ever vertical dispersion.

Btw.: I recently raised the topic of 'lobing' in the vertical, and I was told, never mind, shut it down. Now people praise a solution to a non-problem. That's pretty much inconsistent, except ... :facepalm:
I raised this with Ascilab on the forum and they responded that they do have true 3-way towers planned. I agree with you that a 50-150Hz crossover between a 2-way and a sub does not offer the maximum benefit in reducing IMD. Where I disagree is the need to use smaller midrange drivers. In theory yes you could improve the vertical, but I don’t think it’s worth the extra engineering time when the existing crossover designs are so bloody good. Ascilab would also benefit from economies of scale by using the same mid-bass drivers in the towers.
 
I would love to see a 3-way design/implementation from AsciLab with a midrange driver covering the range 350~3500 (ATC :cool:).

I’d be curious to see which driver AsciLab will select for that all important midrange role.

A solid measuring active version of the above would probably be a good candidate to replace my KH310 if it comes to fruition.
 
I would love to see a 3-way design/implementation from AsciLab with a midrange driver covering the range 350~3500 (ATC :cool:).

I’d be curious to see which driver AsciLab will select for that all important midrange role.

A solid measuring active version of the above would probably be a good candidate to replace my KH310 if it comes to fruition.
The problem with crossing at 3500Hz even if you use a smallish midrange driver, is that the result is vertical lobing.

I honestly think that Ascilab have solved the problem by crossing at 1-1.5KHz.
 
... a midrange driver covering the range 350~3500 (ATC :cool:).
That would ruin the vertical (ATC). Except you consider the vertical as a non-issue. Or, it would still ruin it in my book.
 
@AsciLab
Now that I think about it, why not offer distribution to @Audiophonics which is a reference in Europe?
Me too, I would greatly appreciate that Audiophonics takes the distribution of Ascilab for EU.

Audiophonics is a serious now well established company, with a good service. It designs too, under its own brand, some well engineered amps and streamer/amps using top components (for instance : Purifi, Ncore and 3E Audio classe D modules).

This company covers all Europe and of course particularly France -it's a french company.

Ascilab would be an excellent "add on" to its already large number of distributed brands. I wish that Audiophonics executives read these comments.
 
That would ruin the vertical (ATC). Except you consider the vertical as a non-issue. Or, it would still ruin it in my book.

"To ruin" is quite excessive.

If well designed, a 3 way speaker won't ruin anything (look at Neumann and Genelec classic three ways, d'you really think they're flawed ?).

Indeed, I have seen a picture published on ASR showing a prototype of a large Ascilab three way taken in their showroom (can't find back this pic among the overwhelming number of ASR posts). So, They can work properly on such a speaker, Ascilab has proven yet its expertise to design good speakers, whatever type and size.
 
"To ruin" is quite excessive.
Don't think so. The step from the usual +/-20° (or even less) vertical to +/-40° is huge. I made it with some effort to -20°/+60° (steered upward) and that's a difference even a layman can tell. The good vertical, despite symmetrical for no good reason, is the unique selling point for me.
 
"ruined" vertical

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For real though, a narrow vertical is a easier to integrate in a room than a wide one. No one is calling the Perlisten's vertical "ruined".

And as Ascilab pointed out, once you're at a reasonable listening distance, 20 degree before meeting the lobe is more than enough.
 
"ruined" vertical
... a narrow vertical is a easier to integrate in a room ...
Is it a misunderstanding? With "the vertical" I was addressing the coloration from 'lobing', the eyes in the plot you quoted. Anyway, the 'integrate in a room' is an argument, but as such might be untrue. I know, people say that often.

Anyway, the layman, as I sad will learn that the speakers like the AsciLab still sound just right even when standing up. It's not a drama, because people got used to bad speakers, but.
 
Is it a misunderstanding? With "the vertical" I was addressing the coloration from 'lobing', the eyes in the plot you quoted. Anyway, the 'integrate in a room' is an argument, but as such might be untrue. I know, people say that often.
With regards to lobing, I believe there are two issues.

The first is the necessity to keep your listening position in between the lobes. If the lobes are more than 20 degrees out below and above, for most people that won't be an issue.

The second is about the lack of reflection from the floor and ceiling bounce at the frequencies of the lobing. Here the research seems to indicate that we're less sensitive to this, and for the aforementioned KH420, its lobes are fairly narrow in terms of frequency band width anyway.
 
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With regards to lobing, I believe there are two issues.

The first is the necessity to keep your listening position in between the lobes. If the lobes are less than 20 degrees out below and above, for most people that won't be an issue.
Maybe, because people got used to that weakness. Many also praise coaxials, which solve exactly that problem (while introducing others, of course). Since AsciLab the problem is a matter of choice.

The second is about the lack of reflection from the floor and ceiling bounce at the frequencies of the lobing. Here the research seems to indicate that we're less sensitive to this, ...
I'm a little bit concerned about the technical aesthetics. It's just not graceful to have those lobes, and second to that, the argumentation with what "we" hear and should be aware of, isn't that nice either. Way too often the research confirms just the status quo ... excuses. Again since AscuLab we know that. Game changer, hence it has its selling point, don't lose it.
 
Maybe, because people got used to that weakness. Many also praise coaxials, which solve exactly that problem (while introducing others, of course). Since AsciLab the problem is a matter of choice.


I'm a little bit concerned about the technical aesthetics. It's just not graceful to have those lobes, and second to that, the argumentation with what "we" hear and should be aware of, isn't that nice either. Way too often the research confirms just the status quo ... excuses. Again since AscuLab we know that. Game changer, hence it has its selling point, don't lose it.
Speakers are always a matter of compromise. Knowing what human ears/brains are more or less sensitive to allows a speaker designer to make the best possible compromises. It also allows a prioritization of design goals to meet when given a price point to achieve.
 
WOW… A inexpensive reason to buy more expensive amps….you better put those on the “short list” please..its shaping up to be a good Christmas.
 
The problem with crossing at 3500Hz even if you use a smallish midrange driver, is that the result is vertical lobing.

I honestly think that Ascilab have solved the problem by crossing at 1-1.5KHz.

That would ruin the vertical (ATC). Except you consider the vertical as a non-issue. Or, it would still ruin it in my book.


The reason I mentioned 350-3500 is because it is my opinion (I have no proof) that having just one driver handle the critical range and doing it extremely well, is the foundation of ATC/psiaudio/Genelec success.
  • ATC50 = 350-3500
  • psiaudio A25M = 400-3300
  • Genelec 8361 = 320-2800

That's why I am keeping an open mind ... and eagerly watching which direction AsciLab will take for their 3-way speaker design.

.
 
The reason I mentioned 350-3500 is because it is my opinion (I have no proof) that having just one driver handle the critical range and doing it extremely well, is the foundation of ATC/psiaudio/Genelec success.
  • ATC50 = 350-3500
  • psiaudio A25M = 400-3300
  • Genelec 8361 = 320-2800

That's why I am keeping an open mind ... and eagerly watching which direction AsciLab will take for their 3-way speaker design.

.

As someone who mixes music for their income, and has built lots of speakers, I've never found this to be true. Some of the most coherent speakers I've ever heard have the xover point smack dab in the middle of where people say it's bad. I just don't buy it and often times I find 3 ways that try to follow this "critical range" to actually sound worse for various reasons.

I wouldn't lump the genelec the monitors in with the others. Being coax really makes them an entirely different beast.

Considering the vertical performance of this ascilabs speaker and the new purifi tweeter, I think this notion of preserving the mid range with one driver is just dead in the water.
 
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