Amplifier Choice for Triangle Borea BR08: Burson vs Atoll vs Audiolab

[Martin Rony]

Hi everyone,
Greetings! I am looking for an amplifier to pair with my Triangle Borea BR08 speakers. Given that these speakers can have significant impedance drops, I am prioritizing current delivery and stability under heavy loads.
I am currently considering:
Burson Audio Timekeeper 3i Reference
Atoll IN100
Audiolab 9000A
Which one among these would offer the best stability and current delivery? Also, in terms of sound signature, which one is considered more refined and musical for a balanced Hi-Fi experience?
My current amplifier is Audiolab 6000a. It can't keep pace during higher volume and bass segments.

 

[Morinor]

After having moved from an Audiolab 9000P to a dual mono Purifi 1ET9040 I have to say the following: do yourself and your wallet a favor, buy any Purifi 1ET9040, Purifi 1ET6525 or Hypex Nilai. Audiolab although it was good and much better for me than Arcam A25, it cannot match my new amplifier. You will never think about amplification again. You have to search though for an preamplifier of your choice. There are options from all the above companies. Though you should be aware that most preamps tend to be neutral than have some kind of colouration if that you seek also. As much as I am aware Burson preamps tend to warmth, but maybe choosing Vivid opamps change that. Audiolab 9000Q is not so neutral as they claim, tending to more lower bass and less sparkle on top. There are options there like Aune S17 pro that sounds like tube amp with a hint of more lower bass and richness in the mids making the sound less flat and 2D. Gustard H26 or HP70 could be some options. Laiv Crescendo Verse is another DAC/preamp option.

 

[Martin Rony]

After having moved from an Audiolab 9000P to a dual mono Purifi 1ET9040 I have to say the following: do yourself and your wallet a favor, buy any Purifi 1ET9040, Purifi 1ET6525 or Hypex Nilai. Audiolab although it was good and much better for me than Arcam A25, it cannot match my new amplifier. You will never think about amplification again. You have to search though for an preamplifier of your choice. There are options from all the above companies. Though you should be aware that most preamps tend to be neutral than have some kind of colouration if that you seek also. As much as I am aware Burson preamps tend to warmth, but maybe choosing Vivid opamps change that. Audiolab 9000Q is not so neutral as they claim, tending to more lower bass and less sparkle on top. There are options there like Aune S17 pro that sounds like tube amp with a hint of more lower bass and richness in the mids making the sound less flat and 2D. Gustard H26 or HP70 could be some options. Laiv Crescendo Verse is another DAC/preamp option.

Hi everyone,
Greetings! I am looking for an amplifier to pair with my Triangle Borea BR08 speakers. Given that these speakers can have significant impedance drops, I am prioritizing current delivery and stability under heavy loads.
I am currently considering:
Burson Audio Timekeeper 3i Reference
Atoll IN100
Audiolab 9000A
Which one among these would offer the best stability and current delivery? Also, in terms of sound signature, which one is considered more refined and musical for a balanced Hi-Fi experience?
My current amplifier is Audiolab 6000a. It can't keep pace during higher volume and bass segments.

Thank you very much for the valuable advice.

 

[RandomEar]

Thank you very much for the valuable advice.

Welcome to ASR! The advice by @Morinor to go with Purifi or Hypex based amps is solid. The idea that pre-amps add "warmth", "sparkle" or whatever else to the sound is misguided, though. No pre-amp should alter the sound in any way, apart from optional tone controls. And luckily, outside of niche designs like tube-based offerings, pretty much no modern pre-amp will alter the sound in any meaningful way. The majority are audibly transparent, as they should be. Choose based on features, connectivity and price, not based on the supposed "sound" of a pre-amp. Unless it's broken, it won't have any.

 

[rjp]

After having moved from an Audiolab 9000P to a dual mono Purifi 1ET9040 I have to say the following: do yourself and your wallet a favor, buy any Purifi 1ET9040, Purifi 1ET6525 or Hypex Nilai. Audiolab although it was good and much better for me than Arcam A25, it cannot match my new amplifier. You will never think about amplification again. You have to search though for an preamplifier of your choice. There are options from all the above companies. Though you should be aware that most preamps tend to be neutral than have some kind of colouration if that you seek also. As much as I am aware Burson preamps tend to warmth, but maybe choosing Vivid opamps change that. Audiolab 9000Q is not so neutral as they claim, tending to more lower bass and less sparkle on top. There are options there like Aune S17 pro that sounds like tube amp with a hint of more lower bass and richness in the mids making the sound less flat and 2D. Gustard H26 or HP70 could be some options. Laiv Crescendo Verse is another DAC/preamp option.

