Anyone using 16 Ohm speakers with their AVR?

[Chr1]

I am planning a future upgrade to my multichannel rig and am considering using 16 Ohm JBLs for five of the 9.2 channels. (C, SWL, SWR, SL, SR) The speakers are JBL MS26s, which are 16 Ohm. My AVR is a Pioneer SC-LX86 Elite. (140W per channel @8 Ohm)

The L, R channels will be Neumann KH310s, with internal amplification, and I am currently unsure what I will be using as surround rears. (I could use JBLs, as I have 8 in total. Possibly something smaller however. So therefore more likely 8 Ohm). I am aware that the JBLs will require more power for a given SPL, and I have various amps which I can add to the AVRs pre-outs if required. I was originally going to be using Tannoy V12s but I got the JBLs cheap and am now thinking that the JBLs are a better fit aesthetically. (I also suspect my partner would freak at the Tannoy option!)

I like to listen at relatively high volume, which is why I want to use these speakers. I guess that my main concern is that they won't go very loud, even at full volume when powered by the AVR.

Any considerations, info/advice most welcome!

 

[Cote Dazur]

There is no reason why not, particularly since you already have them. With 91 db sensitivity they should play loud enough.

 

[DonH56]

It should be no problem, though note if your AVR's power amp is voltage-limited (as most are) then power available at 16 ohms will be halved compared to the 8-ohm rating (i.e. 140 W at 8 ohms means 70 W at 16 ohms given the same output voltage). That will help the AVR run a little cooler, and 70 W should still be pretty loud as @Cote Dazur said. You can estimate the SPL using an online calculator such as this one:

Peak SPL Calculator

With no help from the room I get about 103 dB at 10 feet from a pair of speakers. You could get a phone app or cheap SPL meter to see what sort of levels you are averaging now. I find 80 dB average pretty loud, and that would be about 100 dB peaks.

 

[Chr1]

Thanks folks.

This is what I thought. I think that I will just try swapping out my surround right and left speakers to see how the JBLs and AVR fare, volume wise. I am currently using a pair of old Mission 770 Mk2s, which are not really capable of high SPL. If the JBLs don't go loud enough I have a couple of Crown Macro-Tech 1200s that I can use. Would rather avoid multiple amp idle consumption if possible. Just got to figure out what's needed for required SPL.

Thanks again

 

[jdbob]

Looked up the data sheet and didn't see a graph of impedance versus frequency. 16 ohms could mean anything. My LCR's vary between 5 and 10 ohms based on frequency (advertised as 6 ohm) and my surrounds and heights between 4 and 15 ohms (advertised as "Compatible with 4- and 8-ohm outputs").

 

[Chr1]

Apologies.
Have attached the manual with relevant specs.
My feeling is that I may just have to add external amps to the channels that don't go loud enough.
Not a problem at all really, but I guess I am also being a bit of an eco nerd and trying to avoid all channels running external amps, as I'd like to keep idle power consumption as low as possible.

 

[peng]

Thanks folks.

This is what I thought. I think that I will just try swapping out my surround right and left speakers to see how the JBLs and AVR fare, volume wise. I am currently using a pair of old Mission 770 Mk2s, which are not really capable of high SPL. If the JBLs don't go loud enough I have a couple of Crown Macro-Tech 1200s that I can use. Would rather avoid multiple amp idle consumption if possible. Just got to figure out what's needed for required SPL.

Thanks again

Do you know what the rail voltage is for the AVR? If they are like Denon/Marantz that are usually in the neighborhood of 60 V, there should be no problem for 16 ohm speakers. Also if the user manual says 4-16 ohms that you got the answer, though if voltage limited to say below 45 V then you might get less output than with 8 ohm nominal speakers.

 

[peng]

Apologies.
Have attached the manual with relevant specs.
My feeling is that I may just have to add external amps to the channels that don't go loud enough.
Not a problem at all really, but I guess I am also being a bit of an eco nerd and trying to avoid all channels running external amps, as I'd like to keep idle power consumption as low as possible.

Sensitivity of 91 dB/W/1m is very good, so as expected, the "recommended amplifier" spec is just 200 W. An upper midrange Denon or Marantz AVR can do it and it would be loud enough. For external amplifier, find out what their voltage limit is first, because many power amplifiers are designed for relatively high current output but not necessarily high voltage output.

 

[Chr1]

Thanks for your help. I am unsure of the AVRs rail voltage. I guess I will just have to test the speakers with the AVR and see how they work together.
Presumably I can't damage anything, and I may just discover that I don't get enough volume from them and need to add external amplifiers?

 

[fpitas]

Thanks for your help. I am unsure of the AVRs rail voltage. I guess I will just have to test the speakers with the AVR and see how they work together.
Presumably I can't damage anything, and I may just discover that I don't get enough volume from them and need to add external amplifiers?

Class D might care about the 16 ohms. Some are made to work with 8 ohms max. So, I'd stick with conventional amps.

 

[DonH56]

Thanks for your help. I am unsure of the AVRs rail voltage. I guess I will just have to test the speakers with the AVR and see how they work together.
Presumably I can't damage anything, and I may just discover that I don't get enough volume from them and need to add external amplifiers?

Yes.

The power supply in the AVR is fixed, or at least has a maximum voltage to the power amps, that will determine the maximum power delivered. Don't worry about it, there's nothing you can do about it, so try and see if they are loud enough for you.

I checked the Hypex site and the current NCx500 lists load impedance minimum 1 ohm, no max, and I suspect others are similar so probably won't matter if you need to add an external amplifier. But check with the manufacturer of any amp you choose to verify 16-ohm operation.

Given all the angst, and if you have not already bought them, are there other speakers you might try instead that are 8-ohm nominal?

 

[Chr1]

Thanks. I bought the JBLs several years ago as the price seemed very good. I will confess to overlooking the fact that they are 16 Ohm. They looked to me like good option for a multichannel system that would be capable of decent SPL. As long as I don't risk damaging anything I will try them out at some point to check out the volume capability. I guess if they don't seem suitable, I will most likely just opt to sell them on.

 

[bmc0]

Class D might care about the 16 ohms.

Only ones without feedback around the output filter—and even then the only problem is elevated high treble response.

As long as I don't risk damaging anything I will try them out at some point to check out the volume capability.

No risk of damage. If anything, the power amps will be happier (i.e. run cooler) with the higher load impedance. It's (almost) exclusively vacuum tube amplifiers with output transformers that care about higher-than-rated impedance.
My 16 ohm surrounds have similar sensitivity and I drive them with amps rated at only 50W into 8 ohms (~25W into 16 ohms). The output capability is sufficient for my needs.