All About UFO's

[EJ3]

Just a couple of tidbits on monosaccharide stereochemistry from my own lectures on the topic(s)
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Chemical syntheses often (not always!) produce both flavors of stereoisomers when they have a choice (so to speak): a mixture of the two isomers of one chiral carbon is called a racemic mixture. Biological systems (enzyme catalysis) produce one stereoisomer. For example, all of the amino acids found in protein are of the "L" form; no D/L racemic mixtures. All of the common aldohexoses (Galactose, Glucose, Mannose) are of the "D" form, not racemic D/L mixtures. It's a hallmark of biosynthesis.

Galactose, Glucose, and Mannose all have the same molecular composition (C6H12O6), differing only in the way those atoms are hooked together. There are both D and L forms of each, too.

Here's D-glucose, in its "aldopyranose" (ring) form -- as most commonly encountered in a biological context.
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(the hydrogen atoms aren't shown, for clarity). This is the beta form (thermodynamically the most stable due to the orientation of those OH groups); the alpha form "flips" the OH group at carbon 1. L-glucose would flip the configuration at all of the chiral (asymmetrically modified) carbons. alpha-L-glucose is the 'perfect' mirror image of beta-D-glucose.

Since sugars have multiple, chemically active sites, there are lots of different ways to link them together. If we take three sugars of the same mass (e.g., Gal, Glc, Man, the same three mentioned above), there are, on paper, 1056 different ways to hook them together (they do NOT all occur naturally). Those trisaccharides all have the same mass.

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We can start to play tricks such as the aforementioned "MS^n" (fragmentation analysis) to tease apart these "isobaric" (same mass) species.
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Wish that some of my teachers had explained things that well!

 

[PierreV]

Just a couple of tidbits on monosaccharide stereochemistry from my own lectures on the topic(s)

That course was very interesting when I took it.

But the oral exam remains one of my worst memories. The professor (not you, obviously) had a deck of cards that he shuffled like a casino dealer, out of which he drew ten cards which he showed one by one and you had to identify. To be honest I think he let me through simply because I was usually able to fix the lab's Apple IIs

 

[mhardy6647]

I use a terrible series of tricks to remember which isomers are called what.
But the ones that are important to me (i.e., the common monosaccharides found on mammalian glycoproteins) I do know in that deep and profound way that we know stuff tha's important to us.

 

[terryforsythe]

Here is an interesting picture taken by the Mars rover Curiosity on Sol 2556 (August 7, 2022). Look at the lower right portion of the image:

Sol 3556: Mast Camera (Mastcam) – NASA Mars Exploration

This image was taken by Mast Camera (Mastcam) onboard NASA's Mars rover Curiosity on Sol 3556 (2022-08-07 20:58:23 UTC).

mars.nasa.gov

Here is a color and higher resolution of the image from Washington University:

EDIT: ChatGPT says it is part of the rover that fell off, but it looks like it is partially buried. Could it get burried that quickly? I don't know.

 

[xray]

Shadow is consistent with the rest of the photo so it's unlikely a processing artifact. I don't know what geological processes would produce a cylindrical object. Curious.

 

[kemmler3D]

Could it get burried that quickly? I don't know.

Something that is definitely possible to find out.

I don't know what geological processes would produce a cylindrical object. Curious.

They generally don't as far as I know, but this photo was taken by a piece of man-made equipment that's gotten there using other pieces of man-made equipment.

The simplest explanation is it's from Earth and got there the same way the rover did.

Until we can eliminate that very likely possibility, further speculation about alien origins is unwarranted.

If you unexpectedly find a banana in your kitchen, you ask if anyone's gone grocery shopping lately... you do not assume it somehow grew there in total isolation from any other evidence of banana trees.

 

[terryforsythe]

Until we can eliminate that very likely possibility, further speculation about alien origins is unwarranted.

Neither of us speculated that there is an alien origin for the cylindrical object. I agree that the simplest hypothesis is that it came from Earth.

Curiosity does not collect samples in tubes, but Perseverance does. But, its tubes look quite different than the cylindrical object shown in the photo.

It looks like it has been there long enough to become partially burried. The question of whether any other rovers have been in that area or whether debris from previous missions fell there. So far, I have not found any satisfactory answers to those questions. I'll do some research on where the various rovers have traversed on Mars.

 

[xray]

I would agree if it was just sitting there on the surface. It looks to be buried in the sediment layers.

 

[Mart68]

Looks like the open end of a pipe emerging from the rock.

