AKG K371 vs FiiO FT1

[isostasy]

To throw a spanner in, I think the Adam H200 looks promising (construction and FR wise)

Not sure what's happened to Cammy I can't find their squig.link to compare the above with other headphones on their rig.

 

[staticV3]

To throw a spanner in, I think the Adam H200 looks promising (construction and FR wise)

Not sure what's happened to Cammy I can't find their squig.link to compare the above with other headphones on their rig.

Massive fit variability:

Source

 

[markanini]

Massive fit variability:
View attachment 448672
Source

It's prudent to qualify: Compared to what on which rig? Note that closed backs have increased fit variability vs open backs. Each type of design has inherent systemic advantages and disadvantages. More needs to be known before making a meaningful judgement.

 

[petebone]

Yes they are as they can be repeated with the same results.
That's the definition of science.




Maybe you are not a Harman person and that's fine. I like harman curve as I usually like the headphones which measure well on this target.
The HD560S was too shooty (treble peaking is obvious to the ears) and you can see this or these treble peak(s) on measurements made by Amir, DIYaudioheaven, Crinacle or Oratory.

I don't think that is for no reason that these famous reviewers use the harman target.

You keep thinking that you are making some scientific argument based on measurements that someone at some point has deemed as ideal. If we want to use science, then everyone's ears should hear things exactly in the same way, correct? That isn't the case so you making some argument that certain headphones and IEMs are "unbearable" to listen to for everyone is plain incorrect.

 

[FTB]

You keep thinking that you are making some scientific argument based on measurements that someone at some point has deemed as ideal. If we want to use science, then everyone's ears should hear things exactly in the same way, correct? That isn't the case so you making some argument that certain headphones and IEMs are "unbearable" to listen to for everyone is plain incorrect.

I am not making myself scientific argument as I am not the author of the work we talk about.

The Harman curve from Dr Sean Olive is, in fact, a preference curve but made with a scientific method : a large panel of people from different countries, age, gender... who determined with several iterations that can be repeated their preference curve.

Is it not about "one person" liking more this curve : two third of the population like it.
Sean Olive describe the other cases in this PDF (women, elder have different tastes) : https://danishsoundcluster.dk/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Olive_DSD_2022.pdf

There are some limitations about this curve (in the pdf again) but it is the first very good start we have about measuring headphones, like Floyd Tool made in the eighties for speakers.

Denying this is obscurantism.

What I agree with you is the uselessness of the curves made by one and only headphones or IEM reviewer. That's not the case for harman.

 

[FTB]

RTings released their review of the Fiio FT1 :

FIIO FT1 Review

FIIO has made a name for itself as a competitively priced audio enthusiast company with products that fill niches like standalone portable audio players, headpho...

www.rtings.com

They use their own preference curve so the results are of course different from Oratory's measurements made with harman.

We can still see the bloated bass around 100 Hz (like the ATH-M50x) and some peaking around 5-8 kHz.

It is hard to compare with the K371 they also measured as their review tool changed over time, v1.5 for the AKG and v2.0 for the Fiio.

By the way it is the Fiio FT3 (350 ohms version) which look very cool if you like harman target :

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Pretty enough bass for open headphones and globally very good compliance with the target. The K371 still has this big dip at 4 kHz.

 

[audio1200]

RTings released their review of the Fiio FT1 :

FIIO FT1 Review

FIIO has made a name for itself as a competitively priced audio enthusiast company with products that fill niches like standalone portable audio players, headpho...

www.rtings.com

They use their own preference curve so the results are of course different from Oratory's measurements made with harman.

We can still see the bloated bass around 100 Hz (like the ATH-M50x) and some peaking around 5-8 kHz.

It is hard to compare with the K371 they also measured as their review tool changed over time, v1.5 for the AKG and v2.0 for the Fiio.

By the way it is the Fiio FT3 (350 ohms version) which look very cool if you like harman target :

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Pretty enough bass for open headphones and globally very good compliance with the target. The K371 still has this big dip at 4 kHz.

