Alec Baldwin shooting: Lawyer suggests potential sabotage on ‘Rust’ set.

[Justdafactsmaam]

This guy's only business is to supply guns and ammo for movies. His excuse for also having live rounds is what I mentioned: practice sessions offsite. I don't think that is enough value to have him mix live rounds with the rest of his props. The guy's shop by the way, resembled a hoarder's place. Can't believe someone with such responsibility keeping his warehouse and office in such shambles.

Yeah, good points.

 

[Petrushka]

Some parting thoughts: this is a poster child for a case dismissed on technicalities. It will not help in civil liability cases to come.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I mean check out this picture:

How the heck does one trust this person to keep track of what is live and what is not?

If I am in that business at a minimum all live ammo and all non-live ammo are in separate rooms. They also in some manner get obviously different colored boxes and ammo cans.

 

[NTK]

Some parting thoughts: this is a poster child for a case dismissed on technicalities. It will not help in civil liability cases to come.

Family of the deceased victim has settled with Baldwin.

Alec Baldwin reaches settlement over Halyna Hutchins shooting on Rust set

Filming of Rust will resume in January, with Hutchins' husband on board as executive producer.

www.bbc.com

 

[Justdafactsmaam]

Some parting thoughts: this is a poster child for a case dismissed on technicalities. It will not help in civil liability cases to come.

The civil case is already settled. So technically you are right. It didn’t help

 

[Petrushka]

The civil case is already settled. So technically you are right. It didn’t help

Baldwin settled. There could be other civil suits. Yes or no?

 

[Justdafactsmaam]

Baldwin settled. There could be other civil suits. Yes or no?

I’m going to speculate. No. The claimant now has a financial interest in the movie. So any further lawsuits against deep pockets would in effect suing themselves. I doubt there will be any civil suits against those with shallow pockets. Even a win will be a net loss.

 

[Rja4000]

This business of having live rounds on set seems to be at the core of this tragedy.

Well, the very root cause is probably to use weapons able to actually fire live rounds, to begin with.
Using only fake or demilitarized weapons on a set seems a basic safety rule to me.

 

[amirm]

Speaking of that, it was an Italian company that made the revolver! They actually flew the owner/designer to the trial to no effect. He testified that he made the gun in 2017 and that it was all certified and great at that time. The gun was actually made for a trade show exhibition. After 20 minutes on stand on behalf of the prosecutor who likely paid all of his expenses to testify, defense just asked, "you don't know what has happened to the gun since 2018, right?" He answered affirmative! Seeing how the incident was in 2021, the whole thing was useless especially since FBI impact test caused a key part to break apart.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Obviously way over the top was John Wick 4. Here in this short video about making the fight scenes, watch between 7.16 and about the 10 minute mark. Seems a safer way to do it, and lord knows they had lots of prop guns to keep up with. They used solid plugged guns and added effects in post processing. If the Rust armorer had been on this set I guess about 1000 people would have died.

 

[Audio Science Pal]

They were warned by FBI that doing an accidental discharge test could render the gun damaged and they still went through with it. And of course the trigger was broken in half

I am curious how that part broke during testing. I did a web search which just tells me that he pulled the trigger, or he didn't pull the trigger. Is there a link to some technical information about the broken part?

 

[Petrushka]

I am curious how that part broke during testing. I did a web search which just tells me that he pulled the trigger, or he didn't pull the trigger. Is there a link to some technical information about the broken part?

The gold standard for safe guns is that they can’t discharge if dropped. I don’t have any idea how to test that scientifically. But it would rule out the possibility if it firing in your hand without a trigger pull.

 

[amirm]

I am curious how that part broke during testing. I did a web search which just tells me that he pulled the trigger, or he didn't pull the trigger. Is there a link to some technical information about the broken part?

I don't know exactly but got the idea that the secure the gun and then a controlled weight hits it. I found this online:

The FBI was told to go ahead, and tested the revolver by striking it from several angles with a rawhide mallet. One of those strikes caused the gun to break into three pieces.

