• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Amplifier for Wharfedale Linton, budget $ 1,300

As long as it's silver. :)

1704315328513.png
 
The Yamaha amps may be great, but I find it difficult to »trust« a company that prefers to erase any »Made in« sign from their official product images.
 
The Yamaha amps may be great, but I find it difficult to »trust« a company that prefers to erase any »Made in« sign from their official product images.
I think Yamaha A-S701 has a nice look. Classic Yamaha look.:D

As far as I understand, it is reliable. If there had been a quality problem with it, we would have read about it.
 
Why choose this over a Denon AVR-X2800H?
If you're only using 2 channels, why buy an amp with 14. In addition, I'm sure there are 14 channel amps that outperform some 2 channel amps, but it's highly unlikely at the same, or a lower price point.

The Yamaha has more inputs than necessary for a single source set-up, but additional line level inputs won't add that much to the cost, a few extra traces on the PCB and a selector switch. Digital and phono inputs, will require additional circuits and components, and therefore cost, but probably not as much additional amplifier channels.
 
Last edited:
The Yamaha amps may be great, but I find it difficult to »trust« a company that prefers to erase any »Made in« sign from their official product images.
It's quite old teach and very prowen in last 50+ years and Yamaha didn't change much if anything at all. You get a very good iron core transformer (made in Malaysia in very ironed out production long time ago) original Sunken transistors pairs (Japanese) and good quality capacitors. Those amplifier stages are ironed out and perfected long time ago. It's interesting that Chinese didn't menage to copy them good (LJ boards). So basically you get a quality you would get from other manufacturers 20 year's ago. Needless to say pretty much almost everyone else went with optimising the cost and lower quality parts which in the end result in lower life expectations.
There is no audio company with higher grade track record when it comes to honouring they products and costumers and in very long existence (when they messed up they fixed it on their own account) and in short that's why.
 
Valuable? Perhaps, perhaps not. Necessary? Not at all. I agree that it's nice to have friends, especially friends with whom you have a common interest. But a person who has the insight afforded by logic and disciplined thinking doesn't need the reinforcement provided by friends. Instead of depending on them, they can depend on you. :)

Every day, people all over the world are led willy-nilly, first one way and then another, manipulated by people who know how to influence them. The Scientific Method was created for exactly this situation. It uses discipline and control to provide a person with insight into the true nature of an item or process, rejecting emotions, superstitions and bias. Once a person understands the reasons behind science's methodology, they can apply clear thinking and analytical discipline throughout their lives, independent of any "influencers".

Wouldn't that be a great world? ;)

Jim

I'm not talking about "friends" who tell you what to buy, I'm talking about finding those rare people who have a) decades of listening experience or have listened to hundreds of components, and b) are a bit of a quant - meaning they value objective measurements highly and understand them and know precisely how they correlate to their objective findings, and c) have some sort of a method of distributing their ideas and findings and are willing to do so, absent bias.

Our host appears to be one of those folks, lucky us! :)

Here's an example of a seeming disparity between his objective findings and subjective: The A07 Max review, the SINAD numbers are good but also so-so compared to other similar components, there appears to be a slight imbalance in the channels, there's a class load dependency - not bad for an inexpensive class D but maybe nothing to expect much from when matched with high-end components, based on these numbers.

However, Amir allows us to look a little further in his subjective take:

"AIYIMA A07 Max Listening Tests
I connected the A07 Max, don't laugh, to my $23,000 Revel Salon 2 speakers as requested by a member. I must say, I was not remotely prepared for what I heard. This little amp with its 36 volt/6amp power supply had no trouble driving the Revels to incredible dynamics! Resolution and detail was superb. Deep, sub-bass was produced with no sign of amp straining or wanting to turn off. I am still listening to it as I type this and can't believe what I am hearing. The binding posts on the speakers probably weigh as much as this amp!
"


What you're saying in several posts now is that Amir's subjective take is of little or no value, and I think that's demonstrably false.
 
Last edited:
@jooc well particular Aiyima has a bridged mode which most similar don't and when you get two of those with deacent quality power supply's for let's say 220$ you have a deacent performing amplifier with enough power to drive low impedance (which deep under 4 Ohms but not under 3) mid sized speakers. And when power supply dies you just buy another one, simple as that. Of course it's a cheap class D and it's load dependent as all of those are. Is it great? No. Is it useful? More than similar ones. Would it be silent and won't hiss? No but that's not so big issue for most folks and after all you got it for peanut's.
 
If you're only using 2 channels, why buy an amp with 14. In addition, I'm sure there are 14 channel amps that outperform some 2 channel amps, but it's highly unlikely at the same, or a lower price point.

The Yamaha has more inputs than necessary for a single source set-up, but additional line level inputs won't add that much to the cost, a few extra traces on the PCB and a selector switch. Digital and phono inputs, will require additional circuits and components, and therefore cost, but probably not as much additional amplifier channels.
The Denon will not "sound" any different, has essentially the same power, needs no external dac or streaming add ons and can manage subs and room correction as well. It's a no brainer. Stream or stick a usb in the front it'll play any file format, job done.
 
