Amp for bedroom setup: point of diminishing (inaudible) return?

[webzeb]

Hello,

I'm completing the setup of my main bedroom, which already consists in:

• WiiM Ultra (90% of what I'm listening too)
• Old Technics turntable, modded with an embedded RIAA preamplifier (10%)
• Wharfedale Linton Heritage 85th Anniversary

I may (or probably not) add a DSP: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/considering-a-dsp-for-bedroom-setup.72764/

Purpose of this post is to identify 'the point of diminishing return' (or 'inaudible return' may I say) regarding the amp choice in my particular context.
Indeed, although I carefully red many of the excellent amp reviews here, it's sometimes difficult to 'weight' the results for a specific context and identify 'where to stop'.
Basically, I'm willing to pay for audible improvements, but for audible improvement in my particular context only. For example, should an amp have audible distorsion at power levels I will never use, that's not a concern for me.
Until now, I was considering an Hypex Ncore NC122MP in a Ghent Audio case that I can get for 260EUR second hand...

The room is 14m2 (152sq ft) / 35m3 (1245cu ft).
It's located in 1993 apartment and my neighbours have the same layout, which means:

• Where I live, 90's buildings are built in reinforced concrete which is very good at transmitting bass and infras. Hence, I will never add a subwoofer
• During the evening, I will listen at very low volume, likely with a specific EQ on the WiiM Ultra.
• During the day, I will listen at moderate to normal volume (I have to do some tests, but probably no more than 75-80dB/edit: I guess it means about 90-95dB peak, right?)

Listening distance is about 2.6m (8'6").

The Whardeale Linton's measured sensitivity is 85.1 dB (avg. 300Hz-3kHz for 2.83V measured at 1m) as per Spinorama.org.
Their impedance can drop to 3.5ohms and minimum EPDR to 1.7ohms (!):

(Graph from Erin's Audio Corner)
Please note that I had to put the speakers very close to a wall, which is proving massive (about 8dB) of room gain around 46Hz.
That's something that will corrected with EQ...therefore asking less power to the amp in this frequency region.

Many thanks for your help!

Fred

 

[Redacted]

How are you currently powering the speakers - I thought the Wiim Ultra was just a streamer/DAC ?
The Ghent is very good value at €260, and the NC122MP a decent amp with 75W (more than enough to upset neighbours, speaker-independent FR, and no impedance worries).
I'd buy it and see how you get on for a while without buying extra EQ/DSP kit - the Wiim has plenty of things to fiddle with!

 

[webzeb]

How are you currently powering the speakers - I thought the Wiim Ultra was just a streamer/DAC ?
The Ghent is very good value at €260, and the NC122MP a decent amp with 75W (more than enough to upset neighbours, speaker-independent FR, and no impedance worries).
I'd buy it and see how you get on for a while without buying extra EQ/DSP kit - the Wiim has plenty of things to fiddle with!

I'm not, it's a new setup waiting for its amp.

I just played around with an old DIY amp (just 4W) to do some quick measurements of the room/speaker interactions.

 

[Cote Dazur]

Any second hand receiver will do, for very little money, if any, some give them away.

 

[Redacted]

With the Ghent, or indeed any separate used power amp, ask questions about input sensitivity (and returns policy if not happy!) as some units are set up to require different input voltages to get max output (gain is fixed of course).

You could look for a Wiim with amp built-in.

 

[webzeb]

With the Ghent, or indeed any separate used power amp, ask questions about input sensitivity (and returns policy if not happy!) as some units are set up to require different input voltages to get max output (gain is fixed of course).

You could look for a Wiim with amp built-in.

The NC122MP amp + Ghent Audio case I was considering is second hand sold by an individual, not a company.

On the WiiM Ultra I can select the output voltage :

• 200mVrms
• 500mVrms
• 800mVrms
• 1Vrms
• 2Vrms

 

[webzeb]

Any second hand receiver will do, for very little money, if any, some give them away.

Thanks for you advice...but I'm pretty sceptical.

The Wharfedale Linton have a pretty low min. impedance, with important phase rotation in the mid-bass area, and my understanding is that a lot of amps do not like this at all...