 

[Petrushka]

I don't know exactly but got the idea that the secure the gun and then a controlled weight hits it. I found this online:

The FBI was told to go ahead, and tested the revolver by striking it from several angles with a rawhide mallet. One of those strikes caused the gun to break into three pieces.

I cannot imagine that happening with a Colt or S&W.

 

[Sal1950]

I don't know exactly but got the idea that the secure the gun and then a controlled weight hits it. I found this online:

The FBI was told to go ahead, and tested the revolver by striking it from several angles with a rawhide mallet. One of those strikes caused the gun to break into three pieces.

How does beating on the hammer with a mallet have anything to do with liability in this case.
Someone brought live ammo on site, someone put it in a fully functional handgun, Baldwin pointed and pulled the trigger and the weapon did exactly what it was supposed to do. I've never seen a worse case of mis-direction in my life. It's no wonder our legal system is in such a mess..

 

[Petrushka]

How does beating on the hammer with a mallet have anything to do with liability in this case.
Someone brought live ammo on site, someone put it in a fully functional handgun, Baldwin pointed and pulled the trigger and the weapon did exactly what it was supposed to do. I've never seen a worse case of mis-direction in my life. It's no wonder our legal system is in such a mess..

He denied pulling the trigger.

 

[Doodski]

How does beating on the hammer with a mallet have anything to do with liability in this case.
Someone brought live ammo on site, someone put it in a fully functional handgun, Baldwin pointed and pulled the trigger and the weapon did exactly what it was supposed to do. I've never seen a worse case of mis-direction in my life. It's no wonder our legal system is in such a mess..

Apparently they wanted to try and cause a misfire?

 

[Sal1950]

He denied pulling the trigger.

Sure, it went off all by itself.
Typical, try to find a way to blame the weapon instead of the humans who made a bunch of bad decisions.
This is a single action revolver, you first have to manually cock the hammer to before it will shoot.
You can pull that trigger till the cows come home and it will never fire until after you cock it.
Something you never do until just before the moment you intend to shoot it, the trigger can be very touchy then with a pull weight between 2 & 5 lbs, what some would call a "hair trigger". It is a very dangerous condition and anyone who's handled guns knows that.
"Baldwin, 66, said he cocked the reproduction 1873 Single Action Army pistol before it fired a live round that killed the rising-star cinematographer and wounded director Joel Souza."
I'm not saying Baldwin is liable. Unless he intended to kill the victim and put the live round in the gun himself, he was only playing his part.
Just don't blame the gun for doing what it's designed to do, and never should have been there in the first place.

 

[Justdafactsmaam]

Sure, it went off all by itself.
Typical, try to find a way to blame the weapon instead of the humans who made a bunch of bad decisions.
This is a single action revolver, you first have to manually cock the hammer to before it will shoot.
You can pull that trigger till the cows come home and it will never fire until after you cock it.
Something you never do until just before the moment you intend to shoot it, the trigger can be very touchy then with a pull weight between 2 & 5 lbs, what some would call a "hair trigger". It is a very dangerous condition and anyone who's handled guns knows that.
"Baldwin, 66, said he cocked the reproduction 1873 Single Action Army pistol before it fired a live round that killed the rising-star cinematographer and wounded director Joel Souza."
I'm not saying Baldwin is liable. Unless he intended to kill the victim and put the live round in the gun himself, he was only playing his part.
Just don't blame the gun for doing what it's designed to do, and never should have been there in the first place.

It’s very simple. If the gun has a “hair trigger” it is entirely possible for someone to activate it without deliberately pulling the trigger

 

[Petrushka]

It’s very simple. If the gun has a “hair trigger” it is entirely possible for someone to activate it without deliberately pulling the trigger

“Deliberately”.

I know personally of two instances of someone accidentally pulling the trigger. A hair trigger does not pull itself, even if the gun is dropped.