8.0 score for the bass is too much, it has bloated bass like a gaming headset, its not controlled bass like k371.

 

[Pictus]

8.0 score for the bass is too much, it has bloated bass like a gaming headset, its not controlled bass like k371.

EQ is our friend, Oratory EQ and measurements.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

 

[audio1200]

EQ is our friend, Oratory EQ and measurements.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

k371 doesn't need eq, this is why even with issues no closed back comes close to it. it's lightweight (fiio is 350g), confortable and sounds just right

 

[markanini]

EQ is our friend, Oratory EQ and measurements.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

EQ is useful, but not a possibility for every setup. Sometimes elevated bass is used to cover up treble issues, which will be worse when the bass is corrected with EQ.

 

[audio1200]

EQ is useful, but not a possibility for every setup. Sometimes elevated bass is used to cover up treble issues, which will be worse when the bass is corrected with EQ.

the elevated bass definitively covers that 6khz peak, so you'll want to eq that as well. using full oratory profile without tweaks is not ideal.
to make it sound good with eq it takes a lot of trial and error and it's not trivial

 

[FTB]

EQ is not always possible, e.g. portable use with smartphone and a streaming service like Spotify or apple music.
The built-in android EQ isn't really one.
The k371 still sound good without EQ, that's why I find these headphones interesting...

Whatever some people will say measurements are bullshit and frequency response doesn't matter.

 

[FTB]

Hi,

Still curious about headphones although the K371 fits me, I tried some other models in direct comparison.

Please note that's only subjective testing from a person who likes Harman curve and find Amir or Oratory measurements usually following what I hear.

First the Shure SRH840A that looks close enough to the target :

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

And the best selling bluetooth headphones JBL Tune 770NC, measurements showed here :

190270553 10226369381962348 8155885728781037691 n — Postimages

postimg.cc

These two in similar price of the K371 (120 to 150 €).

First about build quality, the Shure is a bit cheap with a lot of plastic. Thick plastic but no aluminum parts like the K371.
The JBL is VERY cheap, light and fragile plastic. I find it indecent at the original price of 120 € but the price is now 70 €, it feels good that way.

The Shure has a good bass level but the sub-bass are low and a bit masked, not as present as the K371. It's more upper bass.
Midrange is fine, warm. What hurts is the elevated treble, cymbals are sharp and metallic. We can see on the measurements that the treble level is well above the 1 kHz level, it's audible and fatiguing.

The JBL (connected with jack cable or bluetooth) is really too boomy like seen on the curve.
It masks everything and the sound is globally congested. A bit of sharpness in the treble make it loudness tuned or "V shape". It seems the K371 has really the right amount of bass with clean extension to sub-bass.

Globally this JBL isn't attractive compared to the neutrality of the K371, the Shure neither. K371 sounds more open than the JBL and softer than the Shure.

I'm waiting for the Fiio FT1 arriving in the next few days. I wonder if my impressions will follow the measurements that's to say boomy, mids peak and recessed treble.

So still going with the K371...

Although a lot of people meets problem with the K371 build quality, I can tell the JBL and Shure are not better here.
I personally have no problem with the AKG, the originals pads last 3 years, there is identical replacement pads available (like these ones https://shorturl.at/uJ9a7 ) and short cable changed once.

We're lucky with this AKG model... It seems there is nothing to found elsewhere in a reasonable price range.

 

[FTB]

I received the FT1.

I'm not sure about build quality. The cable is too thick, stiff and microphonic.
The wooden cups are not damped, when you tap these it resonates.

It surely looks good but that's not what we care about for audio stuff.

It's too warm and bass heavy, bloating bass masking the rest of the spectrum. On "I wish"/Stevie Wonder (a track that is well recorded imho), the snare is very muffled.

Strangely the cymbals feel "detached" from the rest of the spectrum, too high level, it "plays alone". I don't know if it comes from the 5k peak we can see on Oratory measurements as the sound of cymbals starts about 5k and more. Or the peak at 15k if I still ear this frequency...

