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AMD Ryzen 7000 Series Discussion (With X670E Charts)

ThatM1key

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A thread about AMD's upcoming Ryzen 7000 series.

Update:
It appears bifurcation is most likely not on a thing with these new X670E motherboards. Boards that feature Dual CPU-linked "x16 slots" can only be set to x8/x8 or forced x8/x4 (Certain Motherboards that feature a 3rd PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot). Motherboards that include a "Dual M.2 adapter" probably use chip-based bifurcation rather then the modern Motherboard & CPU based bifurcation, which is a major blow for the average consumer. When a board & CPU supports x4/x4 or even x4/x4/x4/x4 bifurcation, the storage options is better for the consumer and the adapters can be made dirt cheap ($5 [Single M.2] to $50 [Quad M.2] an adapter). Non-bifurcation chip-based add-on cards due exist but there very costly (Hundreds of dollars). To ease this news, I will make a simple chart comparing boards. MSI's GEN-5 Xpander card appears to be chip-based due to the various MSI motherboard manual's not mentioning bifurcation.


If you were wondering if there is a difference between an M.2 installed on a CPU-linked slot or a Chipset-linked slot, short answer yes. Long answer: https://www.thefpsreview.com/2021/09/28/primary-m-2-socket-vs-secondary-m-2-socket-which-is-faster/

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CPU Lanes Debate. 20? 24? or 28?
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At first we heard the number was 28 (from rumors), now its 24 (officially from AMD). Older Intel and AMD CPU's used 16 lanes (1 x16 slot or 2 x8 slots). Later we got Intel and AMD CPUs used 20 lanes (1 x16 slot or 2 x8 slots, +x4 slot [Usually M.2 slot]). Now the current AMD holds 24 lanes, which is amazing (You already know the possible configs). Judging by motherboard photos, 6-Full-Speed CPU-linked PCIe 5.0 NVMe drives should be possible. Sadly chipset slots will use PCIe 4.0 speeds but in the distant future, we will get PCIe 5.0 speeds.

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X670E Tier List
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Some Info:
  • All 7000-series CPU's have 24 lanes (Ex: x16 Video Card + Dual PCIe 5.0 x4 M.2 slots).
  • All X670E boards should have at least 2 CPU-linked PCIe 5.0 x4 M.2 slots.
  • PCIe 4.0 x4 slots usually share bandwidth the with Chipset PCIe 4.0 M.2s. Most of the time, you can populate all slots and the default speed remains the but of course, if you use all the devices at the same time, the bandwidth is divided. Having the slots remain the default speed is good because your not gonna use all devices at the same time and you can use let's say your PCIe 4.0 SSD at x4 speed while the other slots are populated not being used.
  • Forced "x2" slots are usually for idiot-proofing. A good example is when you copy a file from a PCIe 4.0 x4 slot device to PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot that share the same bandwidth, both devices will divide because each devices is forced at x2. The problem with these idiot-proof measures is that if you want to transfer data from your PCIe 4.0 x4 device or PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot to a non-shared bandwidth device, the device can do x4 but is limited to x2 just because its "shared" with another device that isn't being used. Forced x2 slots are not needed because the slots naturally divide the speed without adjusting slot bandwidth. I would recommend staying away from motherboards that does forced x2 slots.
  • Before you buy a motherboard, make sure your SSDs will fit in those M.2 slots and vice versa.
  • Currently high-latency DDR5 can match or be below low-latency DDR4 (In terms of performance).
  • PCIe 5.0 SSDs will mostly start at 10,000 megabytes/sec. It's going be a while before we get ~14,000-15,000 megabytes/sec drives.
  • If you wanting USB4-40 support on your favorite MB, Future USB4 AICs will be a thing (Just like what happened with USB3.2 Gen 2x2) and will take up a PCIe 3.0 x4 slot. Although USB4 80-gigabit is a thing, Also Future USB4-80 AICs would be either PCIe 3.0 x8 or PCIe 4.0 x4.
  • If you were wanting to use a GPU, that'll cost you 1 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot (Assuming if your using a Single M.2 card in that top slot).

