Ascilab C8C Active Speaker Review

[Coltr@ne]

It's unlikely you'll notice any degradation when using analog inputs.

 

[TheKoC]

I find the C8C really interesting, but as a layman I have the following question about connecting the C8C:

My preamp only has a digital output with fixed volume, so I can’t connect the C8C via that.

Of course, the C8C also has analogue inputs, but that doesn’t seem like a good solution to me:

Digital sources would first be converted to analogue format by the (my) existing DAC before this signal is fed into the C8C’s analogue input. In the C8C, the analogue signal is digitised again by the C8C’s ADC before being passed on to the DSP, only to be converted back into an analogue signal by a the C8C's internal DAC.

All of this is correct, You either need a digital out with volume control, or use the analog out, the additional DA -> AD conversion will almost certainly have no negative audible effects (provided your DAC is of high enough quality), but I get it, I don't like to add additional conversions either.

 

[7un5]

AsciLab remote Support impressions

Hello everyone, I would like to share my experience with the AsciLab support, as I think there's not much feedback yet and I posted about these 2 issues here on ASR, after I didn't receive a reply on some of my emails for a while. tl;dr: It's really great after all!

Spoiler: Click for full text

I knew there's apparently only one person in charge of the software and also knowing about the (for me, overall acceptable) delays due to various reasons like world politics and upcoming BX8C shipments, I remained patient. The encountered issues were not of pressing nature either. After a while and contact through PM on ASR, we could establish appointments for remote support and then the issues were quickly resolved.

1. It is appreciated they use RustDesk for remote connection, since it is cross-platform compatible (well, the end-user is bound to Windows due to the HFD software requirements) and open-source (Server can even be self-hosted), so it verifiably does not collect + sell your data and follows very high IT-security standards. None of the other more famous options like TeamViewer or AnyDesk fall into all these categories.
2. Furthermore, for the same concept of enhanced privacy and IT-security, I was delighted the technician agreed on Signal messenger for easier support communication. Really great to see a company that's not even situated in, but does sell into the EU to be willingly GDPR compliant (which would not be the case with WhatsApp etc.).

After the RustDesk connection was established, the technician required to download a configuration file and as it should be, I was asked whether he could do so before opening the web browser and continuing with his work (although I would not have complained - I was monitoring the session). Well, the files could be hosted on a private / privacy respecting server rather than Google Drive but there's always room for improvement.

So overall, some settings which require password access were adjusted, as well as the DSP update to V1.1 applied. If someone questions why there's no instructions on how to do it yourself, I agree on AsciLab's procedure to have these settings locked, as many people would else either degrade performance of their speakers or even render them unusable. What's locked behind the admin access is not a DIY playground; but maybe we can expect an end-user friendly update process soon...

Some suggestions, if you require remote support:

• Do not use a VM for Windows, as correct USB driver pass-through is not guaranteed and this could lead to further issues
• As per their manuals, read the chapter and download RustDesk only through the official website ( https://rustdesk.com ), keep it updated and monitor your support session (also to be of assistance when required, like for plugging in and unplugging the speakers through their USB port)
• [Consider using a local, non-administrator Windows account]
• If applicable and you have the possibility, change your Windows display language temporarily to English; I'm sure the technician would welcome that^^
• Be flexible, as with time zone differences [South Korea is UTC+9] it might be challenging to meet with their working hours

We, two C8C customers, like to thank AsciLab for the pleasant experience and if they manage to keep support and service timings with spare parts availability reasonably short on the long run, through themselves and their authorized dealers, I see no reason to not recommend their products for professional studio monitoring - where a quick solution is required if something breaks (besides, one should always have backup speakers ready) - already at this early stage (meaning young, but very ambitious, company).

I also trust they'll use stronger glue on new batches of trim rings and grilles to keep all the magnets in place when switching from one to the other, @AsciLab.

 

[mewho]

Hey guys! I'd love to hear some professional mixing and mastering perspectives on these babies.

I'm currently in the market for a new pair of studio monitors, upgrading from the APS Klasik 2020 and I know most 3-way speakers in this bracket will beat the Klasiks, but of course I'm trying to squeeze out the best price-to-performance deal. : ]]

 

[Matias]

@mewho welcome to ASR, this C8C should be at the very top your list IMO.

 

[pat355]

does anyone have the link to the BX8C video guide please?