I'm in exactly this situation now. I am currently using the Audiolab 9000p and was wondering if the Purifi or hypex might be a better choice (primarily to get a bit more power).
What specifically do you like better about the Purifi compared to the Audiolab? Which brand did you buy?

I noticed that some of these class D builds require fairly high preamp voltages to achieve their rated power outputs.

I have been looking specifically at the Buckeye 2ch Purifi 1ET6525SA, but I see that it's gain is 25dB at 2.3vrms input. I was hoping to drive it directly with the WiiM Ultra, which at max setting can only provide 2vrms output. So if I did the math right this will give me 158 wpc into 8 ohms rather than the 230 they spec. So only 50% more than the 9000p.

 

[Morinor]

Audiolab 9000P is a good AB amplifier especially for its price. What is missing maybe is power on such situations due to its limited power supply. For sure it is one of the cleanest, with better bass control and much better than other AB 100 watt amps. I like it better than Arcam A25 which was not handling the bass correctly and it was not so clear. Even if you can believe it, I like it better than a Luxman L-505z that although it had a sweeter top, the rest was nothing special. It was tiring also after some longer listening.
When I made the switch to the Purifi (Audiophonics HPA-DM750ET), the first obvious thing for me was that now I could listen hard rock and metal songs again with much better ease. I think that the Purifi has greater snap on top frequencies at high volumes. It is more neutral on lower bass as Audiolab seems to had a small perceivable bump on it and the imaging is even better as in my case is also dual mono. After this experience, I find nothing wrong being a class D. I like it even better than a pair of Bryston 7B3. I say that because while testing an Audio Research on Bryston I said that I didn't like the preamp (it sounded close to another Octave preamp that I had heard on the same system). I wanted to test my amp on that system and after exchanging only the amp to my suprise I like it better. At a price of 1000 EUR or US I can no longer recommend another kind of amp. At lower prices, due to the AB amp ability to reach spontaneously 30% more than the advertised power capabilities and usually being an integrated amp, I can still recommend some AB amps. My even previous Cambridge Audio CXA61 is doing a wonderful job with many speakers I have used as an example.
As for recommendation on which company to select it depends on which side of Atlantic you live. Audiophonics and Apollon Audio on Europe. Backeye, VTV and Nord on America.
As for Buckeye I see that have a selector of three gain options: 25, 20 and 15 dB. If you need more you can just use a dedicated preamplifier and that only to anticipate lower volume recordings. Keep in mind that your Audiolab has 23dB gain. The question about that is if you can reach the desired loudness. Metal songs are usually a reference for reaching the limit of output voltage and stressing an amp. Some Jazz and Blues, that you have all the gain that you can need. A Wiim Ultra (configured at 2volt) was nicely driving the Audiolab 9000P when it was moved to a secondary system.

 

[rjp]

Thank you so much for this detailed reply! I am happy to hear that you consider the Purifi to sound t least as good as the Audiolab 9000p, which I agree is an excellent sounding amp. My concern in switching to class D is, of course, that it might not sound as good. I realize it measures as perfection.

I figure the only way to know for sure is to try it for myself. I just ordered a Buckeye Purifi 1ET6525SA 2CH.

I plan to keep both the Audiolab and the Buckeye and test side by side for as long as it is interesting to me. Then ultimately keep the one I like best.

Regarding the input level, yes, the WiiM ultra can only produce 2vrms so feeding it directly to the Buckeye will give me just about 160 watts per channel. Not ideal, but nothing I can do aside from using a preamp. The gain of the Audiolab is 29dB/1vrms (RCA) vs 25dB/2.3vrms for the Buckeye.

 

[RandomEar]

Thank you so much for this detailed reply! I am happy to hear that you consider the Purifi to sound t least as good as the Audiolab 9000p, which I agree is an excellent sounding amp. My concern in switching to class D is, of course, that it might not sound as good. I realize it measures as perfection.

There is no reason to expect a well measuring amp to sound bad. Amplifier classes do not posses an inherent sound. An amp is either designed well, resulting in good measured performance and sound - or it isn't. The Audiolab 9000p was tested by Stereo.de last year: It was measured with an SNR of 88 dB and a THD of -72 dB (@5 W, 4 Ω). Those are average numbers for a modern class AB design and should be good enough for most applications. With that performance it's technically not audibly transparent, but I would be very surprised if many people could A/B this in a well controlled blind test against other competent amps. Listeners failed to hear the difference between worse amps already 40 years ago, so I wouldn't worry too much.