[X670E only]PCIe 5.0 x16 slotsTotal PCIe 5.0 "M.2" slots possible (No Dual M.2 Cards, only Single M.2 card)PCIe 4.0 M.2 slotsPCIe 4.0 x4 capable slotsBoard & CPU BifurcationUSB4/TB4 SupportMSRP (USD)*Notes
Asrock X670E Taichi2 (x16/0), (x8/x8)33 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$500
Asrock X670E Taichi Carrara2 (x16/0), (x8/x8)33 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$530
Asus X670E Extreme2 (x16/0), (x8/x8), (x8/x4)51 (Chipset)1Kind of?Yes/None$1000Last 5.0 "x16" slot will run in x4 mode if a certain PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot is used otherwise the last slot can run in x8 mode.
Asus X670E Hero2 (x16/0), (x8/x8)52 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$700
Asus X670E Gene1 (x16)21 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$600MATX
Asus ProArt X670E2 (x16), (x8/x8)42 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$500PCIe 4.0 "x16" slot is shared with a certain PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot. If both slots are filled, they both run x2. If the "x16 slot" is not used, the M.2 will run at x4 speed. "x16 slot" will always run at x2.
Asus X670E-E2 (x16/0), (x8, x4)41 (Chipset)1NoneNone/Via AIC$470Last 5.0 "x16" slot cannot run in x8 mode at all, only x4 max regardless if an certain PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot is used.
Asus X670-I1 (x16)21 (Chipset)0NoneYes/None$470MITX
Asus X670-F1 (x16)32 (Chipset)1NoneNone/Via AIC$450
Asus X670-A1 (x16)32 (Chipset)1NoneNone/Via AIC$420
Asus Prime X670E-Pro Wi-Fi1 (x16)21 (Chipset), 1 (CPU)2NoneNone/VIA AIC$350Motherboard has 1 extra M.2 that is PCIe 3.0 (Chipset).
Asus TUF Gaming X670E-PLUS (Wi-Fi & Non-Wi-Fi)1 (x16)21 (Chipset), 1 (CPU)2NoneNone/VIA AIC$330 (Wi-Fi)Motherboard has 1 extra M.2 that is PCIe 3.0 (Chipset).
Biostar X670E2 (?)42 (Chipset?)1??None/NoneUnknown (USA site has MB listed)
Gigabyte X670E Aorus Extreme1 (x16), (x8)501NoneNone/Via AIC$700Motherboard has 1 extra PCIe 3.0 "x16" slot (Chipset) that runs at x2. PCIe 5.0 x16 slot will go x8 mode when certain PCIe 5.0 M.2 slots are used.
Gigabyte X670E Aorus Master1 (x16)32 (Chipset)1NoneNone/None$500Motherboard has 1 extra PCIe 3.0 "x16" slot (Chipset) that runs at x2 and shares bandwidth with SATA 4&5. SATA 4&5 become un-usable when that "x16" slot is used.
MSI X670E GODLIKE3 (x16), (x16/x0/x4), (x8/x8/x4)43 (Chipset)0NoneNone/None$1,3006 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slots is (In theory) possible with 2 MSI's exclusive Dual-M.2 AIC. The AIC's appear to use Chip-based bifurcation.
MSI MEG X670E ACE3 (x16), (x16/x0/x4), (x8/x8/x4)43 (Chipset)0NoneNone/None$7006 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slots is (In theory) possible with 2 MSI's exclusive Dual-M.2 AIC. The AIC's appear to use Chip-based bifurcation.
Even if the top slot doesn't support the AIC, you can install a standard adapter and get 5 PCIe M.2 slots.
MSI MEG2 (x16/x0), (x8/x8)42 (Chipset)1NoneNone/None$4806 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slots is (In theory) possible with 2 MSI's exclusive Dual-M.2 AIC. The AIC's appear to use Chip-based bifurcation. Even if the top slot doesn't support the AIC, you can install a standard adapter and get 5 PCIe M.2 slots.