 

[TheKoC]

AsciLab C8C, BX8C Assembly Animation.mp4

drive.google.com

Guys, We share the C8C, BX8C Assembly Animation. Hope it helps well when assembly them.

You mean this?

 

[pat355]

Yes perfect thank you!

 

[mewho]

@mewho welcome to ASR, this C8C should be at the very top your list IMO.

Thank you @Matias

On paper, the C8C looks like exactly what I need, mainly because of the cardioid design. The other pair I have my eyes on is the Neumann KH420, but my room is not the biggest (~15m2) and my 20cm deep rockwool panels aren't doing much below ~130 Hz.

The combo of the C8C + BX8C delivering cardioid directivity down to 35 Hz sounds like a dream for my situation—in fact, it sounds almost too good to be true.

So I guess the question is: besides the cardioid advantage of the C8C which helps with room reflections, can it truly compete with the KH420 on everything else (detail, speed, etc.)?

Maybe @amirm, as someone who has tested and recommended both, can weigh in and help me with the decision

 

[Matias]

@mewho I don't think you will get many opinions on subjective impressions like speed and detail here in ASR...

You can check and compare their spins here:

Easily compare loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

Maybe the deciding factor will be availability, especially the BX8C may take a while (months) to ship.

Btw both will benefit greatly from REW + UMIK-1 + MMM to measure and tame room peaks with PEQ.

 

[illusonic]

room is not the biggest (~15m2)

Both speakers are quite big for that room. Just the C8C or a KH150/310 or the Palmer Orbit 11 would work well. With the latter placed right at the wall there is no need for lower cardioid extension and you can still avoid notches in the frequency response from front wall reflections. In that room size speakers probably must be placed close to the front wall anyways.

 

[amirm]

Thank you @Matias

On paper, the C8C looks like exactly what I need, mainly because of the cardioid design. The other pair I have my eyes on is the Neumann KH420, but my room is not the biggest (~15m2) and my 20cm deep rockwool panels aren't doing much below ~130 Hz.

The combo of the C8C + BX8C delivering cardioid directivity down to 35 Hz sounds like a dream for my situation—in fact, it sounds almost too good to be true.

So I guess the question is: besides the cardioid advantage of the C8C which helps with room reflections, can it truly compete with the KH420 on everything else (detail, speed, etc.)?

Maybe @amirm, as someone who has tested and recommended both, can weigh in and help me with the decision

I really can't give you an unbiased opinion. Further, you are asking me to choose between two of my children. Both are excellent.

 

[dfuller]

Thank you @Matias

On paper, the C8C looks like exactly what I need, mainly because of the cardioid design. The other pair I have my eyes on is the Neumann KH420, but my room is not the biggest (~15m2) and my 20cm deep rockwool panels aren't doing much below ~130 Hz.

The combo of the C8C + BX8C delivering cardioid directivity down to 35 Hz sounds like a dream for my situation—in fact, it sounds almost too good to be true.

So I guess the question is: besides the cardioid advantage of the C8C which helps with room reflections, can it truly compete with the KH420 on everything else (detail, speed, etc.)?

Maybe @amirm, as someone who has tested and recommended both, can weigh in and help me with the decision

The KH420 is quite large and a very deep box to boot. But you do get something for it - the distortion is very low, even lower than the really quite good C8C.

With the BX8Cs, SPL handling is probably similar to albeit somewhat lesser than KH420s + 2 KH870 IIs.

They're both excellent, and I'd struggle to find a reason you'd need subs for either of these in a space of your size. I have KH420s in a similar sized room - things start rattling and shaking long before the speakers have any trouble. It helps that backed up to a wall you get free bass lift from boundary effect - I think the bass is shelved back somewhere around 12dB or so from linear to get it to sound right, so that's effectively 12dB of free low frequency headroom (which is a lot!).

 

[mewho]

@mewho I don't think you will get many opinions on subjective impressions like speed and detail here in ASR...

You can check and compare their spins here:

Easily compare loudspeakers measurements

www.spinorama.org

Maybe the deciding factor will be availability, especially the BX8C may take a while (months) to ship.

Btw both will benefit greatly from REW + UMIK-1 + MMM to measure and tame room peaks with PEQ.

I can get the K420 in less than a week to my door and the C8C will be available within a month or so. As for the measurements and tweaks I'm already doing it for my current setup and using the Arc Studio unit as a standalone solution and pretty happy with the results.

