Amplifier for Wharfedale Linton, budget $ 1,300

[GaryY]

I have some concerns about going for a Hypex or similar module:
1) Apparently it gets very hot which I expect must cause it to degrade faster in general compared to for example an AB class amplifier of good quality components (and sufficient cooling capacity).
2) I don’t like that many of these amplifiers, at least in my eyes, look cheap and DIY.
3) While customer service seems to be good for these products, I find it a bit problematic that costumers quite often seem to experience some sort of problem typical for a newly introduced product. This is perhaps not so surprising since these chips are quite new to the market, but nonetheless I would much appreciate an amplifier concerning which the likelihood of having to return it is lower, i.e. a time tested product, no birth defects and questionable component quality, etc.

I just tried touching both of my DMP-A8 streamer and Boxem amplifier. DMP-A8 is warmer than my Boxem.

 

[kaffe]

Cass D based amplifiers are the most efficient and emit the least heat compared to class AB, not to mention class A based amplifiers. Class A where most of the power you poke into them goes into heat. Little sound for the expensive watt money, so to speak.

BUT even class D amplifiers need to be cooled down. Those class D amps that get too hot are due to poor construction, too little heat dissipation via the heatsink.

How then is a modern class D amplifier in terms of long term reliability? We don't know yet if new class D amplifiers will function flawlessly after several decades like a good class AB can do. But it is not possible to pull all class D over the same comb, so to speak. Discussed eagerly in this thread:
(an EE can, by looking at construction and its components, make a professional judgment about unit X's lifespan)

Class D amp long term reliability

Hi, Looking for 2 channel amp to play a few hours 3-4 days a week. Would like to keep it for the next 10-15 years. Are class D amps today reliable enough to last that long without issues? Or should I go with AB amp? Don't really care one way or the other, but obviously my choice would be...

audiosciencereview.com

Edit:
If you have a class A amp with 20% efficiency then the remaining 80% has to go somewhere and that happens via heat. Class D based amplifiers have approximately 90% efficiency.

That is very interesting and puts a new perspective on things for me.

Clearly I wouldn’t mind an efficient amplifier.
I’ll dig into that topic for sure.

As for power amps, any integrated amp could work as power amp. Some even have power modes. But try to find amps with 12v trigger to wake up.

NAD 268, Rotel 1552, Audiolab 8300XP, emotiva XPA, musical Fidelity M6x 250… many Hypex or purity kits, and many chinese amps (Fosi, topping, SMSL). Plenty of power amps to choose from. Which one? I won’t recommend anything due to biased information. (official response in this forum: choose the one with better graphs and facts)

Thanks for the list, I’ll take a look.

 

[VMAT4]

It occurs to me that miniDSP makes a digital output version of the miniDSP Flex. The OP could easily insert one of these between a WiiM Pro and the Audiophonics DA-S250NC somewhere down the road. If he wanted to explore DIRAC and PEQ with the miniDSP.

 

[kaffe]

It occurs to me that miniDSP makes a digital output version of the miniDSP Flex. The OP could easily insert one of these between a WiiM Pro and the Audiophonics DA-S250NC somewhere down the road. If he wanted to explore DIRAC and PEQ with the miniDSP.

If I go down the miniDSP road I was thinking this setup ultimately (that’s a strong word, yes):

WiiM Mini via SPDIF or Toslink (I don’t know which is preferable) to miniDSP Flex HT
miniDSP Flex HT via RCA to Hypex class D amp

MINIDSP FLEX HT DSP Audio Processor

The miniDSP Flex HT is a 2x8-channel DSP processor featuring HDMI ARC/eARC input and WiSA HT wireless transmission technology.

www.audiophonics.fr

It looks like you can only get the Flex HT with RCA outputs. Is that a reason in itself to for the Flex with balanced instead?

Considering the Hypex options, the Apollon NCMP700 looks particularly interesting in my eyes:

One moment, please...

Would be interesting to have a look at the inside. Judging from the chassis it definitely looks to be of greater quality than some competitors. I’d gladly pay the extra if the inside corresponds. I’m thinking heat management especially.

 

[Miniyouuuu]

Flex HT for wiim mini?
Flex HT advantage is Hdmi eArc. You can connect Flex to TV or AppleTV and set on/off and volumen from TV remote.
If you don’t use Hdmi, flex standard or flex digital would be the choice. I don’t have data, but someone told me coaxial was marginally better than toslink.
Flex digital in the event your external DAC is better than MiniDSP.
Wiim mini is Wifi only. Cable is always more stable and latency is lower. Wiim pro will fit those requirements.

 

[VMAT4]

I own an Apollon NCMP400. It's a fine amp. It may be sufficient for your set up and could save you 100 euros.