Boards that didn't make it to the chart due to there very odd configuration of slots (Will not mention x1 slots) (M.2 slot is x4 unless noted):

Asrock X670E PG Lightning:
  • CPU: 1 PCIe 5.0 x16 slot, 1 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot, and 1 PCIe 4.0 "x16" x4 slot
  • Chipset: 1 PCIe 3.0 M.2 slot, 1 PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot (x2 speed, wtf), 1 PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot.
  • Bifurcation: None
  • MSRP: $260
Asrock X670E Pro RS:
  • CPU: 1 PCIe 5.0 x16 slot, 1 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot and 1 PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot.
  • Chipset: 2 PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot and 1 PCIe 3.0 M.2 slot (x2 speed, wtf)
  • Bifurcation: None
  • MSRP: $280
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The internet is debating about the difference's between the MSI MEG X670E ACE and Carbon Wifi. The main difference is slots.

MSI MEG X670E ACE ($700 USD)MSI MPG X670E Carbon Wifi ($480)
Last "x16" slotPCIe 5.0 x4 (From CPU)PCIe 4.0 x4 (From chipset)
M.2 PCIe 5.0 Slot's (From CPU)1 (up to 2280)2 (up to 2280)
M.2 PCIe 4.0 Slot's (From Chipset)3 (up to 1x 22110 and 2x 2280)2 (up to 1x 22110 and 1x 2280)
LANMarvell® AQC113-B1-C 10GbpsRealtek® RTL8125BG 2.5Gbps
Total USB 2.0 Ports4 (4 Front Type A)6 (2 Rear Type A, 4 Front Type A)
Total USB 3.2 Gen1 ports [5 gigabit/sec]4 (4 Front Type A)4 (4 Front Type A)
Total USB 3.2 Gen2 ports [10 gigabit/sec]10 (8 Rear Type A, 1 Front Type C, 1 Rear Type C)8 (6 Rear Type A, 1 Front Type C, 1 Rear Type C)
Total USB 3.2 Gen2x2 ports [20 gigabit/sec]3 (2 Rear Type C, 1 Front Type C)1 (1 Rear Type C)
Pump Fan Headers21

In terms of rare performance with M.2 slots, both boards feature the same amount. In terms of future-proofing, the ACE wins. The ACE features a 10-gigabit controller and a physical PCIe 5.0 x4 CPU-linked (than the Carbon's PCIe 5.0 x4 M.2 slot). Why is a physical PCIe 5.0 slot is better than a PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot?, future M.2 sizes. Instead of being stuck with 2x PCIe 5.0 2280-max slots, your giving up 1 PCIe 5.0 M.2 slot for a PCIe 5.0 x4 PCIe slot, which could be slotted with a future 22110 & 25110 PCIe 5.0 x4 add-on cards. In terms of 10-gigabit LAN, the ACE features a built-in while with the Carbon, you have to buy a 10-gigabit LAN add-on card which wastes your valuable PCIe 4.0 x4 chipset-linked slot. You could hope and wait for a 10-gigabit USB adapter (to save that PCIe slot) but it's gonna be a while before that happens. If you don't care about wasting that slot, then you could save some money.

The one advantage the carbon has is future USB cards. If you want a USB4 add-on card (40 gigabit/sec), wasting the Carbon's PCIe 4.0 x4 Chipset-linked slot is ironically better then wasting the PCIe 5.0 CPU-linked slot. If you care about USB4, I would wait half a year and see if there's any X670E boards that feature built-in ones.

============================================================
USB4 & TB4 AICs
============================================================

Info on USB4 speeds through TB4 ports on MBs/AICs is almost non-existent, where's a small list of what I can find (FTW: USB 4 can do TB4 speeds):
  • ASRock Thunderbolt 4 AIC:
Screenshot 2022-09-04 105428.png

  • ASUS ThunderBoltEX 4 Card:
Screenshot 2022-09-04 105335.png


  • MSI Thunderbolt 4 PCIe Expansion Card:
Screenshot 2022-09-04 105543.png


  • Gigabyte GC-MAPLE RIDGE (USB 3.2 Gen 2 is 10 gigabit/sec):
Screenshot 2022-09-04 105948.png




If you want to hear my thoughts:
I'm mainly an Intel guy and a computer geek. My job is about computers and my main interest is computers, so I think about computers a-lot. Anyways, I wanted to build a system not because its broken because I want more of a modern future-proof computer. I'm the top of person that cares more about the motherboard then the video-card.

