Anybody Out There Who Hears a Difference Between 320 kbps MP3 and Red Book CD? What Differences Do You Hear?

[olieb]

So am I deaf or do I have a poor gear or is the clapping I chose not good enough to show the differences?

I am deaf too. I tried it before and did not perceive any difference with MP3 at 320kbps (audacity) over earphones.
I highly doubt the description of "underwater, totally amorphous".

 

[Zensō]

I hadn't considered lowfi streaming services.
My bad.
But why? I suppose, when you are listening on your phone's speaker, or wireless buds, you can't be choosy.

True, though blind tests have shown that even when listening on high quality “audiophile” gear most cannot discern between 256 AAC/320 Ogg and lossless Redbook or higher.

 

[Ken Tajalli]

True, though blind tests have shown that even when listening on high quality “audiophile” gear most cannot discern between 256 AAC/320 Ogg and lossless Redbook or higher.

I can relate to that, as I did say originally.

 

[Deleted member 48726]

I hadn't considered lowfi streaming services.
My bad.
But why? I suppose, when you are listening on your phone's speaker, or wireless buds, you can't be choosy.

Another contender for the tests in my signature. Go ahead and tell us how it went.

 

[Deleted member 48726]

So am I deaf or do I have a poor gear or is the clapping I chose not good enough to show the differences?

Obviously you need to have a highly resolving system to be able to tell. -You heard that old one before?

 

[paudio]

If I run into an encode that bothers me I redo it differently. I've yet to find something I have to use FLAC for to fix. There were plenty of bum versions of LAME along the way. I suppose if I had an encode of album that bothered me in 320 MP3 I'd just rerip or re-encode in something that doesn't have the same artifacts.

 

[TonyJZX]

i have capped stuff off youtube and have used only 128k mp3 and the quality has been more than acceptable BUT i'm choosing good recordings off youtube ie. vinyl rips

to me HDD space is so cheap I dont know why you just wouldnt use flac on stuff you ripped yourself

but well ripped 320k is ok if you have dont it yourself and you know what you did

random shit off the net? you take your chances but since it cost you zip

 

[paudio]

i have capped stuff off youtube and have used only 128k mp3 and the quality has been more than acceptable BUT i'm choosing good recordings off youtube ie. vinyl rips

to me HDD space is so cheap I dont know why you just wouldnt use flac on stuff you ripped yourself

but well ripped 320k is ok if you have dont it yourself and you know what you did

random shit off the net? you take your chances but since it cost you zip

HDD space is cheap but my time isn't. It may not be limited by storage in 2020s due to very large microSD cards but before that it certainly wasn't the case.

 

[doug s.]

i'm not streaming, but i do listen to internet radio, w/a grace-link internet tuner; its 48khz digital out going to an outboard dac. while there are many internet stations with high bitrate feeds, the station i listen to most - fip.fr - has a 192kbps feed, and its s/q is outstanding. easily comparable to my cd and vinyl. it has an amazingly eclectic variety, and it's easy to distinguish high quality recordings from those just ok and/or mediocre. no, i haven't done testing, but i don't feel the need - it sounds great, that's all i care about. of course, i can't hear anything over ~15-16khz, so maybe that's the reason?

fip.fr is the best station on the planet, imo - fabulous variety, great sound, and it stores its playlist for 30 days. it also offers genre-specific feeds, but i prefer the main feed which plays everything. literally.
https://www.radiofrance.fr/fip/titres-diffuses
its higher bitrate feed:
https://icecast.radiofrance.fr/fip-hifi.aac?id=radiofrance

oh, yes, my system is quite resolving, and i have a nice 26x38x8.5 room where it's set up... (not shown in the pic is the 2nd pair of vmps larger subs and their amp in the back of the room, ~20' behind the listening area.)

happy listening,

doug s.

 

[ahofer]

i'm not streaming, but i do listen to internet radio, w/a grace-link internet tuner; its 48khz digital out going to an outboard dac. while there are many internet stations with high bitrate feeds, the station i listen to most - fip.fr - has a 192kbps feed, and its s/q is outstanding. easily comparable to my cd and vinyl. it has an amazingly eclectic variety, and it's easy to distinguish high quality recordings from those just ok and/or mediocre. no, i haven't done testing, but i don't feel the need - it sounds great, that's all i care about. of course, i can't hear anything over ~15-16khz, so maybe that's the reason?

fip.fr is the best station on the planet, imo - fabulous variety, great sound, and it stores its playlist for 30 days. it also offers genre-specific feeds, but i prefer the main feed which plays everything. literally.
https://www.radiofrance.fr/fip/titres-diffuses
its higher bitrate feed:
https://icecast.radiofrance.fr/fip-hifi.aac?id=radiofrance

oh, yes, my system is quite resolving, and i have a nice 26x38.8.5 room where it's set up... (not shown in the pic is the 2nd pair of vmps larger subs and their amp in the back of the room, ~20' behind the listening area.)
View attachment 326935
View attachment 326936
happy listening,

doug s.

Cool system. That one belongs in the dictionary under "WAF"

 

[escape2]

i'm not streaming, but i do listen to internet radio,

I would classify internet radio as streaming.

fip.fr is the best station on the planet,

Thanks for the suggestion. Checking out their channels right now...
Looks like they're applying some kind of a low pass filter at around 18 kHz, but like you, I can't hear much past 15 kHz, so no issue.

