All About UFO's

[Mart68]

In both cases (UAP and 'magic in audio') there will be no 'hard evidence' but lots of theories and speculation.

Nothing wrong with theory and speculation as long as no-one is pretending they are anything more than that.

I notice on this thread some people are assuming that if someone theorises or speculates then they must 'believe.' That's simply not the case. I'm highly sceptical but still happy to theorise and speculate about this subject.

Audio, less so, since we are dealing there with a much more constrained topic. I can accept there can be unknown unknowns about the nature of reality, but not about varying a voltage into a magnet to make a cone vibrate.

 

[AdrianusG]

It’s the same problem I have with a lot of these comments. You’re taking some known science, some hypotheticals and then making some completely unconnected assumptions about something else.

It’s like saying If we did prove multiple dimensions existed, then that means we would then suddenly know how to travel faster than the speed of light. It’s too simplistic a view of science and how stuff works.

Some here seem to understand actual science well and have clearly studied and or worked in a scientific role. Others are well versed in YouTube science. They are not the same thing.

True,

However... even the "real science" comes up short with a lot of answers "all things Universe related" It's age; Big Bang vs Black Hole Universe? (still under research!) the clumpy-ness Issue; the expansion rate issue; gravity, is it classic or Quantum? is it a force at all?
Then the "real science" regarding String Theory, did they find any proof of it being correct in what ?... 40 ish years, all the those extra dimensions that are needed to make it work?, i don't think so.
Dark Matter?; Dark energy? still under investigation, findings so far?
So what do we really know about our Universe?, doesn't sound like a lot to me.
I think at current we may be lucky if we "know" around 10% but wouldn't be surprised if it's less than that.

 

[Taiga]

My Doctor: You have a serious illness that requires major surgery and multiple treatment regimens.

Me: You doctors don’t know everything. You once thought leeches were a good idea. But science moves on. You don’t know how cranial white matter shapes our lives or how it came into existence. That’s why I rely on credentialed Youtube experts who can advise me based on their ideas of future medical advances.

My Doctor: But their revelations are derived from an unending expansion of theoretical possibilities, none of which have been verified or even realistically studied since we presently lack the knowledge and technology to adequately evaluate them.

Me: But they are not afraid to think outside of the box. To admit that they do not know what they do not know. They realize that there is more to science than we can even imagine. I don’t want to risk my life and the welfare of my family to the entrenched biased thinking of modern day physicians and researchers.

My Doctor: Well, for the benefit of your family, I suggest that you get your affairs in order.

Me: Don’t worry, there are highly credentialed Youtube leakers and Congressional sub-committees that can give me the secret insider information on that.

My Doctor: Please pay your bill in full before you leave the office.​

 

[Mart68]

That's just False Equivalence. But did remind me of this joke:

Man goes to the doctor.
Doctor gives him six months to live.
Man can't pay his bill
Doctor gives him another six months.

 

[Taiga]

That's just False Equivalence.

Either you accept that the scientific method, with all of its flaws and limitations, provides you with the best available evidence, or you don’t.

 

[Mart68]

Either you accept that the scientific method, with all of its flaws and limitations, provides you with the best available evidence, or you don’t.

I agree it does - I just don't think you can equate speculating about aliens or the nature of the universe with getting medical advice.

 

[PierreV]

True,

However... even the "real science" comes up short with a lot of answers "all things Universe related" It's age; Big Bang vs Black Hole Universe? (still under research!) the clumpy-ness Issue; the expansion rate issue; gravity, is it classic or Quantum? is it a force at all?
Then the "real science" regarding String Theory, did they find any proof of it being correct in what ?... 40 ish years, all the those extra dimensions that are needed to make it work?, i don't think so.
Dark Matter?; Dark energy? still under investigation, findings so far?
So what do we really know about our Universe?, doesn't sound like a lot to me.
I think at current we may be lucky if we "know" around 10% but wouldn't be surprised if it's less than that.

A few observations:

The fact that we are facing extremely complex questions and mysteries that we can't answer yet about the profound nature of the Universe is not a symptom of "real science" failure. In fact, it is the direct consequence of a few centuries of amazing "real science" successes.

Not all leaps of understanding necessarily redefine our practical/technological reality equally. Without Maxwell (and if no one else had replicated his work since), we would not have a "modern world". Without Einstein, our day to day reality wouldn't be as different. More imprecise, yes. Missing some features, definitely.

Assuming we end up having a unifying string theory that explains everything, we gain a full understanding of what dark matter and dark energy really are or whatever profound law we are missing they are the symptom of, it does not follow that interstellar/intergalactic travel will emerge just as it did not follow from Einstein's work that we developed cars travelling at relativistic speeds.

Knowledge will hopefully continue to increase. Invoking what we hypothetically don't know today to explain phenomenons we may or may not have experienced isn't different from the sapiens in his cave invoking gods when thunder struck.

 

[terryforsythe]

Humanity has been around between 100k and 300k years. Given the exponential rise in technology, I think it is entirely possible for humanity to make it to the stars sometime in the next 100k years if we do not first destroy ourselves. According to the Theory of Relativity, as relative speed increases, time slows down for the traveler. Yes, it takes incredible amounts of energy, but if the big bang theory and dark energy hypothesis are correct, there may be energy leaking into our universe. Can it be harnessed for space travel? Not with our present understanding of nature, but that does not mean it must be forever ruled out. Moreover, just as nuclear fission provided us vastly more energy density than previous technologies, will future discoveries enlighten us to even vastly greater energy density? Perhaps.