Both speakers are quite big for that room. Just the C8C or a KH150/310 or the Palmer Orbit 11 would work well. With the latter placed right at the wall there is no need for lower cardioid extension and you can still avoid notches in the frequency response from front wall reflections. In that room size speakers probably must be placed close to the front wall anyways.

I'm not sure KH150/310 or the Palmer Orbit 11 will be a worthy improvement from my APS Klasik 2020. Maybe the KH310, but from my research they work best with a sub or better two subs and in that case I'd rather get the KH420. Also, I will be moving into a bigger room this year, so we can say I'm preparing for it, haha.

I really can't give you an unbiased opinion. Further, you are asking me to choose between two of my children. Both are excellent.

I don't believe in unbiased opinions anyway, so I'd be grateful for the biased one. However, if you choose to stay neutral for you own reasons, I'll respect that too.

The KH420 is quite large and a very deep box to boot. But you do get something for it - the distortion is very low, even lower than the really quite good C8C.

With the BX8Cs, SPL handling is probably similar to albeit somewhat lesser than KH420s + 2 KH870 IIs.
View attachment 535377View attachment 535379

They're both excellent, and I'd struggle to find a reason you'd need subs for either of these in a space of your size. I have KH420s in a similar sized room - things start rattling and shaking long before the speakers have any trouble. It helps that backed up to a wall you get free bass lift from boundary effect - I think the bass is shelved back somewhere around 12dB or so from linear to get it to sound right, so that's effectively 12dB of free low frequency headroom (which is a lot!).

Thanks for the input @dfuller !

I'm only considering the subs for the C8C for leveraging the full spectrum cardioid design which paired with the BX8C claims to pull off cardioid directivity down to 35hz that's supposed to help control the nulls in a smaller room like my current one. The KH420 will shake my balls as is, no doubt about it, lol.

 

[Purité Audio]

Cardioid down to 35Hz is imho worth pursuing.
Keith

 

[illusonic]

I'm not sure KH150/310 or the Palmer Orbit 11 will be a worthy improvement from my APS Klasik 2020. Maybe the KH310, but from my research they work best with a sub or better two subs and in that case I'd rather get the KH420. Also, I will be moving into a bigger room this year, so we can say I'm preparing for it, haha.

APS Klasik 2020 is 2-way with a 7" mid-woofer. Kh150 has an exeptionally low distortion mid-woofer. KH310/Orbit 11 are 3-way which gives cleaner midrange at high level. See max SPL comparison below. All of the proposed speakers will have better directivity. So I think all of these would be a clear improvement over your current speaker. Personally, I love the Orbits playing in >35m2.

Cardioid down to 35Hz is imho worth pursuing.

At 35Hz that room is a pressure chamber. And I think they would look huge too. But for the next room...

 

[AsciLab]

@mewho
Even accounting for my bias as the designer, the KH420 stands alongside the C8C at a level where choosing between them is genuinely difficult. Paired with the KH870 subwoofer, the combination would be formidable.

That said, once the bass extension module is brought into the comparison, I have to say honestly that I don’t believe any speaker currently matches the C8C + BX8C.

Unlike other bass-extension concepts that simply high-pass the satellite, the BX8C recalculates every crossover except the tweeter–midrange crossover when the system is integrated. The result goes well beyond the horizontal directivity the C8C is already recognized for — it delivers a level of vertical directivity control that, frankly, I had not seen achieved before. The full-bandwidth directivity integration that follows from this is unlike anything I’ve observed in other systems, and it’s borne out in listening as clearly as in the measurements.

That is the point I most want to emphasize as the designer.

 

[Grimoire]

Unlike other bass-extension concepts that simply high-pass the satellite, the BX8C recalculates every crossover except the tweeter–midrange crossover when the system is integrated.

Are you sure that that is true of the Kii Three/BXT? Bruno says otherwise, I think.

 

[WerT]

The white drivers are ugly. Looks like Revel.... Accuton white ceramic drivers look nice tho because they have a mesh. Are these driver fragile?
Be nice if there is a textreme version one day (mainly for looks)

Does anyone have pictures of these speakers with the grills?

 

[AsciLab]

Are you sure that that is true of the Kii Three/BXT? Bruno says otherwise, I think.

You can share. Please let me know.