I initially wanted to go with an Intel Z690 motherboard. PCIe 4.0 x8 Equivalent Chipset bandwidth (DMI 4.0), Dual CPU-linked PCIe 5.0 "x16" slots (x16/x0 or x8/x8 mode), USB4/TB4 ports, 1 CPU-linked PCIe 4.0 M.2 slot, etc. There's one problem, no bifurcation. Bifurcation is important to me because without it, you can only run 1 PCIe 5.0 NVMe SSD on that divided x8 slot and if it had it, you can run 2 PCIe 5.0 NVMe SSDs on that same slot. If Intel allowed Z690 to have that, I wouldn't mind buying one but having no bifurcation just bugs me. I think Intel Z590 does bifurcation but the chipset bandwidth is PCIe 3.0 x4 Equivalent, dual slots are PCIe 4.0 and the CPUs are just bad value (A 12th gen i5 shouldn't match a 10th gen i9).

AMD's current X570 (With a 5000 series CPU) on the other hand. PCIe 4.0 x4 Equivalent Chipset bandwidth, Dual CPU-linked PCIe 4.0 "x16" slots (x16/x0, x8/x8 and x8/x4/x4), USB4/TB4 ports, 1 CPU-linked PCIe 4.0 slot, etc. With X570, we do get bifurcation but the chipset's bandwidth is half of Intel's Z690 and the 2 "x16" slots are PCIe 4.0. Since we have bifurcation, in theory, a DirectStorage API game could load faster on a X570 Bifurcation RAID 0 PCIe 4.0 NVMe setup, then a Z690 Chipset-based RAID 0 PCie 4.0 NVMe setup but that theory falls apart because we could use a PCIe 5.0 SSD on the Z690 divided x8 slot that would match that X570 bifurcation setup.

What I do think of X670E?, its best of both worlds potentially. X670E has dual PCIe 5.0 "x16" slots that mostly will support bifurcation and the 1 CPU-linked M.2 slot will be most likely PCIe 5.0 also. In terms of chipset bandwidth theory, it could PCIe 4.0 x8 or even PCIe 4.0 x16 Equivalent. I think Z790 will remain mostly the same like the Z690, just like the jump from Z170 to Z270.
 
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Digby

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modern future-proof computer
All computers are equally futureproof, around 5 years after they are manufactured before being significantly superseded. It is a very odd term IMO, because things change so fast. You can use a computer with just USB2 slots, it is possible but who would do that when USB3 and up exists. So, five years, more or less.

The thing is, I bet you change your PC far more frequently than every 5 years, everyone who uses the term futureproof seems to change every 18 months to 2 years. It's a funny old world, eh?
 
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Moravid

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I don't know about it's PCIE configurations but in terms of single core performance Ryzen 7000 will merely tie 12th Gen performance, 13th gen is expected to release sometime in October with even higher performance
 
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ThatM1key

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All computers are equally futureproof, around 5 years after they are manufactured before being significantly superseded. It is a very odd term IMO, because things change so fast.
I agree with, I believe for that to be true in terms of rare power (CPU/GPU) but in terms of little things like USB ports and features, yeah they do change pretty fast.
You can use a computer with just USB2 slots, it is possible but who would do that when USB3 and up exists. So, five years, more or less.
My brothers was only a USB2 only system and it is pain to transfer files, so I added a USB3 card and that made the system experience better.

The funny thing is, I bet you change your PC far more frequently than every 5 years, everyone who uses the term futureproof seems to change every 18 months to 2 years. It's a funny old world, eh?
My system mainly has a i7 6700 with a GTX 1070 ti, but it technically holds just fine. In terms of change, I went through 3 motherboards and 4 cases. I also meant futureproof in terms of bottlenecks, anything beyond a GTX 1080/RTX 3060 ti for that i7 6700, is a bottleneck. I'm not much of a gamer but eventually I would like to upgrade to a better GPU and I want a CPU that can handle that GPU upgrade and future GPU's.

