AMP and DAC for Hifiman Ananda

[enoiro]

Hello everyone, I am new to the forum and first of all I would like to thank Amirm and all forum members for the many measurements and discussions I have read in the last 3-4 weeks since I got to know the forum. I came to the forum because I am just saying goodbye to my hifi system and switching to headphones. Since I have a family I just don't get to listen to my stereo in a way that I can enjoy the music. This has changed a lot since I bought good headphones.

For some time now, I've only listened to music from my Macbook Pro, Mobile or DAP, and recently I took out a subscription to Qobuz. Right from the start, it was clear to me that the new headphones should be as open as possible and closer to listening to normal speakers than to listening to headphones. Secondly, it was clear from the start that I needed a DAC that was portable and did not require a separate power source. Thirdly, I was initially of the opinion that I would at least keep my stereo amplifier (Marantz PM7001), but I am now seriously considering giving it away and buying a smaller one.

Well, what happened in the meantime;

Because I had first looked into a possible streamer (RPI and Allo Digione sign., Khadas WIM 3 with Tone Board I) I became aware of Tone Board I in the forum because it did so well in the measurements and, among other things, does not need a separate power source if used as Standalone DAC. I just ordered it and in the meantime I have to say that I am quite satisfied.

I live in Switzerland and if you are a headphone fan and have the opportunity to visit Zurich I recommend to visit the K55 Shop. I was allowed to make myself comfortable there and test about a dozen different headphones (all in a price range of 450 - 1200 CHF / USD and which I had chosen myself in the beginning based on their construction, measurements and field reports) with the players I had brought with me. Almost like a blind test I listened to the different headphones and in the end it was clear that the HIFIMAN ANANDA were my absolute favorites.

Now I'm thinking about replacing the amplifier with a much smaller one and I'm thinking that the quality of the headphones comes first, then the quality of the amplifier and in third place the quality of the DAC. I'd like to avoid spending more than 300 - 400 USD / CHF for a new amplifier, but I have trouble with the specifications. The Ananada is easy to drive and has a frequency response of 8 Hz to 55 kHz. I know that probably the very low frequencies as well as the frequencies higher 12-16 kHz are not (consciously?) perceivable, but what if exactly these frequencies give the music some unconsciously perceivable quality? Finally, I listen to a lot of music with Qobuz in the meantime, choose HiRes music pieces whenever possible, and my Marantz allegedly has a frequency response of 5 Hz – 60kHz, which would be top for Ananda. And so I find it hard to buy e.g. a JDS Labs EL AMP II or one from Schiit, because they apparently have a frequency response of about 10-20 Hz to 20 kHz. Can you tell me if it really matters to have an amplifier that can cover the whole frequency range that my headphones could reproduce? What amps would you recommend in combination with Ananda and Tone One? I like the JDS Labs EL AMP II optically very much and according to Amirm's tests it should be a totally valid amp, but the frequency response...

Thanks in advance.

 

[solderdude]

And so I find it hard to buy e.g. a JDS Labs EL AMP II or one from Schiit, because they apparently have a frequency response of about 10-20 Hz to 20 kHz.

All these amps will go lower than 10Hz and certainly higher than 20kHz.
DACs also go higher but are usually spec'd worst case, where worst case is CD quality.

The JDS will go far beyond your headphone when it comes to frequency response.
It is within 0.02dB flat in this frequency range so will go at least from 1Hz to 100kHz at least within 1dB.
Just pick an amp that has the functionality and power levels you want. Output resistance isn't even important in your case.

You like the details of the Ananda because of the treble peak it has at 10kHz, not so much the treble extension.
Most likely you will be listening to 44kHz recordings anyway which do not have any content above 20kHz.

 

[enoiro]

All these amps will go lower than 10Hz and certainly higher than 20kHz.
DACs also go higher but are usually spec'd worst case, where worst case is CD quality.

The JDS will go far beyond your headphone when it comes to frequency response.
It is within 0.02dB flat in this frequency range so will go at least from 1Hz to 100kHz at least within 1dB.
Just pick an amp that has the functionality and power levels you want. Output resistance isn't even important in your case.

You like the details of the Ananda because of the treble peak it has at 10kHz, not so much the treble extension.
Most likely you will be listening to 44kHz recordings anyway which do not have any content above 20kHz.

Thank you for your feedback and infos.

In the meantime I bought the JDS Labs EL AMP II and I am very happy how well my current setup works. Khadas Tone Board I (currently external and portable DAC, in future possibly as DAC of a Khadas VIM3 Streamer), JDS Labs EL AMP II and the Hifiman Ananda harmonize perfectly together, I can recommend it highly.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Ananda is not peaky at all and extends well beyond 20khz towards 16khz. Use online tone generator to hear for yourself.

 

[solderdude]

Filtering the peak that isn't there seems to help. It is a narrow peak so not very audible but audible it is when listening to well made recordings that have sufficient energy there. It enhances cymbals which many people actually like. It does give some 'sharpish etch' to some instruments to the discerning owner. It may take a while to hear it but once you hear it, it will start to annoy. Removing it helps solve this.

Even Rtings (measured with Pinna) still shows a small peak but you you have to take into account that this is partly 'removed' by the measurement sytem having a dip there that is compensated questionable against a reference they apply.