The Denon will not "sound" any different, has essentially the same power, needs no external dac or streaming add ons and can manage subs and room correction as well. It's a no brainer. Stream or stick a usb in the front it'll play any file format, job done.
You have all of that with YPAO R-N uper range from Yamaha in stereo form and lot of things done better except YPAO with better DAC, loudness and performance for less money and it will last you longer (to week swinging power supply in Denon AVR) and be easier to repair.
 
@jooc well particular Aiyima has a bridged mode which most similar don't and when you get two of those with deacent quality power supply's for let's say 220$ you have a deacent performing amplifier with enough power to drive low impedance (which deep under 4 Ohms but not under 3) mid sized speakers. And when power supply dies you just buy another one, simple as that. Of course it's a cheap class D and it's load dependent as all of those are. Is it great? No. Is it useful? More than similar ones. Would it be silent and won't hiss? No but that's not so big issue for most folks and after all you got it for peanut's.
Hi I wasn't really talking about the a07 max per se, I was using it as an in-forum example of where subjective takes can be valuable when delivered by a knowledgeable and experienced source who maybe has listened to everything. In that example the objective numbers suggest "don't bother matching that amp up with really expensive components," the subjective take tells a different story.
 
What you're saying in several posts now is that Amir's subjective take is of little or no value, and I think that's demonstrably false.

No, that's not what I'm saying. Amir is a trained listener. The vast majority of people are not.

In my post, I stated, "... a person who has the insight afforded by logic and disciplined thinking doesn't need the reinforcement provided by friends. Instead of depending on them, they can depend on you."
That's exactly the situation we have with Amir. I don't trust my hearing ability. I don't trust your hearing ability. I trust Amir's hearing ability and his dedication to truthful presentations. Training provides that. Time in service does not necessarily provide that.

I also said, " Every day, people all over the world are led willy-nilly, first one way and then another, manipulated by people who know how to influence them." Do you really think that I put Amir in that category? Don't be silly.

There are masses of students, but few teachers upon whom one can depend. My remarks address the state of the student body, not the faculty. And BTW ... I'm one of the students, and I have no illusions about that. ;)

In a nutshell: If your friend is trained, then I concede that your point is valid. If he's not, then I would be wary.

Jim
 
Last edited by a moderator:
No, that's not what I'm saying. Amir is a trained listener. The vast majority of people are not.

In my post, I stated, "... a person who has the insight afforded by logic and disciplined thinking doesn't need the reinforcement provided by friends. Instead of depending on them, they can depend on you."
That's exactly the situation we have with Amir. I don't trust my hearing ability. I don't trust your hearing ability. I trust Amir's hearing ability and his dedication to truthful presentations. Training provides that. Time in service does not necessarily provide that.

I also said, " Every day, people all over the world are led willy-nilly, first one way and then another, manipulated by people who know how to influence them." Do you really think that I put Amir in that category? Don't be silly.

There are masses of students, but few teachers upon whom one can depend. My remarks address the state of the student body, not the faculty. And BTW ... I'm one of the students, and I have no illusions about that. ;)

In a nutshell: If your friend is trained, then I concede that your point is valid. If he's not, then I would be wary.

Jim

Glad you're coming around!

In typical forum-obsessive mode I'll refer you to good old post # 97: ;)

"...It (subjectivity) can perform a function before the final arbitration if you've come to trust and agree with the subjective opinions of some source. It's never going to map to your experience 100%, but that opinion can deliver a very good lead-in - depending on the source.

If fact I'd say that's a necessary function as we can almost never do that final arbitration ourselves until after the purchase ;)

The trick is to find the sources of subjectivity that you trust, someone who isn't trying to sell you something or justify a past purchase."


Again, no 'friends' involved - trusted sources such as our host.

...I guess I should allow a caveat in that friends' subjective take could be valuable if you both share technical experiences and have the ability to describe them to each other consistently, but overall subjective value is delivered best (usually) by the same folks who can deliver objective value and map the two.

I would gently suggest (to anyone) not trying to shame people if they're here to give subjective takes - That's in part what I and many others are here to read, because we can get it delivered in the same dose as the real data and it makes everything fleshed out and more enjoyable to read.
 
Last edited:
You have all of that with YPAO R-N uper range from Yamaha in stereo form and lot of things done better except YPAO with better DAC, loudness and performance for less money and it will last you longer (to week swinging power supply in Denon AVR) and be easier to repair.
The different dac won't make any difference to the sound and the Denon power supply has a higher wattage than the A-S701 (which doesn't have YPAO or usb input or streaming support). I'm not sure why you think the Denon won't last as long as the Yamaha.
 
The different dac won't make any difference to the sound and the Denon power supply has a higher wattage than the A-S701 (which doesn't have YPAO or usb input or streaming support). I'm not sure why you think the Denon won't last as long as the Yamaha.
Sure better DAC will bring in better performance but it won't be great improvement. Compare last not top end Denon AVR's gen with ESS32 vs previous gen with AKM.
Sure iron core transformer will last a lot longer than cheap bad cooled switching one with cheap regulator and condensers. For the price of 4800H you can buy 5x A-S700 and that's one channel more and lot of more power. Or just one and Flex HT for less than half the money with much better performance for what you need in stereo and beyond and it won't be load dependent or hiss. You get AVR for property Dolby support and movies as all in one economy pack not for stereo.
 
Back
Top Bottom