I don't know about it's PCIE configurations but in terms of single core performance Ryzen 7000 will merely tie 12th Gen performance, 13th gen is expected to release sometime in October with even higher performance
It probably will but Ryzen 7K is gonna have PCIE 5.0 SSD support while 13th gen is gonna probably stick with PCIE 4.0 SSD support judging by Z790 supporting DDR4 still.
 

MRC01

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All computers are equally futureproof, around 5 years after they are manufactured before being significantly superseded. ... I bet you change your PC far more frequently than every 5 years, everyone who uses the term futureproof seems to change every 18 months to 2 years. It's a funny old world, eh?
That was certainly true 25 years ago. Computers were getting so much faster every year we were replacing them every year or two. The software was quicly becoming increasingly bigger, more complex and more bloated too, to take advantage of the better hardware. Today, not so much. The rate of improvement is much slower. A 5 year old desktop is still perfectly fine today, if it was a good one when it came out. Especially so if you're not gaming.
 

DonR

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I was stoked when I heard that they might release a Zen 4 for AM4 but alas it looks unlikely. I hope AM5 lasts as long and has a similar life cycle as AM4 did. Personally still using an i5-2500K which I upgraded to earlier this year from an i5-2500. Still does what I need it to do.
 

abdo123

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A 5 year old desktop is still perfectly fine today, if it was a good one when it came out. Especially so if you're not gaming.

That's because focus lately have been on mobility and energy efficiency accumulating into the Apple Silicon ARM processors which set a new record of how much performance we can get per W.

Nvidia have been going the opposite direction with graphics cards, and if they're not careful all-in-one chips might pull the carpet under them sooner than expected.
 

Digby

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My system mainly has a i7 6700 with a GTX 1070 ti, but it technically holds just fine. In terms of change, I went through 3 motherboards and 4 cases.
Trigger's broom (https://www.adambowie.com/blog/2018/06/triggers-broom/):

There’s a great gag from an episode of Only Fools and Horses where street sweeper Trigger has been rewarded by his local council for using the same broom for 20 years.

“This old broom has had 17 new heads and 14 new handles in its time.”


With the money spent on 2 motherboards and 4 cases (why 4 cases?), you might have funded a newer CPU/MB & PSU. I am not against keeping older tech running, but only if I have a secondary use for it. My main system gets upgraded around every 5 years. The performance gains are such that one can use more frequent replacement cycles and use cheaper components - compare CPUs from 2017 to 2022, big gains in performance even at the lowest price levels.

A 5 year old desktop is still perfectly fine today, if it was a good one when it came out. Especially so if you're not gaming.
Is it, does Windows 11 support all 5 year old CPUs? I think they may be at the edge of support for that OS.

I know you'll probably say to use Linux, but that is another thing entirely (time & energy to change/no gaming potential/patchy driver support/fill in your own blank). I think what I said holds true...let's call it 7 years maximum; the components, if still supported, are probably going to give out in short order, it is only a matter of time. Probably the motherboard, maybe the PSU, but it will happen and when it does good luck finding a replacement motherboard that isn't also 7 years old and well used, good luck not having your faulty PSU take a hdd or ssd with it.

You can run PCs older than 5-7 years for your main PC, but I wouldn't recommend it, considering the time you will waste reviving it when it eventually goes down. For your main PC, I think it is just prudent to set a sensible time scale and replace the CPU/PSU/MB within it.

Also, 5 year old components can still fetch a decent price on ebay, sometimes around 60% of new price. Your old junk is someone's treasure, if you wait until it is 7 or 8 years old, the value may have fallen to lower than 30% original cost.
 
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Berwhale

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A 5 year old desktop is still perfectly fine today, if it was a good one when it came out. Especially so if you're not gaming.

Indeed, I built a PC with a Ryzen 7 1700X on a B350M motherboard in January 2018. I'm considering putting a Ryzen 5 5000 series in the PC (on the same AM4 motherboard) when the price drops further after the 7000 series becomes available. The upgrade will give me a modest performance increase, official Windows 11 support and reduced power consumption.