 

[doug s.]

Cool system. That one belongs in the dictionary under "WAF"

the wife is fine w/it.

the single piega, which is in the pic, and was in the system before the horns went in, is now in the kitchen system w/its mate. only took me a year to finally move them.

doug s.

 

[doug s.]

I would classify internet radio as streaming.


Thanks for the suggestion. Checking out their channels right now...
Looks like they're applying some kind of a low pass filter at around 18 kHz, but like you, I can't hear much past 15 kHz, so no issue.

ok, so i'm streaming! not what most folks who stream are doing, tho - no roon, qobuz, spotify, apple, amazon, tidal, etc...

i have no way of knowing what fip's doing, other than the 48khz (which is fine, as that's the grace-link's limitation). maybe they get higher rez <18khz if they filter >18khz? and the 192kbps shows up as 189kbps on the grace-link's display when you want to see the data. (also, it's 32 bit.) fip also has a metadata feed, which displays what's playing, but it's not always working, which is why i have both url's saved in the tuner.

doug s.

 

[escape2]

(also, it's 32 bit.)

Technically, the concept of bit depth does not apply to lossy formats like AAC as it varies from sample to sample. What you're seeing (32 bit) is probably the max bit depth that your DAC supports.

EDIT: Then again, max supported bit depth on your Grace Link appears to be 24, so I'm really not sure what that "32 bit" is all about.

fip also has a metadata feed, which displays what's playing, but it's not always working, which is why i have both url's saved in the tuner.

Which URL shows metadata? I've tried several of their URLs for various stations in Foobar2000 and in SqueezboxTouch and none show any metadata.

Another good/free streaming radio is Radio Paradise - they stream in various bit rates including lossless (FLAC), and do have metadata, but their material selection is a bit dated - you won't find any recent releases there.

 

[doug s.]

Technically, the concept of bit depth does not apply to lossy formats like AAC as it varies from sample to sample. What you're seeing (32 bit) is probably the max bit depth that your DAC supports.

EDIT: Then again, max supported bit depth on your Grace Link appears to be 24, so I'm really not sure what that "32 bit" is all about.




Which URL shows metadata? I've tried several of their URLs for various stations in Foobar2000 and in SqueezboxTouch and none show any metadata.

Another good/free streaming radio is Radio Paradise - they stream in various bit rates including lossless (FLAC), and do have metadata, but their material selection is a bit dated - you won't find any recent releases there.

my dac will support 32 bits on the usb and iis inputs, but only 16 & 24 on the coax and optical, which are the ones i've used, besides what the grace-link supports. so, the 32 bits has to be from fip.

this is the url for fip's metadata feed. (not sure if they have metadata feeds for their genre-specific feeds; i haven't tried to find them):
http://radio-metadata.fr:8000/fip
if you try it now, you get "refused to connect - this site cannot be reached" which explains why it's not working on my grace-link now.

if you're wanting metadata at the higher bitrate, to show up on a tuna like the grace-link, you could query them via email directly:
[email protected]
the lower bitrate feeds all have what's currently playing, and the playlist history that you can see on your phone/computer/tablet/etc...

i've tried radio paradise before; not a big fan.

here's a link for quite a few hi bitrate internet radio stations:
http://radiobit.50webs.com
and a cool link that shows internet radio around the world - literally:
http://radio.garden

doug s.

 

[escape2]

the lower bitrate feeds all have what's currently playing, and the playlist history that you can see on your phone/computer/tablet/etc...

I'm not getting any metadata on the lower bitrate feeds either.

https://stream.radiofrance.fr/fip/fip_midfi.m3u8?id=radiofrance

https://icecast.radiofrance.fr/fip-midfi.aac?id=radiofrance

 

[doug s.]

I'm not getting any metadata on the lower bitrate feeds either.

https://stream.radiofrance.fr/fip/fip_midfi.m3u8?id=radiofrance

https://icecast.radiofrance.fr/fip-midfi.aac?id=radiofrance

i'm pretty sure you won't see it on a regular internet tuner - only on the web. and to see it on the web, use the link i posted prior:
https://www.radiofrance.fr/fip/titres-diffuses

 

[Andysu]

Sooty can easily hear this , i think some dvd have that rate which ones , there was sony dvd that showed the bit rate , but bit rates can be faked so much than busier than piccadilly circus

 

[Peterinvan]

But who can REALLY tell the difference and validate their claims. This should be an open-and-shut scientific case. Something amiss here. Is it lack of DBT trials or 'I can hear it' protests with no substantive back-up from that camp?
'Round and 'round we go ..................................... .

I do not do well on the blind A/B tests with 320kbs and FLAC CD rips.

I confess that because of FOMO, I will continue to pay for Tidal HiRes FLACS, and use balanced output.

 

[doug s.]

I'm not getting any metadata on the lower bitrate feeds either.

https://stream.radiofrance.fr/fip/fip_midfi.m3u8?id=radiofrance

https://icecast.radiofrance.fr/fip-midfi.aac?id=radiofrance

fwiw (if anyone's interested), fip's metadata (at 192kbps) feed for its eclectic channel is back up again...
http://radio-metadata.fr:8000/fip
it will display group/song being played if your internet tuner or radio has a display capability.

doug s.