AKG K712 Pro Review (Headphone)

[staticV3]

I saw that AKG K712 can reach 100/100 score with EQ with Oratory EQ.

*Sigh*

Every headphone can achieve 100/100 score with EQ.

If you see an EQ preset with just 94/100 or something, then that does not necessarily mean that the headphone is bad, or worse than ones with 100/100.

It just means that oratory didn't see any point in optimizing the EQ preset further.

 

[MadaCrow]

*Sigh*

Every headphone can achieve 100/100 score with EQ.

If you see an EQ preset with just 94/100 or something, then that does not necessarily mean that the headphone is bad, or worse than ones with 100/100.

It just means that oratory didn't see any point in optimizing the EQ preset further.

I see, didn't had too much experience with EQing the headphones. Thank you for clarification, thought it was like a perfect score for Harman target.

 

[Kremmen]

@dante21 you could call the K712 warm, but tbh it just sounds bad. Not even EQ can save this headphone imo. An HE400se or a used HD600 would be much better purchases.

I completely agree with what you say about the HE400SE. I laid out 6 of the best of my 20+ headphones to compare the other day (for a bit of fun) and to my mind the least impressive of the lot were my K712 Pro, which were easily bettered by the HE400SE (£69 new on Amazon recently) and unsurprisingly my Hifiman Edition XS (£350 when new 2 years ago and my overall favourite headphone, now I've changed the itchy pads), but that's not a fair comparison. I was comparing some of my open-back headphones BTW.

I have tried various EQ settings I have found on the net (and in the excellent Wavelet app) with my K712 but nothing really seems to elevate them to a level that justifies the price.

I paid £181 new for the K712 about 5 years ago and at the time I did appreciate their spacial qualities, hence the purchase, but I have that and more now with even the HE400SE, without EQ! The K712 Pro currently sell for around £230 on Amazon UK. Too much!

The K712 Pro are easily bettered by my K371 too, but that is of course closed-back. They look nice on the shelf with all my others though, and I occasionally put them on for a few hours for old time's sake. I don't think they're a bad headphone by any means, just bettered by others that are cheaper.

 

[Robbo99999]

From what I read there is no new/old version of HD 560s, only difference being shorter/longer cable. I used this as my EQ Sennheiser HD560S. I had AKG K371 and I absolutely hated them, maybe harman target isn't for me because I'm very treble sensetive especially on the range of 8Khz-11Khz. (Which is why I had troubles with something like Fidellio X2HR). I saw that AKG K712 can reach 100/100 score with EQ with Oratory EQ.

It depends who you talk to re if they think there is such a thing as a New Version HD560s. The measurements that me & Solderdude have done show that there is a trend difference between New Version & Old Version. I've measured 5 units, and Solderdude has measured about the same number of units, maybe a few more, and we both see the trend that New Version is a darker headphone than the Old Version.

Following is the link to the measurements I did showing a difference between Old & New Version:

New version of Sennheiser HD 560S (!)

I should have said 'I perceived distortion', which could mean snything, or nothing. Thanks for taking measurements. Do you still have the "new version" HD560s? If you're a Harman fan you could reverse engineer the measured changes that solderdude has noted. In other words, you'd use an...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Following is the link to the measurements Solderdude did showing a difference between Old & New Version:

New version of Sennheiser HD 560S (!)

All used. That throws a bit of a spanner in the works in terms of reliability due to pad wear when viewed without further qualification, because every single one of my measurements I've shown on here for all my HD560s have been with new fresh pads (apart from my Unit 1 Old Version, but I've...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Depending on if you have the New Version or Old Version HD560s then it's possible the Oratory EQ will not be totally optimal for your unit. If you've got the New Version then you might want to try my New Version EQ which you can find in that thread I linked. Either way, in terms of getting back to your original point you brought up I think if you already have the New Version HD560s then I think at stock then that would be optimal for voice work (if you're after balanced tonality in voices & indeed overall) or using my New Version Harman EQ that I've just mentioned.

 

[Robbo99999]

I completely agree with what you say about the HE400SE. I laid out 6 of the best of my 20+ headphones to compare the other day (for a bit of fun) and to my mind the least impressive of the lot were my K712 Pro, which were easily bettered by the HE400SE (£69 new on Amazon recently) and unsurprisingly my Hifiman Edition XS (£350 when new 2 years ago and my overall favourite headphone, now I've changed the itchy pads), but that's not a fair comparison. I was comparing some of my open-back headphones BTW.

I have tried various EQ settings I have found on the net (and in the excellent Wavelet app) with my K712 but nothing really seems to elevate them to a level that justifies the price.

I paid £181 new for the K712 about 5 years ago and at the time I did appreciate their spacial qualities, hence the purchase, but I have that and more now with even the HE400SE, without EQ! The K712 Pro currently sell for around £230 on Amazon UK. Too much!

The K712 Pro are easily bettered by my K371 too, but that is of course closed-back. They look nice on the shelf with all my others though, and I occasionally put them on for a few hours for old time's sake. I don't think they're a bad headphone by any means, just bettered by others that are cheaper.