 

[TurtlePaul]

For pretty affordable prices you can get 3e Audio A7 or a pair of Fosi v3 mono. Those amps are as good as it gets sonically and can go to ear splitting SPLs. If you are going to keep the volume down, the Topping Mini 300 is only $139.

 

[Redacted]

The NC122MP amp + Ghent Audio case I was considering is second hand sold by an individual, not a company.

On the WiiM Ultra I can select the output voltage :

• 200mVrms
• 500mVrms
• 800mVrms
• 1Vrms
• 2Vrms

Do you know the individual or can you get ebay (say) protection? In my experience though, used purchases have been just fine.

It's the input sensitivity of the power amp that matters too - some amps may need balanced inputs for max outputs (i.e. more than 2V), but I don't know what configs Ghent supplied - maybe ask the seller what the amp was attached to. It's probably got normal line-level RCA inputs, which will be fine.

 

[webzeb]

For pretty affordable prices you can get 3e Audio A7 or a pair of Fosi v3 mono. Those amps are as good as it gets sonically and can go to ear splitting SPLs. If you are going to keep the volume down, the Topping Mini 300 is only $139.

Thanks for your advice.

I don't know the 2Audio A7; I'll take a look!
Edit: I'll also take a look at the topping Mini 300.

A second hand pair of Fosi v3 Mono + powersupply is around 220-250EUR where I live, pretty much in the same ballpark as the NC122MP.
Edit: How they compare?

 

[webzeb]

Do you know the individual or can you get ebay (say) protection? In my experience though, used purchases have been just fine.

It's the input sensitivity of the power amp that matters too - some amps may need balanced inputs for max outputs (i.e. more than 2V), but I don't know what configs Ghent supplied - maybe ask the seller what the amp was attached to. It's probably got normal line-level RCA inputs, which will be fine.

The amp has XLR + RCA adapters (that would be supplied by the seller).
I'll ask him the details.

The site (leboncoin) has some buyer protection, but I did 100+ purchases, almost 100 sales, and never had a serious problem. So I don't know how well (or bad) that buyer protection is.

 

[Redacted]

Go for it!

 

[Cote Dazur]

Thanks for you advice...but I'm pretty sceptical.

The Wharfedale Linton have a pretty low min. impedance, with important phase rotation in the mid-bass area, and my understanding is that a lot of amps do not like this at all...

You might be surprised how well any amp will handle the speaker you have at the level you want to play them.

 

[webzeb]

You might be surprised how well any amp will handle the speaker you have at the level you want to play them.

I understand that a decently designed amp can be completely transparent, until you ask too much power and distorsion starts rising / power supply collapses.

However, I had also in mind that some amps (e.g. class D with feedback loop before the LC filter) were not impedance independent. Hence, while FR would measure flat with a purely resistive load, it would not with a speaker with complex impedance. Is that correct? Does it only manifests at high volume?

 

[melomane13]

aiyima a70 have no problem with impedece. good sinad, high power, small price. look at armir test.

 

[webzeb]

Quick feedback:
Bought the NC122MP
Still experiencing with REW for EQ, but very good first impressions. No audible noise, no audible distortion and enough power.

 

[mlsstl]

Since you have a WiiM Ultra, why not consider a WiiM Vibelink amp? It's 100 w/ch at 8 ohms. I have that combo in a medium-large room (15' X 24' with vaulted ceiling & a large opening to the dining room on one side. I have a pair of Ohm 1000 speakers which are medium sensitivity (88 dB) and zero issues playing at 80 to 85 dB average level. The Vibelink is also a nice cosmetic match for the Ultra, and as with all WiiM products, very reasonaby priced.

 

[thcdru2k]

I use WiiM Ultra and Buckeye Hypex NCx252MP to power a 2.1 setup in bedroom. Its a large master room slightly larger than a 2 car garage. It is way more power than what I need. I find that built-in DSP with laptop / REW is sufficient. WiiM Ultra allows subwoofer / main delay, HPF, LPF, HS, LS, and PK.