According to most cosmologists, our universe is around 13.8 billion years old, and our Milky Way galaxy is around 13.6 billion years. Life would not have started until space had been seeded with heavier elements by supernovae. Some estimates I have seen are that may have taken up to 4 billion years. That still leaves the possibility of other civilizations developing billions of years before ours. Can some of them be travelling between stars? I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility. That does not mean I think NHI is here, it just means that I don't rule out the possibility. There have been profound scientific and technological breakthroughs in just the last 200 years alone that have utterly changed humanity in ways completely unforeseen to those who lived before. What may come to us with another 100k years of technological advancement, or what may have come to civilizations far older than ours, is unknowable to us at this time. I respectfully disagree with the proposition that travel between stars will forever remain impossible, and that humanity knows enough about nature at this point in time to make it an absolutely certainty that it will never happen. To me, such statements sound more like religious dogma than science.

 

[terryforsythe]

I just came across this article, which discusses a study by physicist Rajendra Gupta claiming the universe is 26.7 billion years old and questioning the existance of dark matter and dark energy:

Study claims dark matter does not exist and the universe is 27 billion years old

A study from the University of Ottawa suggests we might not need dark matter or dark energy to explain the workings of the universe.

www.earth.com

If it isn't clear enough, there is so much about this universe we do not know that I find befuddling the absolute conviction that travel between the stars is forever impossible, especially coming from people with a scientific background.

 

[Sir Sanders Zingmore]

I just came across this article, which discusses a study by physicist Rajendra Gupta claiming the universe is 26.7 billion years old and questioning the existance of dark matter and dark energy:

Study claims dark matter does not exist and the universe is 27 billion years old

A study from the University of Ottawa suggests we might not need dark matter or dark energy to explain the workings of the universe.

www.earth.com

If it isn't clear enough, there is so much about this universe we do not know that I find befuddling the absolute conviction that travel between the stars is forever impossible, especially coming from people with a scientific background.

There is so much about power cables we do not know that I find befuddling the absolute conviction that power cables can't make a difference, especially coming from people with a scientific background.

 

[terryforsythe]

There is so much about power cables we do not know that I find befuddling the absolute conviction that power cables can't make a difference, especially coming from people with a scientific background.

At least with cables you can perform blind testing to confirm whether they truly make an audible difference. I don't know of a way to test whether inerstellar travel is out of the realm of possibility.

 

[Sir Sanders Zingmore]

At least with cables you can perform blind testing to confirm whether they truly make an audible difference. I don't know of a way to test whether inerstellar travel is out of the realm of possibility.

fair point, that proves little green men are real... I'm convinced

 

[terryforsythe]

fair point, that proves little green men are real... I'm convinced

Somewhere among the vastness of the universe, perhaps. I'm still not convinced NHI is here, nor am I convinced that it is not, but I have my doubts.

 

[Audiofire]

I don't think boldface (or extra line-spacing) adds veracity to your post (nice try perhaps). But I can see more of your habitual credentials fallacy in play. As to your proposition, yes the interviewer is crazy/lying, to promote his infotainment channel obviously (we can directly compare to the great subjective audio story-tellers in this case) and the subject is indulging us with his avuncular confabulation.

Oh, and you're immune to the veracity caveat as well as the credentials fallacy. Avuncular confabulation is habitual in this thread anyway. Well, I tolerated the whole video, and hope that "highly credible person" is barking up the wrong tree.

 

[Sir Sanders Zingmore]

Somewhere among the vastness of the universe, perhaps. I'm still not convinced NHI is here, nor am I convinced that it is not, but I have my doubts.

NHI?

 

[voodooless]

NHI?

Dolphins…

 

[Sir Sanders Zingmore]

Dolphins…

So long and thanks for all the fish

 

[terryforsythe]

NHI?

From the 2024 UAP Disclosure Act (not enacted into law):

(13) Non-human intelligence.--The term ``non-human
intelligence'' means any sentient intelligent non-human
lifeform regardless of nature or ultimate origin that may be
presumed responsible for unidentified anomalous phenomena or
of which the Federal Government has become aware.

https://www.congress.gov/amendment/118th-congress/senate-amendment/2610/text

 

[AdrianusG]

A few observations:

The fact that we are facing extremely complex questions and mysteries that we can't answer yet about the profound nature of the Universe is not a symptom of "real science" failure. In fact, it is the direct consequence of a few centuries of amazing "real science" successes.

Not all leaps of understanding necessarily redefine our practical/technological reality equally. Without Maxwell (and if no one else had replicated his work since), we would not have a "modern world". Without Einstein, our day to day reality wouldn't be as different. More imprecise, yes. Missing some features, definitely.

Assuming we end up having a unifying string theory that explains everything, we gain a full understanding of what dark matter and dark energy really are or whatever profound law we are missing they are the symptom of, it does not follow that interstellar/intergalactic travel will emerge just as it did not follow from Einstein's work that we developed cars travelling at relativistic speeds.

Knowledge will hopefully continue to increase. Invoking what we hypothetically don't know today to explain phenomenons we may or may not have experienced isn't different from the sapiens in his cave invoking gods when thunder struck.

This wasn't a "Rant" against real science, quite the opposite, it's the only thing we have to figure out the Universe, i just meant to say that we (still) know almost nothing really for sure, so that means we don't know for sure if FTL is possible or not, we currently lack the knowledge, (about a lot of things) and may never know.

 

[Petrushka]

This wasn't a "Rant" against real science, quite the opposite, it's the only thing we have to figure out the Universe, i just meant to say that we (still) know almost nothing really for sure, so that means we don't know for sure if FTL is possible or not, we currently lack the knowledge, (about a lot of things) and may never know.

We had positive indicators of relativity and quantum phenomena long before they were understood, they permeate our everyday existence.

We have no indications of FTL.