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Am I crazy for abandoning Room EQ?

Buckeye Amps

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So, in the last three years I have went from a simple Yamaha AVR using YAPPO for simple distance and level adjustment to a Monoprice HTP-1 using Dirac and really diving into making my own house curve that didn't change the FR of the speakers too much past 500Hz (used the Harman house curve basically with more bass added) to a Trinnov Altitude and using a similar house curve to now an Anthem AVM90 and only using ARC EQ up to 500Hz.

Through them all, I still never felt like my Funk sub was being EQ'ed properly as there was a lot of oomph missing that I knew the sub could produce (being a 21", 2.4kw beast).

Recently I got around to using the Funk subs built-in DSP software and making my own PEQ adjustments to get a flat response: before, there was a +12dB peak between 30-45Hz and a -8dB null between 65-85Hz. The large difference between the two would always have any of the Room EQ software "neutering" the sub and favoring a baseline EQ target that used the peak instead of cutting the peak to get closer to the dip.

What I found doing my own PEQ is I can safely cut the peak and bring up the null for a somewhat flat (+/-4dB) response curve from 15Hz to 100Hz. And using reference level testing material, the sub handles it (no limiting, no distortion, etc).

By and large, the sub/bass sounds the best it ever has in my room with just using PEQ on the sub and letting the speakers play unaltered (no Room EQ). It also helps I have Revel Be speakers for the LCR and a decently treated room, so the natural sound above 200-300Hz is perfect to my ears in my room.

With all that said: am I crazy for completely abandoning Room EQ and letting my speakers play as they are in the room with just simple PEQ adjustment to the sub?
I am even contemplating selling the AVM90 to pocket the funds and just get a simple (but well reviewed) pre-pro or AVR at this point.

Again, crazy?
 

dadregga

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I know REW lets you pick the equalization threshold, so you have a choice as to whether your peaks get knocked or your nulls boosted. Does the room EQ software you are using allow you to pick this?

Also generally most EQ can't fix bass nulls/peaks very effectively - that's why sub positioning to get those fixed before you do room EQ usually helps room EQ do a much better job.

I'd suggest rerunning room EQ on top of your now-EQ'd, now-flatter sub response and see what it does.
 

Grotti

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You are running just one sub? I think a second one carefully positioned could have been helpful with the null. Anyway: if you are satisfied with the sound as it is now: congratulations! You seem to have achieved more than a lot of folks reading this thread. Me included ;)...
 

MattHooper

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If you are crazy so am I.

I tend to prefer the room EQ off for my home theater system. For my 2 channel system I had subs with room correction for a little while, but preferred my system without the subs/room EQ.

A nice benefit about being a heathen like this is less complexity/boxes/speakers in my system, which I appreciate :)
 

DWPress

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I have come to a similar place with my subs, it was especially bad with Dirac 2ch as far as the auto room correction stuff went. I do still use some correction for time alignment but everything in the subs range <65Hz is just done with a handful of PEQ adjustments per sub for amplitude. Sounds great and much better measurements as well for confirmation.
 

JEarle

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I have just done the same thing on my with two of my systems! Family Room BMR Towers sound better without ARC engaged and Front Room Wharedale Denton's + Sub sound better with just a little PEQ on the sub. More impact, more natural and more enjoyment.

Basement sounds best with Dirac on though.
 

GXAlan

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It’s completely fine. You are running room correction— it just happens that your literal HOUSE curve is different in your home.

Harman curve is the best overall curve, but there may be times you want a little difference because of seating positions.
 

yourmando

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Yes, you are crazy :p

You won’t get neutered as much with room correction if you use more than 1 sub. 3-4 subs is good, and 2 might work well with great room placement.

1 sub just can’t address your room modes and your degrees of freedom for optimization parameters are extremely limited. The room optimization is really hamstrung because it can’t change many variables and something like Dirac will limit the amount of boost it will allow because it doesn’t know the limits to your gear.

Add at least one more sub, use MSO to optimize, then plug the delays and biquads into your Trinnov and you should get better summation as well as better seat to seat consistency on top of that.
 