I saw Ryzen 5 5500 going for just over £100 the other day, although i'll probably spend a little more on an R5 5600X or even a R7 5700X if they drop enough.
 

MRC01

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...Is it, does Windows 11 support all 5 year old CPUs? I think they may be at the edge of support for that OS. ... I know you'll probably say to use Linux, but that is another thing entirely
...
You can run PCs older than 5-7 years for your main PC, but I wouldn't recommend it, considering the time you will waste reviving it when it eventually goes down. For your main PC, I think it is just prudent to set a sensible time scale and replace the CPU/PSU/MB within it. ...
Yep, you predicted that! ;) I've been running Linux at home & work for the past 10 years. It is lighter, faster more efficient, more reliable and more secure than Windows. It runs on both old and new hardware seamlessly, it doesn't slowly fill your computer with crap, slowly consuming disc space and CPU cycles with incrementally increasing bloat-ware, eventually forcing your hardware into planned obsolescence. Your 5-7 year prediction is actually pretty good if you run Linux and you're not gaming. A Windows PC won't last that long, but that's a software problem. Of course the situation is different for gaming, which is why I mentioned that in my first reply.
 

Digby

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My system mainly has a i7 6700 with a GTX 1070 ti, but it technically holds just fine. In terms of change, I went through 3 motherboards and 4 cases. I also meant futureproof in terms of bottlenecks, anything beyond a GTX 1080/RTX 3060 ti for that i7 6700, is a bottleneck. I'm not much of a gamer but eventually I would like to upgrade to a better GPU and I want a CPU that can handle that GPU upgrade and future GPU's.
So you are running a 7, nearly 8 year old system. I would suggest changing systems more frequently.

What is the point of worrying about PCI-E NVMe specs, when your current equipment is old, yet works pretty well and serves most of your needs (if it didn't you would have changed it already). Why not just buy lower spec equipment, more frequently, and sell the old stuff before it loses too much value.

I used to run equipment into the ground. It is easy to get comfortable, but you don't want to be dealing with the potential of big failures. You've already changed the motherboard twice (did the replacement die twice over?). There comes a point where, in keeping something going, you're just exchanging money for old rope.

Yep, you predicted that! ;) I've been running Linux at home & work for the past 10 years. It is lighter, faster more efficient, more reliable and more secure than Windows. It runs on both old and new hardware seamlessly, it doesn't slowly fill your computer with crap, slowly consuming disc space and CPU cycles with incrementally increasing bloat-ware, eventually forcing your hardware into planned obsolescence. Your 5-7 year prediction is actually pretty good if you run Linux and you're not gaming. A Windows PC won't last that long, but that's a software problem.
But what you're doing is something niche. I have no problem with it, but running Linux, in whatever way it may be better than Windows, is by necessity not running something up to date. The latest drivers are not going to be available for Linux like they are for Windows, so Linux is a way to keep old stuff going, but it is de facto not cutting edge, whatever advantages it has over Windows, being current is not one of them.

Linux doesn't stop your old hardware going kaput either. If it is a non-essential PC, no big deal, if it is your main one you have a problem. Using time and money to tend to some elderly computer may be someone's idea of fun, but I'd rather do something else than hunt down old motherboards on ebay, hand over good money and then toss a coin as to how long it will last.

We can talk about e-waste and all that jazz, but in the end I'd rather recycle my stuff by selling it while it still has value, rather than trying to eke every last year out of it at an ever worsening energy to profit ratio.
 

Berwhale

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It is lighter, faster more efficient, more reliable and more secure than Windows. It runs on both old and new hardware seamlessly, it doesn't slowly fill your computer with crap, slowly consuming disc space and CPU cycles with incrementally increasing bloat-ware, eventually forcing your hardware into planned obsolescence.

In my experience, if you spend the same time fettling Windows as you need to fettle Linux to make is useable, you get pretty much the same result.