As the Shure above it gives a V signature so the mids, what we are the more sensitive to, are too much laidback.
These headphones sound pretty hollow, it has a bit of the "cavern" sound like, lacking presence.

I don't believe the hype, the AKG are better if you like the Harman curve, more neutral.

 

[markanini]

I received the FT1.

I'm not sure about build quality. The cable is too thick, stiff and microphonic.
The wooden cups are not damped, when you tap these it resonates.

It surely looks good but that's not what we care about for audio stuff.

It's too warm and bass heavy, bloating bass masking the rest of the spectrum. On "I wish"/Stevie Wonder (a track that is well recorded imho), the snare is very muffled.

Strangely the cymbals feel "detached" from the rest of the spectrum, too high level, it "plays alone". I don't know if it comes from the 5k peak we can see on Oratory measurements as the sound of cymbals starts about 5k and more. Or the peak at 15k if I still ear this frequency...

As the Shure above it gives a V signature so the mids, what we are the more sensitive to, are too much laidback.
These headphones sound pretty hollow, it has a bit of the "cavern" sound like, lacking presence.

I don't believe the hype, the AKG are better if you like the Harman curve, more neutral.

Thanks for your report. It seems the asking price of 160 USD is too high for FT1 high based on your description. At this price level I expect either good tuning or good build.

 

[staticV3]

It's too warm and bass heavy, bloating bass masking the rest of the spectrum.

That aligns well with 5128 frequency response data:


There, the FT1 shows ~4dB more mid bass.

 

[FTB]

Thanks for your report. It seems the asking price of 160 USD is too high for FT1 high based on your description. At this price level I expect either good tuning or good build.

Hi,

I think the headband and hinges are good quality, it's just the wooden cups that make me this impression as a bit light... maybe the wood isn't thick enough IDK, what is sure is it is not damped. The cable is surely good quality, it's just a bit stiff (and yes microphonic) when you need to move.

Then these are my subjective impressions knowing that the harman target fits me.

That aligns well with 5128 frequency response data:
View attachment 476544

There, the FT1 shows ~4dB more mid bass.

It's funny how we can never compare measurements from different sources

On the gadgetry tech squiglink, it's the K371 which has more bass.

Can you tell me where you got these curves ?

I made a test about these harsh cymbals on the FT1 by generating signals. I set up an average volume with a 1 kHz signal then I put a 15 kHz. I still can hear it at a good level. Nothing after 15,6 kHz.
So maybe it comes from this 15k peak that we see or not according to different measurements.

I'm not sure it can come from the peak around 5 kHz, it's a pretty low frequency for cymbals...

 

[staticV3]

Can you tell me where you got these curves ?

The K371 was measured by Listener: https://listener.squig.link/5128/?share=K371

The FT1 by Resolve: https://forum.headphones.com/t/fiio-ft1-measurements-discussion/24767

I then traced the graph from Resolve and uploaded the .csv to Listener's squig for easy comparison.

 

[Maxon]

My answer is pay more and get Denon AH-D5200. For easy to use get and keep seal, much less compression to FT1 and not being source impedance dependant (those will truly work good and from bad high self impedance anaemic source as integrated outs from most things). While neither is ideal Denon still does highs better and is less exaggerated in lows.

Why don't you recommend the HD800 right away? In my opinion, recommendations should be commensurate, and not just advise everyone what you have.

 

[ZolaIII]

Why don't you recommend the HD800 right away? In my opinion, recommendations should be commensurate, and not just advise everyone what you have.

Because I don't. Get Stelth if you can afford them. If I recommend something very similar regarding driver's (Foster paper one's) that is built great and fits good to almost anyone for not so much more money it's with a reason. Actually easiest recommendation regarding headphones ever, when you dig in seriously you will understand. To do so head to solderdude reviews (DIY Audio Heaven) and read carefully intro about fit and comfort at least cuple of times, then do it again.