 

[ZolaIII]

I have some concerns about going for a Hypex or similar module:
1) Apparently it gets very hot which I expect must cause it to degrade faster in general compared to for example an AB class amplifier of good quality components (and sufficient cooling capacity).
2) I don’t like that many of these amplifiers, at least in my eyes, look cheap and DIY.
3) While customer service seems to be good for these products, I find it a bit problematic that costumers quite often seem to experience some sort of problem typical for a newly introduced product. This is perhaps not so surprising since these chips are quite new to the market, but nonetheless I would much appreciate an amplifier concerning which the likelihood of having to return it is lower, i.e. a time tested product, no birth defects and questionable component quality, etc.

Well I did show you high quality Hypex based amps (with long warranty, adequate cooling and long run parts availability).
I am not fobic when it comes to new stuff.
Anyway take a look at this:

ProtectedPool ➤ Most Powerful and Safest Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet

ProtectedPool ➤ Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet . Your New DeFi Experience:: Secure, Smart, Simple. Double Approvals. Add extra confirmation of any transaction with 2FA solutions including Google Authenticator or hardware security keys. Self-custodial Solutions. Protected Pool is built on smart...

docplayer.net

It makes you wonder how they get all of that in for 715€. Inputs are balanced only and you would have to adopt speaker cable's but it's not a big problem.

 

[kaffe]

Well I did show you high quality Hypex based amps (with long warranty, adequate cooling and long run parts availability).
I am not fobic when it comes to new stuff.
Anyway take a look at this:

ProtectedPool ➤ Most Powerful and Safest Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet

ProtectedPool ➤ Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet . Your New DeFi Experience:: Secure, Smart, Simple. Double Approvals. Add extra confirmation of any transaction with 2FA solutions including Google Authenticator or hardware security keys. Self-custodial Solutions. Protected Pool is built on smart...

docplayer.net

It makes you wonder how they get all of that in for 715€. Inputs are balanced only and you would have to adopt speaker cable's but it's not a big problem.

Seems a bit difficult to come across Ati in EU.
From what I have gathered so far the price is way, way higher compared to the Apollon, but perhaps I am wrong.

 

[Deleted member 48726]

Seems a bit difficult to come across Ati in EU.
From what I have gathered so far the price is way, way higher compared to the Apollon, but perhaps I am wrong.

Dynacord L1300FD DSP

DSP Amplifier 2 Ohm stable, Intuitive system control software for easy setup and control, Balanced XLR in/out, Speaker Twist connections, Dimensions (W x H x D): 483 x 88 x 462,4, Weight: 12.9 kg Maximum power single channel: 2 Ohm: 1100 W, 2.6...

www.thomann.de

Dynacord L1300FD Digital Forstærker (2x650W, DSP)

1300W DSP forstærker Kompakt og ideel til live/studie lyd på farten True 2 Ohm stabilitet FIR Driver teknologi 'Et-knaps' DSP indstilling

www.drumcity.dk

Dynacord L1300FD DSP Power Amplifier | Gear4music

Dynacord L1300FD DSP Power Amplifier | Gear4music

www.gear4music.dk

 

[kaffe]

Flex HT for wiim mini?
Flex HT advantage is Hdmi eArc. You can connect Flex to TV or AppleTV and set on/off and volumen from TV remote.
If you don’t use Hdmi, flex standard or flex digital would be the choice. I don’t have data, but someone told me coaxial was marginally better than toslink.
Flex digital in the event your external DAC is better than MiniDSP.
Wiim mini is Wifi only. Cable is always more stable and latency is lower. Wiim pro will fit those requirements.

Thought to connect the WiiM to the Flex HT.
Perhaps I am better off with WiiM Pro Plus, but not sure in my particular case. No issues with WiFi (distance between device and router would be like 4-5 feet, in the same room).

 

[ZolaIII]

Seems a bit difficult to come across Ati in EU.
From what I have gathered so far the price is way, way higher compared to the Apollon, but perhaps I am wrong.

No you aren't wrong. Dynacord is more to show what kind of quality you can get for a bottom price and it will run pretty much anything including large sub's in bridged mode and it's good old A-B or G class.

 

[DanielT]

Well I did show you high quality Hypex based amps (with long warranty, adequate cooling and long run parts availability).
I am not fobic when it comes to new stuff.
Anyway take a look at this:

ProtectedPool ➤ Most Powerful and Safest Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet

ProtectedPool ➤ Web3 Smart DeFi Wallet . Your New DeFi Experience:: Secure, Smart, Simple. Double Approvals. Add extra confirmation of any transaction with 2FA solutions including Google Authenticator or hardware security keys. Self-custodial Solutions. Protected Pool is built on smart...

docplayer.net

It makes you wonder how they get all of that in for 715€. Inputs are balanced only and you would have to adopt speaker cable's but it's not a big problem.

Looks good BUT it is fan cooled. The question then becomes whether the fans make a lot of noise?