AdamG247

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I vote another sub. But I am a self admitted Basshead.
 

Matias

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You just dialed down from an "ideal" approach to a "minimal" approach. As with all things, I guess room EQ also has diminishing returns. EQing your sub probably is the 80% return for 20% tweaking that is the best value for you.
 
OP
Buckeye Amps

Buckeye Amps

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I did go back and do some more tweaking with the Funk EQ and I *seem* to have found a happy median where I can EQ the sub to be somewhat flat without using much gain (no more than 4dB) and then using ARC on top of that with some more global sub gain added and only EQ'ing up to 500Hz.

The result seems a little more controlled/clean than just doing my own EQ without ARC but still has about 95% of the oomph and punch I got when EQing myself.
One benefit with ARC is delays and levels are more precise than the tape measure and SPL meter.

Will try this for now. A local dealer just got the new AVM 70 8k in stock so I may trade down to that, keep the minimalist ARC approach, and still pocket some extra cash.
 

Axo1989

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If you are crazy so am I.

I tend to prefer the room EQ off for my home theater system. For my 2 channel system I had subs with room correction for a little while, but preferred my system without the subs/room EQ.

A nice benefit about being a heathen like this is less complexity/boxes/speakers in my system, which I appreciate :)

Less stuff is more zen !!

I've not had separate subs to integrate (so far at least, I ended up with full-range speakers, effectively passive subs <100 Hz but fixed to the T/M/B location) which keeps things simple. I've never deployed an AVR (all those connectors give me trypophobia) so have no specific experience with their room correction software implementations however I usually run room EQ (Sonarworks) full range from the computer source ... but I've just changed said source and yet to run the procedure so listening uncorrected for fun ... hello 50 Hz bass.

I could probably mitigate that by moving things around (I assume you've done this) but there's not much floor space in my case. For the OP there's no reason why judicious PEQ wouldn't work I think. I hate doing my own PEQ though, I can never stop.
 
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kongwee

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Go ahead with your listening curve. Sometime you just need to move speaker/sub 1 degree or half cm and get better presentation. A lot of time the material you listen determine how you want your system sound.
 

AudioJester

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Not crazy.
Nos start building and selling tube amps and you have come full circle
 

MattHooper

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Less stuff is more zen !!

Yes, I'm a fan of a clean, minimal look for my listening room. Even the cables are hidden. Subs are damned ugly to my eye (not to mention more cables, and needing to run to more AC outlets) so I was glad to be rid of them.

I've never deployed an AVR (all those connectors give me trypophobia)

Same here! My system is particularly complex, with all my cables running from an equipment room down through the floors/walls to my home theater/listening room. The very thought of having to swap in a new AV receiver is so skin crawling I've kept my old Denon receiver since 2009!
I loathe dealing with cables 'n shit.

I could probably mitigate that by moving things around (I assume you've done this) but there's not much floor space in my case. For the OP there's no reason why judicious PEQ wouldn't work I think. I hate doing my own PEQ though, I can never stop.

I didn't have much floor space either, which is why I had one sub along my screen wall behind the main speakers and one across the room, on a diagonal, behind my listening sofa in a bay window area. I had a nice JL Audio CR-1 crossover which made dialing in things a cinch, and some room correction, and even before correction it all worked surprisingly well! (I still ultimately preferred my main speakers without the subs though).
 

DWPress

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No room for more subs at this time
In the past I used a small 8" Yamaha sub (actually 2 of them in the end before I bought the SVS) to compliment my 18" sub because they were easy to hide and were able to fill that void naturally created by my main sub and room which no amount of treatment can address. The little subs never broke up at high SPL because they only served out signal from 45-55Hz with a LR8 on either side. Not a good idea to boost room nulls with EQ, make cuts only in the bass region.

I'm computer based though and can easily control the HP and LP filters, SPL, EQ, etc. for each channel. I've a feeling you're more home theater oriented and are at the mercy of those devices that easily decode video but are more limited in correction abilities.
 

dorakeg

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I don't see how is that crazy. Room correction didnt even exist 20yrs ago and I m still not having any room EQ today...
 
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