Note: I am biased as I qualified as a Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer in 1997 and have worked with Windows most of my life, but I've also been a certified SA in Unix (IBM AIX 3.3) and Novell Netware 3.12 :)
 
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ThatM1key

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I was stoked when I heard that they might release a Zen 4 for AM4 but alas it looks unlikely. I hope AM5 lasts as long and has a similar life cycle as AM4 did. Personally still using an i5-2500K which I upgraded to earlier this year from an i5-2500. Still does what I need it to do.
I would recommend upgrading to a i7 3770, if your motherboards supports it. $45 for a CPU that almost matches my i7 6700 or at least a i5 6400.

With the money spent on 2 motherboards and 4 cases (why 4 cases?), you might have funded a newer CPU/MB & PSU. I am not against keeping older tech running, but only if I have a secondary use for it. My main system gets upgraded around every 5 years. The performance gains are such that one can use more frequent replacement cycles and use cheaper components - compare CPUs from 2017 to 2022, big gains in performance even at the lowest price levels.
When I growing up, I grew up with cases that tons of functions (aka lots of 5.25's and 3.5's) but I also love todays air-flow based cases that barely have any functions. So I kept flipping between those kinds of cases.

Yep, you predicted that! ;) I've been running Linux at home & work for the past 10 years. It is lighter, faster more efficient, more reliable and more secure than Windows. It runs on both old and new hardware seamlessly, it doesn't slowly fill your computer with crap, slowly consuming disc space and CPU cycles with incrementally increasing bloat-ware, eventually forcing your hardware into planned obsolescence. Your 5-7 year prediction is actually pretty good if you run Linux and you're not gaming. A Windows PC won't last that long, but that's a software problem. Of course the situation is different for gaming, which is why I mentioned that in my first reply.
The only thing close to that was Windows 7, lightweight and did everything well (at the time). Although Win7 did have that caching problem, that forgot to delete temp stuff oops. I would go back to Windows 7 but some games run better on Windows 10/11 and it doesn't have DirectStorage API.

What is the point of worrying about PCI-E NVMe specs, when your current equipment is old, yet works pretty well and serves most of your needs (if it didn't you would have changed it already). Why not just buy lower spec equipment, more frequently, and sell the old stuff before it loses too much value.
In terms of NVMe SSDs, value. You can buy a PCIe 4.0 NVMe for a bit more than a PCIe 3.0 drive. In terms of my PC, it does what I need but I'm not a big fan of how I setup it. My PC is essentially a NAS and a gaming PC shoved together. I essentially want to start fresh in a way, build a new high airflow gaming-focused PC while using this current PC as a "Windows NAS". I did have a low-spec idea in-min, buy a modern Ryzen 3/Intel i3 that matches my i7 6700's performance and ride for a few years or buy a modern Ryzen 7/Intel i7 that'll last me 5+ years again, of course both options would have the highest chipset motherboard.
 

ZolaIII

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Regarding Ryzen Zen 4 will probably be the last architecture based on initial updated Zen core's and next literacy will probably be based on the completely new architecture. How good it will be we will see. Intel switched to a new one wider OoO for a big core's on the current one and big little topology. However old Zen 3 Ryzen with borrowed "infinite cache" from server parts is still competitive regarding gaming on old AM4 socket. AM5 will probably be there for at least couple generations and in generally that's AMD's advantage on long run. Still upgrades are limited by UEFI support and size so most of old chipset one's don't exactly support Ryzen 5xxx or 3D processor's.
PCIe is what it is, M2 SSD's are getting rather power hungry and it's becoming crucial that they have a proper cooling which most don't have. A year ago when I bought Corsair MP600 I bought it more for it's write and work endurance then spead. I have sata Samsung 860 Pro in a laptop that's used as music server and again bought it for a same reason and it's still fast enough and there is no obvious difference in regular use between the two, in some scenarios there is but I seriously doubt anyone of you will be doing raw video editing in pro codecs on regular basis if ever. There is also a difrence between performance trough native PCIe 4 lines in CPU (SoC really) and additional one's on chipset.
More or less we are all in line for GPU upgrade if prices ever get back to normal and after the new generation refresh.