 

[Miniyouuuu]

Thought to connect the WiiM to the Flex HT.
Perhaps I am better off with WiiM Pro Plus, but not sure in my particular case. No issues with WiFi (distance between device and router would be like 4-5 feet, in the same room).

Even close enough wifi has higher latency than cable. When possible chose always cable!

 

[kaffe]

It looks like I could quickly drain my wallet if I buy a Purifi or Hypex amplifier of good looks and high quality I think that will have to be for sometime in the future.

Meanwhile I might just buy a Yamaha A-S701 or Leak Stereo 230 BUT I want to be able to EQ with Dirac (via miniDSP) at some point without running into a power supply bottleneck. Now I understand the Lintons can be a bit tricky to drive, but will I be "safe" by going for either of these choices using Dirac and EQ?

A-S701 - Specifikationer - Yamaha - Danmark

Yderst ren lydkvalitet og fremragende råstyrke. En integreret forstærker med fordelene ved digitale indgange.

dk.yamaha.com

STEREO 230 – LEAK

www.leak-hifi.co.uk

The Leak offers 75W RMS (8Ω) and 115W RMS (4Ω)
The Yamaha offers 100W RMS (8Ω) and 160W RMS (4Ω)

Leak don't provide much detailed information, if any, about the dynamic capabilities of the amplifier, but I found this description of the amplification on www.hifipig.com:

"AMPLIFICATION
At its core is a Class AB power stage arranged in a dual-parallel configuration, drawing on many decades of amplifier design experience to deliver 75W per channel into eight ohms, and 115W per channel into four ohms. A substantial low-noise 270VA toroidal transformer is followed by 2x15000uF reservoir capacity.

[...]"

LEAK Stereo 230 Integrated Amplifier | Hifi Pig

HiFi News - The new LEAK Stereo 230 Integrated Amplifier is designed a sa step up from the 2020 LEAK Stereo 130 vintage-inspired design

www.hifipig.com

 

[ZolaIII]

@kaffe read:

http://www.newaudio.it/YAMAHA/as700/Yamaha-AS700-.pdf

It's a same power stage in newer A-S 70x and 80x models and similar iron core transformer.

 

[ZolaIII]

Looks good BUT it is fan cooled. The question then becomes whether the fans make a lot of noise?

It looks great and there is disassembly animation on official page. I really don't know about fan.

 

[kaffe]

@kaffe read:

http://www.newaudio.it/YAMAHA/as700/Yamaha-AS700-.pdf

It's a same power stage in newer A-S 70x and 80x models and similar iron core transformer.

From the article you linked:

"[...]

Using the usual ‘both channels driven into 8Ω’ criteria that is the accepted in-dustry standard for measuring power output, the Yamaha A-S700 delivers a minimum power output of 115-watts per channel at 20kHz, but can manage a little more at higher frequencies, to the tune of 130-watts at 1kHz and 127- watts at 20kHz.

[...]"

The spec sheet of the A-S700 doesn't show RMS at 8Ω: https://dk.yamaha.com/da/products/audio_visual/hifi_components/a-s700/specs.html
But in the manual it's stated as 90 minimum.

Here's from the Stereophile review on the Leak: https://www.stereophile.com/content/leak-stereo-230-integrated-amplifier-measurements

"[...]

With both channels driven, the Stereo 230 is specified as delivering maximum output powers of 75Wpc into both 8 ohms (18.75dBW) and 115W into 4 ohms (17.6dBW). With our usual definition of clipping as being when the THD+N reaches 1%, the Stereo 230 slightly exceeded the specified powers, clipping at 80Wpc into 8 ohms (19dBW, fig.5) and 120Wpc into 4 ohms (17.8dBW, fig.6).

[...]"

So based on this the A-S701 (which should perform at least similarly to the A-S700 as far as I have understood) offers 115W (8Ω) and can manage even up to 130W at higher frequencies, while the Leak starts to clip at 80W (8Ω). That seems to be a pretty huge difference in performance.

 

[VMAT4]

@kaffe, have you considered the Audiophonics AP300-S2503e? It's about 500 Euros. But, it has only balanced inputs. The miniDSP Flex package you'd need is about $884 US dollars.

 

[ZolaIII]

@kaffe to be precise that's 115W 8 Ohms at 20 Hz and 130W both chenels driven at 1 KHz to which it's declarative.

 

[kaffe]

@kaffe, have you considered the Audiophonics AP300-S2503e? It's about 500 Euros. But, it has only balanced inputs. The miniDSP Flex package you'd need is about $884 US dollars.

Yup. Definitely cheaper than the Apollon alternative, but I like the fact that Apollon offers 5 year warranty as an option (for +10%).
Also I very much prefer the looks of it to be honest.

If I go for a Hypex or Purifi amp I will probably prefer to buy a miniDSP with HDMI ARC so I can connect it to my tv. But I am pretty sure you can't get the Flex HT with balanced inputs. I guess you need the more expensive version (don't remember the name of it) for that.