I figure the only way to know for sure is to try it for myself. I just ordered a Buckeye Purifi 1ET6525SA 2CH.

I plan to keep both the Audiolab and the Buckeye and test side by side for as long as it is interesting to me. Then ultimately keep the one I like best.

Regarding the input level, yes, the WiiM ultra can only produce 2vrms so feeding it directly to the Buckeye will give me just about 160 watts per channel. Not ideal, but nothing I can do aside from using a preamp. The gain of the Audiolab is 29dB/1vrms (RCA) vs 25dB/2.3vrms for the Buckeye.

If you want to test and compare them fairly, remember to match their levels well and to ideally allow for instant switching between the amplifiers. Since human echoic memory is only a couple of seconds long, it's not possible to compare very similar sounds or small details when using long switching times.

 

[whereisbrian]

Hi everyone,
Greetings! I am looking for an amplifier to pair with my Triangle Borea BR08 speakers. Given that these speakers can have significant impedance drops, I am prioritizing current delivery and stability under heavy loads.
I am currently considering:
Burson Audio Timekeeper 3i Reference
Atoll IN100
Audiolab 9000A
Which one among these would offer the best stability and current delivery? Also, in terms of sound signature, which one is considered more refined and musical for a balanced Hi-Fi experience?
My current amplifier is Audiolab 6000a. It can't keep pace during higher volume and bass segments.

I also have Triangle speakers, older floorstanding models than yours.
I used them with a Simaudio Moon amplifier and now with a Class D amplifier: no complaints whatsoever.

The most important thing is to optimize the acoustics of the listening room and the placement of the speakers.
The choice of an amplifier is secondary.
It will sound good in a controlled environment and less so if it isn't.

 

[rjp]

If you want to test and compare them fairly, remember to match their levels well and to ideally allow for instant switching between the amplifiers. Since human echoic memory is only a couple of seconds long, it's not possible to compare very similar sounds or small details when using long switching times.

Agreed. I typically match SPL for common pink noise to achieve the level match. The switching is instantaneous using a single button. That’s the only way I can hear relative differences reliably.

As for the issue of the existence of sound differences , I was able to hear a very slight difference between the Audiolab and the WiiM Vibelink. Should this be impossible? I do not have great ears.

 

[Multicore]

The current generation of good class d amps sound like nothing at all. It's a good thing.

 

[Paul7777x]

As ever it’s the speaker positioning and room contribution that matters most.

In which case, as ever in the modern hifi world, room correcting DSP is your new best friend.

I’d go for any of the Purifi or Hypex power amps that give you the power you’d like and a Wiim pre/dac/dac streamer that will also give you PEQ ability to get it all right at once.

 

[RandomEar]

Agreed. I typically match SPL for common pink noise to achieve the level match. The switching is instantaneous using a single button. That’s the only way I can hear relative differences reliably.

As for the issue of the existence of sound differences , I was able to hear a very slight difference between the Audiolab and the WiiM Vibelink. Should this be impossible? I do not have great ears.

It's not impossible, but still unlikely I'd say. The Vibelink performs a good bit better than the Audiolab on paper. I would expect less tweeter hiss with the Wiim, which would be an easy tell. But the lower distortion of the Vibelink (when fed by a digital source) is unlikely to be audible.

In any case, for level matching it's easier and far more precise to use a multimeter at the speaker binding posts. Measuring it using any acoustic method is trickier and subject to lots of potential errors.

 

[rjp]

Oh, good idea. I can simply measure true rms with a meter. Thanks for this tip!
Is pink noise a good signal for this measurement?

 

[RandomEar]

No, for the multimeter a sinus is best. 400 Hz or something, the exact frequency isn't critical.

 

[Chanur]

Hi everyone,
Greetings! I am looking for an amplifier to pair with my Triangle Borea BR08 speakers. Given that these speakers can have significant impedance drops, I am prioritizing current delivery and stability under heavy loads.
I am currently considering:
Burson Audio Timekeeper 3i Reference
Atoll IN100
Audiolab 9000A
Which one among these would offer the best stability and current delivery? Also, in terms of sound signature, which one is considered more refined and musical for a balanced Hi-Fi experience?
My current amplifier is Audiolab 6000a. It can't keep pace during higher volume and bass segments.

I'm in the camp the majority of money should be spent on speakers. I feel like your HiFi triangle is upside down. That being said you can't go wrong with Buckeye or Schiit amps.

 

[rjp]

No, for the multimeter a sinus is best. 400 Hz or something, the exact frequency isn't critical.