Yep, I recently bought the HE400SE for £69 whilst it was on sale, with the Oratory EQ they're close to perfect on my unit, tonality is excellent (I did make some small changes in the treble above 4kHz but it's an EQ based on Oratory's measurement). In terms of the "voice work" discussions we've been having recently in this thread I'll just add that I think Oratory EQ'd HE400SE would be fantastic for that if you're after accurate tonality on voices.

EDIT: HE400SE is probably most balanced tonality after Oratory EQ that I've ever experienced in comparison to my other headphones after initial Oratory EQ. I found also that Hifiman HE4XX was also very good tonality after Oratory EQ - maybe there's something about Hifiman and Oratory EQ's that is meshing very well together. Maybe the Hifiman's are low unit to unit variation, maybe there's not much on-head variation with these models when worn by different people, maybe there's something else intangible re Hifiman's combined with Oratory EQ's, but they've needed the least tweaking after Oratory EQ than all my other headphones to get to their best point.

 

[MadaCrow]

It depends who you talk to re if they think there is such a thing as a New Version HD560s. The measurements that me & Solderdude have done show that there is a trend difference between New Version & Old Version. I've measured 5 units, and Solderdude has measured about the same number of units, maybe a few more, and we both see the trend that New Version is a darker headphone than the Old Version.

Following is the link to the measurements I did showing a difference between Old & New Version:

New version of Sennheiser HD 560S (!)

I should have said 'I perceived distortion', which could mean snything, or nothing. Thanks for taking measurements. Do you still have the "new version" HD560s? If you're a Harman fan you could reverse engineer the measured changes that solderdude has noted. In other words, you'd use an...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Following is the link to the measurements Solderdude did showing a difference between Old & New Version:

New version of Sennheiser HD 560S (!)

All used. That throws a bit of a spanner in the works in terms of reliability due to pad wear when viewed without further qualification, because every single one of my measurements I've shown on here for all my HD560s have been with new fresh pads (apart from my Unit 1 Old Version, but I've...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Depending on if you have the New Version or Old Version HD560s then it's possible the Oratory EQ will not be totally optimal for your unit. If you've got the New Version then you might want to try my New Version EQ which you can find in that thread I linked. Either way, in terms of getting back to your original point you brought up I think if you already have the New Version HD560s then I think at stock then that would be optimal for voice work (if you're after balanced tonality in voices & indeed overall) or using my New Version Harman EQ that I've just mentioned.

I used my info from HD 560s dropbox page
Oratory said there

There is no difference in acoustics. I have measured 18 units so far and could not observe any trend before/after 2022.

I can see slight variation on your tests, that's true. I brought mine from almost year ago but mine has a 3m cable so must be old edition. For me the comfort of them, plastic feel of a toy is huge issue. I never had more comfort in any headphone like in akg k240 mkII mostly because of headband. I am also checking Moondrop Para but I had issues in the past with moondrop products being prone to breaking quickly and investing 350$ for me isn't cheap

 

[MadaCrow]

Yep, I recently bought the HE400SE for £69 whilst it was on sale, with the Oratory EQ they're close to perfect on my unit, tonality is excellent (I did make some small changes in the treble above 4kHz but it's an EQ based on Oratory's measurement). In terms of the "voice work" discussions we've been having recently in this thread I'll just add that I think Oratory EQ'd HE400SE would be fantastic for that if you're after accurate tonality on voices.

EDIT: HE400SE is probably most balanced tonality after Oratory EQ that I've ever experienced in comparison to my other headphones after initial Oratory EQ. I found also that Hifiman HE4XX was also very good tonality after Oratory EQ - maybe there's something about Hifiman and Oratory EQ's that is meshing very well together. Maybe the Hifiman's are low unit to unit variation, maybe there's not much on-head variation with these models when worn by different people, maybe there's something else intangible re Hifiman's combined with Oratory EQ's, but they've needed the least tweaking after Oratory EQ than all my other headphones to get to their best point.

So far I tested akg 240 mk ii, fidellio x2hr, akg k371, ATH-M50x, phillips shp9500, beyer dt770, sennheiser hd 599. I mostly weren't picking hifiman because of rtings score in the past. I kinda test IEF neutral with bass. I'm not that knowledgeable but comfort is important for me and precise working on sibilance regions, imagining, and wide soundstage.
Quote from rtings about HE400SE

The low treble is recessed, which veils vocals and lead instruments.

But ofc they haven't tried to EQ. I used Peace and mostly AutoEQ from there.

 

[Robbo99999]

So far I tested akg 240 mk ii, fidellio x2hr, akg k371, ATH-M50x, phillips shp9500, beyer dt770, sennheiser hd 599. I mostly weren't picking hifiman because of rtings score in the past. I kinda test IEF neutral with bass. I'm not that knowledgeable but comfort is important for me and precise working on sibilance regions, imagining, and wide soundstage.
Quote from rtings about HE400SE

But ofc they haven't tried to EQ. I used Peace and mostly AutoEQ from there.