Best regards.
 

DonR

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I would recommend upgrading to a i7 3770, if your motherboards supports it. $45 for a CPU that almost matches my i7 6700 or at least a i5 6400.
I really have no need as the way I use it the 2500K barely breaks a sweat as it is and that is $45 towards my new PC fund. This one was a free gift when my son upgraded his PC to a 5800X. Personally, I am not sure it is worth putting money into an old platform like this (Z77 ITX). If I find a nice used B450 ITX (does one exist?) I might get an R5 3600 and call that an upgrade. When I was working for a living, my PC was upgraded every 24 months at the most but one has to be a little more flexible when it is your own money or you are not using it for a productive task.
 

Blaazen

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I also plan to build a new AM5 machine. But PCIe 5.0 NVMe is not important for me. It will have better numbers in benchmarks but hardly any benefit in real life, i.e. IOPS and random access. I'd like to buy pair of Hynix P41 Platinum because of their power efficiency, one for system and the other for /home (yes, Linux).
 

MRC01

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.... But what you're doing is something niche. I have no problem with it, but running Linux, in whatever way it may be better than Windows, is by necessity not running something up to date. The latest drivers are not going to be available for Linux like they are for Windows, so Linux is a way to keep old stuff going, but it is de facto not cutting edge, whatever advantages it has over Windows, being current is not one of them.
...
There are downsides to running Linux, but being current or up-to-date is not one of them. Active Linux distros like Ubuntu (among others) issue updates (both performance & security) at least as often as Windows. Unlike Windows, with Linux you don't need drivers for every piece of hardware you plug in. Webcams, sound cards, mice/trackballs, etc. just plug them in and they work, no driver needed. When it comes to installs, Linux package managers handle that and manage the dependencies.

Of course you do need a video driver and here's one of the Linux downsides. NVidia is great. They publish binary drivers that are seamless to install and use (built into the standard package manager repos). But NVidia is pretty much the only option on Linux. The others don't support Linux at all, or nearly as well.

In my experience, if you spend the same time fettling Windows as you need to fettle Linux to make is useable, you get pretty much the same result.
...
Not in my experience. I also use and manage both. Windows 10 was an improvement but I still find it to be less reliable and more fragile than Linux. Either one (Windows or Linux) can be made to work but I waste less time fussing with Linux.
 

Berwhale

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Not in my experience. I also use and manage both. Windows 10 was an improvement but I still find it to be less reliable and more fragile than Linux. Either one (Windows or Linux) can be made to work but I waste less time fussing with Linux.

Fair enough, it's the opposite or me :) I've been a Windows Insider since 2014 and i've never had to 'format and re-install' apart from significant hardware changes (and in some cases, not even then). i.e. I've been running beta versions of Windows for 8 years with zero issues (Actually, PUBG and BattleEye didn't like my Windows version for a while)
 

Blumlein 88

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There are downsides to running Linux, but being current or up-to-date is not one of them. Active Linux distros like Ubuntu (among others) issue updates (both performance & security) at least as often as Windows. Unlike Windows, with Linux you don't need drivers for every piece of hardware you plug in. Webcams, sound cards, mice/trackballs, etc. just plug them in and they work, no driver needed. When it comes to installs, Linux package managers handle that and manage the dependencies.

Of course you do need a video driver and here's one of the Linux downsides. NVidia is great. They publish binary drivers that are seamless to install and use (built into the standard package manager repos). But NVidia is pretty much the only option on Linux. The others don't support Linux at all, or nearly as well.


Not in my experience. I also use and manage both. Windows 10 was an improvement but I still find it to be less reliable and more fragile than Linux. Either one (Windows or Linux) can be made to work but I waste less time fussing with Linux.
Pretty much my experience with Linux too. I do keep a Win laptop around, but it is a secondary machine I use with recording interfaces. If there were something like Asio for Linux I'd ditch Windows altogether.

My laptop is 10 years old. My desktop 7. I may update both soon. Me previous laptop was given away at 10 years old and still in use by a relative. I did put an ssd on it when I had it.

Former MCSE here too.
 
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