I imagine the measured resonance also is a measurement artifact of my rig ? (that doesn't show up with many other headphones)

 

[JohnYang1997]

Filtering the peak that isn't there seems to help. It is a narrow peak so not very audible but audible it is when listening to well made recordings that have sufficient energy there. It enhances cymbals which many people actually like. It does give some 'sharpish etch' to some instruments to the discerning owner. It may take a while to hear it but once you hear it, it will start to annoy. Removing it helps solve this.

Even Rtings (measured with Pinna) still shows a small peak but you you have to take into account that this is partly 'removed' by the measurement sytem having a dip there that is compensated questionable against a reference they apply.

I imagine the measured resonance also is a measurement artifact of my rig ? (that doesn't show up with many other headphones)

This is solely the difference between measurement equipment and human ears. This is much more pronounced with planars. Indeed your flat plate setup is much better inherently in high frequency measurements. But that's also what I was concerned before I bought mine. It turned out to be completely peak free. There will be some notche around 7-8k because of planar + pinna. But after that it's very smooth. I adopted this method of testing high frequency in 2018, just using ear as equipment. For picking up peaks in the highs is very easy to do and suitable.
I also don't experience dip from 2khz and upwards. There should be some recession in 2khz but it should be 5db max and flat after 3khz. And maybe my pinna is larger I get more 2khz so I don't even feel the dip around 2khz. I also have hd660s 650 600 k612 dt880 600ohm in hand. I would say the tonality and whole frequency spectrum of Ananda are pretty much point.

 

[JohnYang1997]

In terms of Rtings. Headacoustics's head have this issue all along from tyll. This doesn't mean BK and GRAS are perfect. No they are not. I would say flat plane is better in this regard not worse.

 

[solderdude]

I also don't experience dip from 2khz and upwards.

That's the downside of the flatplate. With some (not all) headphones the pinna gain is not shown in the plot. For detecting peaks it seems to work well.
Quite possible some people are less sensitive for peaks. I mean there are tons of people not hearing the treble peaks in HD800 and DT1990 for instance.
When I started in headphones I started with this DT990 and did not find it bright/sharp at all (young ears back then).
I thought it had smooth and not elevated treble and accurate lows. Now I can't stand it without EQ.

 

[enoiro]

Ananda is not peaky at all and extends well beyond 20khz towards 16khz. Use online tone generator to hear for yourself.

Did not know the online tone generator, thanks for the indication.

 

[JohnYang1997]

Did not know the online tone generator, thanks for the indication.

make sure to dial down the volume before playing

 

[asiroo]

Thank you for your feedback and infos.

In the meantime I bought the JDS Labs EL AMP II and I am very happy how well my current setup works. Khadas Tone Board I (currently external and portable DAC, in future possibly as DAC of a Khadas VIM3 Streamer), JDS Labs EL AMP II and the Hifiman Ananda harmonize perfectly together, I can recommend it highly.

How much of a difference is there when you listen to Ananda through your DAC+Amp combo instead of listening directly from PC or mobile? Coz I just purchased an Ananda & I'm searching for some good source component.
Thanks in advance. Cheers!!

 

[solderdude]

Hard to say. It completely depends on the quality of the components connected to it.
A phone should be able to drive it loud and good enough so you don't really need an external amp.
However, if the sound quality of the soundcard (some may not like 25 Ohm) is poor or it is noisy an external DAC/amp may well improve the sound.

 

[enoiro]

How much of a difference is there when you listen to Ananda through your DAC+Amp combo instead of listening directly from PC or mobile? Coz I just purchased an Ananda & I'm searching for some good source component.
Thanks in advance. Cheers!!

It depends on what you consider an increase in quality. For example, I love details, rich and precise basses, roominess, etc. The best thing for me is when I can't distinguish whether a sound comes from my headphones or from my surroundings.

In all the following settings the music I listen with an Audioplayer comes from Qobuz, often in the best quality I can find.

My smartphone has no problem running the Ananda's, and I listen music with the USB Audio Player. The Sound ist really good, but because I usually only listen to music with my smartphone when I'm away from home (and I then use Inears), this setup rarely comes up.

At home I use exclusively my Macbook Pro (2014) to stream Music (or see films, youtube, ...). I usually sit on the same site of the couch, and there I have placed the Dac/amp, and so in 99% of the time I can use my Anandas to hear whatever I want. Since I have the Anandas I hear Music only with Audirvana.

Interestingly, I enjoy music more when my smartphone is connected to DAC and AMP than when the music comes from my Macbook.


My preferences;

The biggest improvements in sound "Quality" (according on my preferences) brings the players. The USB Audio Player (smartphone) is set with "bit Perfect" and Audirvana (Macbook) without any Equalizer setting (is equalizing even possible with Audirvana?). Both players deliver better sound than the Qobuz players.

Amp and Dac highlight the qualitative points I mentioned at the beginning, which are very valuable for me when I listen to music. If you ask my wife she can hear an improvement, but for her it's not worth the money, she usually do not hear only Music, only videos with an Ipad or Iphone.

Two months ago I replaced the power adapter of the amp with a linear AC adapter (Dodocus Ubox-P). The improvement is minimal, but for me worth the money when I hear Instrumentals (guitar, piano, violin, cello...).

Long story short:
- JDS Labs and Khadas Tone Board with the Ananda's is a very good combo, especially if the streamer (soundcard) is weak.
- If you have a good soundcard maybe the Combo Audirvana-Qobuz (or a similar Streaming Service) would be sufficient with the Anandas
- changing the power adapter is clearly a fine tuning matter.

Hope I could be helpful