Amplifiers and subwoofers - difference?

[Jonas_h]

I have a home theater with a lot of JBL 2269H 18" drivers. I use Crown MacroTech 12000i amplifiers with one channel pr. 18" driver.

This weekend a Crown 12000i broke and need to be sent to service. This is the second time one of my 12000i amps need this and I am extremely tired of idle time and overhead by sending back and forth.

So I had a crazy thought:

1. Sell all my Crown amps
2. Buy something like Behringer EP4000 and bridge it pr. subwoofer. Buy 2-3 spare units and if one break, I will just replace it instantly.

The Behringers will have enough power to run my system and it will cost me next to nothing.

So the big question: Will there be an audible difference here?

Control over the woofer/dampning factor? Punch? Something else? People on forums always mention the bass when they try Class D.

What's your take here?

 

[Keith_W]

It's a bit unusual that a pro audio amplifier should die. If we can think of these amplifiers as a group, they are designed to be inexpensive, powerful, reliable, and have pro audio features. They are usually actively cooled with fans. Ambient noise and sound quality (i.e. low noise floor) is usually not a design priority.

Those Behringers are cheap copies of QSC amps, which have a solid reputation of reliability in the pro audio world. If you are worried about failure, I probably would not replace a Crown with a Behringer! Not unless you are happy keeping a few of these lying around and swapping them out if one of them fails. What you COULD do is to run them in mono (bridged) mode, and if one fails, convert it to stereo mode until you get around to replacing it.

Otherwise, I would consider moving up the food chain - Outline, Powersoft, etc. And I would look closely to see why your amplifier failed. It's usually heat death, so you need to check whether you have enough air circulation.

As for audible difference - your amplifier has a clipping indicator. Have you ever seen it turn on? If not - there will be very little difference. You MAY hear some noise if you hook up your amp to a sensitive driver like a tweeter if you buy a worse amp.

 

[Jonas_h]

Well, unusual or not, out of my three Crown Macrotech 12000i's (which are not inexpensive), 66.6% of them have now required service. There is also a Tech Note #203 saying that some components get too hot inside the amps and they admit its a design flaw on older models. I can look at the temps, but I have a pretty big air exhaust fan in the room and room temperature is constant when I turn on the theater.

So right now, I can't see that I am running a bigger risk going to Behringer which is old-school class AB with a toroid which should be very reliable tech.

But would I hear a difference? That's the question! Both amps would run below clipping. But I have a bad feeling by going from the top of the food chain to the bottom. Even though they are not clipping.

 

[OldHvyMec]

I have been using 4 Behringer NU12,000 for close to 10 years, and we purchased a pallet of 24. None of the co-purchasers has ever reported a failure yet.
Class Ds, and they put out over 1700 watts at 8ohms per rail. I use 2 of them to run 4 Ultimax I 15" subs per amp (8 total) and 2 bass columns per single amp with 6 RS225 8" per column.

I've tried to break the things, but they just won't die.


The subs and bass drivers are all wired @8ohms I've wired the subs and columns at 4 and 2 ohms. The only thing that happened was the temp went up about 20% at 2 ohms, but at 4 ohms, very close to the same temp as 8 ohms.

They run so cool at 8 ohms. I disconnected 1 of the 3 fans and put both of the remaining on a mini toggle. I've yet to flip that toggle, even after 100db sessions for well over 45 minutes. They are full of red orange drop caps, those things last 50-60 years, at least they have in both my MC225.

I gave those NU12K the thumbs up over 5 years ago, and that is saying something for my picky ass. I'm not a big fan of any equipment breaking.

I'm looking at a broken Fosi ZD3 that is 3 months old. It lost the ability to use or recognize the hardwired part of the network. I have 7 of their Z units, I'm hoping it's not a trend for my cheap leap from my tried and true fleet of over 40 Mcintosh pieces. I had one Mac failure, and that was my fault in over 50 years of service.

Everything else was just normal service or campaign recommendations because of a crap batch of bumblebees in some of the MC240 and C11/C22s.

I'll stick with the Behringer for the heavy sub/bass lifting, Nord for main speaker power in the summer months, and of course my old Mac and Cary valve amps for my preferred choice of sound in the autumn, winter, and spring months.

It would be nice if you could find a few of the NU12Ks but as time passes, they are tough to find for a reason. BTW, the average amp was about 450.00 usd per unit 10 years ago. The last ones I saw were over 1,000-1,400 a pop or more used. They were about 750.00 per retail when they first came out.

I've been noticing a few different pro brands from China. I just don't know how reliable the reviews are. Most have complaints about fan noise, but overall very reliable so far.

Best of Luck and Regards

 

[Head_Unit]

old-school class AB with a toroid which should be very reliable tech

I should think AB or D or G or H, it just depends on how overbuilt and well designed it is. And I'd think if you got some way overpowered Behringer or whatever i.e. running them below full tilt, it should be good. By the way you mentioned ROOM ventilation but how is the ventilation around the amps?

 

[Deleted member 97805]

If a Class A or AB amplifier, with a big toroid, dies prematurely, I can almost always guarantee you that a mosfet has blown up.
It happened to me three times and it was always those mosfets. Capacitors right after that but always the mosfets first.