Anyway, I've given you my opinion on what headphones I think would be applicable for you for "voice work" if you're after balanced tonality in the voice, so I'll leave it there.

 

[HammersRocco]

This is weird - I think I noticed somewhere else too, but the k712 Pro seems to be way more expensive from American sources

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/970888-REG/akg_2458z00140_k712_pro_hi_performance_headphones.html

AKG K712 PRO Open-Back Over-Ear Mastering Referencing Headphones | Guitar Center

Shop for the AKG K712 PRO Open-Back Over-Ear Mastering Referencing Headphones in and receive free shipping and guaranteed lowest price.

www.guitarcenter.com

Noticed they are discounted from $659 which was the price (no discounts) the last time I checked, when I got the k712 Pro from Thomann at around $260, I think, quite sometime ago.... No wonder they are discounting... do they even check? weird.

Ah well, do apologize if comment is stupid, just curious...

[edit - ordered Feb 2020, 220 Euros, Price at Guitar Center and another source, thinking here in L.A. was indeed $659 as per my notes]

 

[Dazerdoreal]

*Sigh*

Every headphone can achieve 100/100 score with EQ.

If you see an EQ preset with just 94/100 or something, then that does not necessarily mean that the headphone is bad, or worse than ones with 100/100.

It just means that oratory didn't see any point in optimizing the EQ preset further.

Ackchyually

There are fringe cases though. You are likely correct when the number is 94, but
- Sometimes perfect EQ it is not possible because of technical limits. (it is not possible to EQ this 4k dip)
- Or because the distortion would be too high
- Or because unit variation/HRTF variation is so high that precise corrections do not make sense

If a headphone does not reach at least about 90 with Oratorys EQ, it might indicate to something to worry about. (You knew that anyway but maybe not the people you adressed.)

 

[Robbo99999]

This is weird - I think I noticed somewhere else too, but the k712 Pro seems to be way more expensive from American sources

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/970888-REG/akg_2458z00140_k712_pro_hi_performance_headphones.html

AKG K712 PRO Open-Back Over-Ear Mastering Referencing Headphones | Guitar Center

Shop for the AKG K712 PRO Open-Back Over-Ear Mastering Referencing Headphones in and receive free shipping and guaranteed lowest price.

www.guitarcenter.com

Noticed they are discounted from $659 which was the price (no discounts) the last time I checked, when I got the k712 Pro from Thomann at around $260, I think, quite sometime ago.... No wonder they are discounting... do they even check? weird.

Ah well, do apologize if comment is stupid, just curious...

[edit - ordered Feb 2020, 220 Euros, Price at Guitar Center and another source, thinking here in L.A. was indeed $659 as per my notes]

For some reason AKG seems really expensive in USA, same is true of K702 when comparing prices of UK/Europe vs USA.

 

[HammersRocco]

For some reason AKG seems really expensive in USA, same is true of K702 when comparing prices of UK/Europe vs USA.

Yeah - would really love to ask AKG - To be truthful, at the time, I thought I was taking advantage of a mistake when I got them from Thomann...

 

[solderdude]

These headphones (all the similar looking models) have a few common failures.
The elastic bands after a few years loose elasticity and the 'auto-height adjustment' thus won't work well.
Another common failure is solder joints breaking loose (poor soldering).
With one of them the headband fell apart (the leather came loose from the plastic inside).

Otherwise they seem quite durable.
There is not much 'neutral' about those headphones.
The K712 (and K7XX) are certainly much less 'forward/clear'' than K701/K702/K602/K612

 

[staticV3]

Yet the sound neutrality seems pretty impressive.

In no meaningful metric is the K712Pro neutral or even remotely reference.

I rarely listen to mine, even with EQ, and certainly would not take them with me when travelling.

 

[Van_Flowne]

Just wanted to add that I believe there is a perceivable difference when you do the K712 balanced mod to these. Be it more power, maybe placebo... but they definitely changed in sound to my ears.

Only Placebo

 

[Ufasas]

Waiting for them to arrive from Japan, says Made In Slovakia too, got for £111, a bargain, some k702s are running for 115.- here online, i had it before, i liked them for competitive gaming, they were awesome with Fiio K7, but dissapointing for music, quite shallow, and i hate using EQ, hah. Will be interesting to pair k712 them with Fiio K13 r2r or K7

 

[Van_Flowne]

Just wanted to add that I believe there is a perceivable difference when you do the K712 balanced mod to these. Be it more power, maybe placebo... but they definitely changed in sound to my ears.

The quality is the same. What you might notice is a significant improvement in headphone performance if you use a high-power, fully balanced headphone amplifier in High Gain Output mode, like a Topping A70 Pro. You'll then feel a greater impact, as these headphones need a dedicated headphone amplifier to be driven properly. I also have these AKG headphones with balanced amplifiers. They don't perform at their best through my old Pioneer Reference A770 MkII amplifier from 1990. I personally recommend EQ tuned to the correct curve using DSP for these great headphones.

 

[bequietjk]

I really miss my 712's. When they are driven properly I don't think i've ever heard rock music sound so much fun like on these cans.