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Another Opinion on Why Vinyl is Better.

Fitzcaraldo215

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#1
Here is something I recently posted at Computer Audiophile. Read it and weep:

The real reason for vinyl is contained in Art Dudley's response to a letter in the current Stereophile:

"To my ears and to my thinking, the phonograph is the only domestic playback source that does not dynamically compress music. I believe this is so because literally every other source component - CD players, DACs, even tape machines - works by modulating electricity originating in that product's power supply. But, in a conventional phonograph, apart from the motor drive, there is no need for a power supply, since the phono cartridge generates its own electrical current."

So, there ya go. Life made simple and (seemingly) logical by the Deputy Editor himself. Electricity = bad, unless used to spin a motor or generated electro-mechanically in the phono cartridge, which apparently has unlimited, undistorted dynamic capability, unlike all those awful power supplies that we use elsewhere. And, of course, the recording, production and pressing chain leading up to that LP in no way compromises the quality of signal, notwithstanding all the power supplies used in that chain. Who knew that the secret sauce was getting rid of power supplies?

But, I can go Art one better by playing Edison cylinders or acoustic 78's via a beautiful, flower-like acoustic horn, all powered by a hand-cranked spring. Talk about lack of dynamic compression in a system requiring no electricity at all! You guys ain't heard nothin' yet. It is the path to the future of high fidelity.
 

RayDunzl

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#2
Without "electricity" nothing familiar occurs.

Imagine a world without electrons.

Oops, I can't. No electrons.
 

amirm

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#3
Just incredible. It seems folks wake up every day thinking of another lay argument to justify their non-scientific assumptions about audio.

Have him stop the motor in the LP and tell us how much electricity is generated out of the stylus sitting frozen in the groove. And how the modulation caused by the motor change what comes out of the stylus for that reason.
 

FrantzM

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#5
I don't know it is because of the ease of getting information but I never though people were that extreme and spewed so much nonsense when it came to Audio.
When it comes to Vinyl ... There is even a school that advocate Tubes Power Supplies for TT... Brinkman for example .. so what's left? Triode Power Supply for TT? OTL Power supplies? Direct Heated Triode Power supplies :confused:?
 

TBone

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#6
Art is right ... I can prove so, my turntable has an "option" ...

dis-connecting belt from motor (&without turning on my tt power supply, if that matters), I carefully turned the platter by hand, using a strobe I get it to speed, well kinda ... . ... . then gently placed the stylus down, and yep ... music into the preamp.

Problem was, I had a real difficult time running back and forth, from listening position to tt to keep it revolving at speed. Lots of exercise later, during a break ... further pondered the situation ... I could replace the bearing viscous oil w/v.light oil and that would certainly help maintain rotation considerably ... but after a few heart palpitations ... decided to revert back to the original motor driven option.

Motor quality and implementation are obviously very important to any decent turntables design, Art knows this ... good ole Art ...
 

krabapple

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#7
I don't know it is because of the ease of getting information but I never though people were that extreme and spewed so much nonsense when it came to Audio.

You either are young, or never read much Stereophile or TAS; both have been spewing exactly the sort of contemptible nonsense you refer to, across a span of time now measured in decades.
 

fas42

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#8
"To my ears and to my thinking, the phonograph is the only domestic playback source that does not dynamically compress music. I believe this is so because literally every other source component - CD players, DACs, even tape machines - works by modulating electricity originating in that product's power supply. But, in a conventional phonograph, apart from the motor drive, there is no need for a power supply, since the phono cartridge generates its own electrical current."
Although poorly expressed there is nothing radically wrong here: for many people vinyl playback does have more sparkle and life to the ears, for a variety of reasons; powers supplies in components are often a major factor in poorer subjective performance, this is something I've played with for decades - the more effectively "perfect" the rails are, the better the hearing; and of course in a cartridge the permanent magnet "supplies the power", compare conventional speaker driver with an electrodynamic one.

Subjectively uninteresting, poorer playback can be the result of power supplies being modulated by various causes - a permanent magnet in one sense is much more stable as a 'supply' ... QED.
 

fas42

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#10
What I like best about vinyl, is the timing. Timing in music audio is everything. There is something right about it. ...Not perfect but right.
Yep, Bob. "Timing" is so much of what gives music that specialness, that draws you in. However, that's nothing to do with vinyl per se; if you don't hear that quality in the sound then it's faulty - and this can especially happen with digital, that flat-footedness one often hears from CD, say, is a distortion signature or marker. And because it's indeed a flaw, a failing of the playback, it can be fixed - may take a bit of knowledge and effort to resolve - but ultimately is no more a problem than a cartridge that's poorly aligned on the TT ...
 

Sal1950

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#11
Would you buy a used car from this man?
Hey, trust me!
mf.jpg
 

Ethan Winer

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#12
Just incredible. It seems folks wake up every day thinking of another lay argument to justify their non-scientific assumptions about audio.
LOL, no kidding. I loved this line:

"To my ears and to my thinking, the phonograph is the only domestic playback source that does not dynamically compress music."

In fact, vinyl is the only medium I can think of offhand that is almost always compressed for fear of burning out the cutting head. :rolleyes:

--Ethan
 

FrantzM

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#13
Yep, Bob. "Timing" is so much of what gives music that specialness, that draws you in. However, that's nothing to do with vinyl per se; if you don't hear that quality in the sound then it's faulty - and this can especially happen with digital, that flat-footedness one often hears from CD, say, is a distortion signature or marker. And because it's indeed a flaw, a failing of the playback, it can be fixed - may take a bit of knowledge and effort to resolve - but ultimately is no more a problem than a cartridge that's poorly aligned on the TT ...
what'cha you talking about fas?
 

fas42

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#14
I's talkin' 'bout fixin' things, Arno... err, Frantz ...
 

fas42

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#16
Bob, another perfect post from you ... :p

I'll just clarify one thing - what's flawed with analogue and digital are the implementations, the real life beasts we buy or put together - not the media itself. And digital is well ahead in what's possible, but many people are still struggling with understanding what's important to get right in digital - out pops poor implementations, meaning fatiguing, non-sexy, get me outta here, :D sound ...

Talking about the brain, them scientist chappies are still going full tilt at finding out how sharp us humans are in grokkin' sound - I was literally just looking at the summary for an article dated Jan, 2016 - "Brain responses in humans reveal ideal observer-like sensitivity to complex acoustic patterns" - reckon that title is pretty sexy in itself! E.g.
We demonstrate that listeners are remarkably sensitive to the emergence of complex patterns within rapidly evolving sound sequences, performing on par with an ideal observer model
@ http://www.pnas.org/content/113/5/E616.abstract ...
 

TBone

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#17
Frank & North, do either of you own a turntable currently; if not, what's your history w/turntables?
 

JoeWhip

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#20
Bob, I Have a nice TT and prefer digital. I do not find it fatiguing in the least. In fact, the most fatiguing stuff I have heard in the last several months has been from vinyl.
 

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