 

[terryforsythe]

I'll do some research on where the various rovers have traversed on Mars.

Perseverance is a long way from Curiosity. The closest man-made object to Curiosity, that we know of, is the InSight lander, which is 600km (373 miles) away.

According to ChatGPT, no Mars lander or rover is known to have flown over Curioisity's current location during landing. IF ChatGPT is correct, that rules those out.

EDIT: Here is a link to a map of Nasa's Mars landing sights: https://science.nasa.gov/resource/map-of-nasas-mars-landing-sites/

 

[terryforsythe]

The closest failed mission to Curiosity's location at Gale Crater is Beagle 2, about 2,900km away at Isidis Planitia.

 

[Petrushka]

Here is an interesting picture taken by the Mars rover Curiosity on Sol 2556 (August 7, 2022). Look at the lower right portion of the image:

Sol 3556: Mast Camera (Mastcam) – NASA Mars Exploration

This image was taken by Mast Camera (Mastcam) onboard NASA's Mars rover Curiosity on Sol 3556 (2022-08-07 20:58:23 UTC).

mars.nasa.gov

Here is a color and higher resolution of the image from Washington University:

View attachment 497796

EDIT: ChatGPT says it is part of the rover that fell off, but it looks like it is partially buried. Could it get burried that quickly? I don't know.

Searching the web
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The object in the lower right corner of this Curiosity rover image is a small, protruding rock with a roughly cylindrical or conical shape, appearing grayish-blue against the reddish Martian soil. It stands upright and partially embedded in the ground.Mars' geology frequently produces unusual rock formations through wind erosion (ventifacts), differential weathering, and ancient water-related processes that harden certain minerals into resistant shapes. Curiosity has photographed many such oddly shaped rocks over the years, including:

• Coral-like branching structures
• Spoon-shaped overhangs
• Flower-like blooms
• Stick-like protrusions

—all explained as natural erosion sculpting softer surrounding material away from harder cores or veins.This particular object strongly resembles a heavily discussed feature from a 2022 Curiosity Mastcam image (around Sol 3556), where a similar cylindrical/cone-shaped rock sparked online speculation (e.g., comparisons to a traffic cone, tube, or even rover debris). Discussions on forums like Reddit noted its hollow or buried appearance, but experts and NASA context attribute it to natural geology on an "alien world with a lot of strange" erosional shapes. Curiosity's drill produces powder, not solid cylinders, and no man-made debris matches this description.No official NASA identification labels this as artificial or anomalous—it's consistent with the rover's thousands of images showing wind-sculpted rocks in Gale Crater. If you'd like, I can help search for similar examples or the exact raw image source!

 

[terryforsythe]

Something that is definitely possible to find out.

Again relying on ChatGPT for this one, it states:

"Burial of rover artifacts on Mars by wind and sand is an extremely slow process, typically taking centuries to millennia. The thin Martian atmosphere means winds exert little force, so large objects are not buried quickly like they might be on Earth."

 

[terryforsythe]

If it is a geological formation, to me it seems like an extremely interesting one. I wonder why NASA did not send Curiosity over to it to check it out. If they did, I can't find where they said anything about it.

 

[xray]

Yeah, seems like the logical thing to do unless they have other information indicating it wasn't worth the effort.

 

[Taiga]

Perseverance is a long way from Curiosity. The closest man-made object to Curiosity, that we know of, is the InSight lander, which is 600km (373 miles) away.

According to ChatGPT, no Mars lander or rover is known to have flown over Curioisity's current location during landing. IF ChatGPT is correct, that rules those out.

EDIT: Here is a link to a map of Nasa's Mars landing sights: https://science.nasa.gov/resource/map-of-nasas-mars-landing-sites/

Yes, but according to well placed government sources, Curiosity was launched accompanied by a top secret companion rover:
bi-Curiosity. Apparently it brought along a toy.

 

[sam_adams]

It's either part of the MAVEN orbiter:

NASA's MAVEN spacecraft is still silent at Mars — and apparently is spinning, too

MAVEN's handlers haven't heard from the probe since Dec. 4.

www.space.com

or it's this.

 

[xray]

What are the chances of stumbling on to something from another mission on Mars? I can't even find my keys to the shed and I know it's somewhere in my house.

 

[sam_adams]

I can't even find my keys to the shed and I know it's somewhere in my house.

What is a shed doing inside your house?

 

[Sir Sanders Zingmore]

but it looks like it is partially buried

No it doesn’t. I don’t see that