Hmm, I feel like matching just one tone would only work if the amps had identical frequency response.
My guess is a tone is recommended because most multimeters can't measure true rms unless the signal is a sinusoid.

 

[Miniyouuuu]

I have the Audiolab 9000A. When I bought it I liked the match with Wharfedale Linton speakers, great control of bass. Now I have the Mofi SourcePoint 10 speakers and that amp seems to be in the lean side. Nice specs and reviews, but nowadays you can get better power amps and better preamps.
I would go to a Purifi 9040 or Nilai 500 based power amp preferably on dual monoblock layout. And then I’d suggest you to choose the the preamp that suits to your liking.
I get the concept of trying to get the most neutral preamp but, at least to my ears, I prefer some coloration and openness.
I’m very sensible to sibilance and usually, the more precision or detail you get at higher frequencies, the more presence you provide to these range. I also prefer some presence at 100 to 200hz so I have a DSP to change the sound to my linking, but it’s difficult to play with the soundstage.
Some DACs and preamps open the soundstage, and that’s what you should try by yourself. After the choosing of the speakers and setting them in your place, DAC and preamp will affect the way you perceive the sound in your place. A powerfull power amp will ensure the power, but that’s something that you will only get at high volume listening.

 

[RandomEar]

Hmm, I feel like matching just one tone would only work if the amps had identical frequency response.
My guess is a tone is recommended because most multimeters can't measure true rms unless the signal is a sinusoid.

That is correct, a sinus is the best for multimeters without true RMS capability.

I would not worry about frequency response in modern amps. Outside of tube amps and the very cheapest class D without PFFB, I can't remember a single review on ASR where an amp showed a relevant deviation in the FR. If it were present, it would affect the extreme top or bottom end of the spectrum. If one of your amps FRs looks like a rollercoaster nonetheless, I would argue that it's time for a repair

 

[Morinor]

There is no reason to expect a well measuring amp to sound bad. Amplifier classes do not posses an inherent sound. An amp is either designed well, resulting in good measured performance and sound - or it isn't. The Audiolab 9000p was tested by Stereo.de last year: It was measured with an SNR of 88 dB and a THD of -72 dB (@5 W, 4 Ω). Those are average numbers for a modern class AB design and should be good enough for most applications. With that performance it's technically not audibly transparent, but I would be very surprised if many people could A/B this in a well controlled blind test against other competent amps. Listeners failed to hear the difference between worse amps already 40 years ago, so I wouldn't worry too much.


If you want to test and compare them fairly, remember to match their levels well and to ideally allow for instant switching between the amplifiers. Since human echoic memory is only a couple of seconds long, it's not possible to compare very similar sounds or small details when using long switching times.

There are also some additional measurements with more detail on power and different loads from hifinews.com. It is one of the few staying stable as the power increases and load is changing (measurements are THD not THD+N but some calculations can be made). Bridge Mode was disappointing though. The website image of bridge mode is not correct. There is one hidden reflecting the officially published one (THD bridged mode). There is no free lunch as with bridge mode the load is getting in half increasing the noise and THD. There should be an option or done automatically to decrease gain. Maybe then could had better results. Still I have seen rare cases that bridge mode can work well on 4ohm let alone lower. I tried to compare stereo mode vs bridge mode on one of my speakers (Quad Revela 2) and I much proffered the stereo mode. In bridge was less clear, although there was a hint of more bass maybe as it was getting less controlled (increased harmonics). I was waiting a much more analytical review/measurements from soundstagehifi.com too. But they have published only for 9000Q leaving the promise for 9000P unfulfilled.
As for measurements alone, they can tell something but maybe something is missing from measurements themselves. I compared Audiolab 9000P and it was much better choice than Topping LA90. I observed that the Topping having more loose bass sounded bloated on some cases/speakers. Audiolab produce more correct tight bass, that is why one year before I chose that over risking getting two Topping B200. Topping LA90 could theoretically have a more clear reproduction, but at least if you check the 20Hz protection or the recent measurements on B200, you can see the limit that a power supply can have. Purifi and Hypex options can be much safe options, especially the 1ET9040 as it can reach safely 1200 watt at 2 ohm. In the past I was thinking that those class D options where not as good as Topping offerings on high frequencies. I checked though that the situation is slightly getting worse at 10 kHz and more obvious at 15 kHZ. The second harmonics of those frequencies are not though hearable so we shouldn't care at all. On some measurements it can be observed a deep on 10kHz and beyond as they choose actually to take into account the noise only and not the harmonics.