Aimpire AD10: Fake Topping D10 DAC?

[thefsb]

Thank you for your advise! We have discussed such products, probably extracting IIS from HDMI and decoding it. Unfortunately, it failed to pass the discussion of our product team, so it suspended.

Hi Mr. Wong, IIS is not interesting. I'm interested in audio extraction from a video signal.

Your DAC device would pass-through video using one HDMI video input going to one HDMI audio output. The device extracts digital audio from the passed-thruough video. That extracted audio is fed to your DAC. I need this and I think I'm not alone.

At the moment I have one of these cheap switch/audio extractors with its optical audio output connected to a Topping D50s.

 

[TomB19]

Several others have complained of their Topping merchandise from Amazon being opened and scratched, prior to receiving it. All four of my Topping products had the box seals cut (ie: D30, P50, D50s, A50). None of these devices were scratched, however, so I'm not that worried about it.

Still, it's time to get Topping gear from a source other than Amazon.

 

[amirm]

Hi Mr. Wong, IIS is not interesting. I'm interested in audio extraction from a video signal.

That is what he means. The HDMI chipset separates the audio stream and sends it over I2S bus. It is not the external I2S interface that you see on some audio products.

 

[TomB19]

Your DAC device would pass-through video using one HDMI video input going to one HDMI audio output. The device extracts digital audio from the passed-thruough video. That extracted audio is fed to your DAC. I need this and I think I'm not alone.

There are lots of solutions for extracting digital audio from HDMI. I've never used one, though. Are the current devices insufficient or are you asking for one device to do more stuff to reduce component count and/or save money?

 

[amirm]

There are lots of solutions for extracting digital audio from HDMI. I've never used one, though. Are the current devices insufficient or are you asking for one device to do more stuff to reduce component count and/or save money?

If they extract audio at > 48 kHz sampling, they would be violating HDCP license agreement for transmission of digital audio without copy protection (which would be the case in an external S/PDIF or AES output). The enforcement is not strong though so if they do otherwise, they probably get away with it.

An internal implementation gets around this restriction since the transmission is not "user accessible bus."

 

[thefsb]

That is what he means. The HDMI chipset separates the audio stream and sends it over I2S bus. It is not the external I2S interface that you see on some audio products.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[thefsb]

There are lots of solutions for extracting digital audio from HDMI. I've never used one, though. Are the current devices insufficient or are you asking for one device to do more stuff to reduce component count and/or save money?

There aren't any attractive options that I have found. What are the options?

• A television set. Plug in the HDMI inputs and the TV's optical output goes to the DAC. Problem: I don't have and don't want a TV. I have a projector.
• An AV Receiver. They are horrible in a number of ways that I'd prefer not to enumerate if I don't need to.
• AV processor/preamp. Worse than AVRs except they exclude the crummy amp.
• Cheap no-brand switch extractors
  • I got through several of them. Some of them sometimes worked with some sources.
  • So I got a AVR but the SQ was crap.
  • So I got rid of the AVR and I got a decent stereo amp for music and this 3-port switch/extractor. It's connected to the Topping D50s optical input. It's a great little video source switch and the extraction works but I don't trust the audio. Maybe it doesn't matter for watching Rick and Morty but some movies have a good soundtrack (just watched The Childhood of a Leader with a fantastic soundtrack by Scott Walker) and I'd prefer to have a device that I know is practically transparent. Maybe I can buy one for Amir to measure and it will turn out to be good enough and the matter is settled. But I'd bet money it doesn't.
• Pro video gear is very expensive.
• https://www.essenceelectrostatic.com/product/evolve-ii-4k-hdmi-v2-0-7-1-channel-dac/ Is it good?

If, for example, Topping had a product like the D50s plus HDMI passthru...

 

[UCrazyKid]

I feel like I hit the lottery. I took a chance and ordered a D10 from Amazon Warehouse (returned products) and I received a like new true Topping D10! For $63! No signs of previous use besides the box being a bit roughed up. Topping box, Topping warranty card, measurement cards, correct spelling of “Direct Stream”, serial number barcode sticker in the side. I expect if I open it I will see “Topping” printed on the circuit board. . And delivered in 2 days with Amazon Prime.

 

[Veri]

I feel like I hit the lottery. I took a chance and ordered a D10 from Amazon Warehouse (returned products) and I received a like new true Topping D10! For $63! No signs of previous use besides the box being a bit roughed up. Topping box, Topping warranty card, measurement cards, correct spelling of “Direct Stream”, serial number barcode sticker in the side. I expect if I open it I will see “Topping” printed on the circuit board. . And delivered in 2 days with Amazon Prime.

A risky bet, but looks like it paid off

 

[fieldcar]

Several others have complained of their Topping merchandise from Amazon being opened and scratched, prior to receiving it. All four of my Topping products had the box seals cut (ie: D30, P50, D50s, A50). None of these devices were scratched, however, so I'm not that worried about it.

Still, it's time to get Topping gear from a source other than Amazon.

Correct, don't buy from amazon directly, but from authorized 3rd parties on amazon.

 

[Tidaliser]

I've fell for this and I'm not happy at all, in the UK it's listed as "Aimpire AD10 PC USB Amplifier, Music Receiver USB DAC CSS XMOS XU208 ES9018K2M OPA2134 Decoder Audio Amplifier (D10 Silver)"

I wanted another D10 for use in my car, to be honest I didn't pay much attention when ordering I saw (D10 silver) and thought it's a D10, reading reviews from other buyers from other countries (translated reviews to english) I then saw comments about this being a fake. The measurements are really bad for this, so annoyed because I've potentially got to risk going to the post office to return this i.e. risk in terms of the coronavirus.

If it doesn't sound as good as my Topping D10 it'll definitely be sent back and with a review on Amazon to warn others. It wouldn't be as bad if this was cheaper than a Topping D10 but it's exactly the same price and also is listed when you search Amazon for a "Topping D10".

It's also annoying because Amazon had this for delivery next Thursday but it's arriving today, so I've got no way to cancel the order. I would of thought Topping could complain to Amazon about someone selling inferior fake goods, I'm kind of shocked that Amazon is doing this / allowing this, this is the sort of thing you get on ebay - is that what Amazon is now ?

I could be wrong but I think this is against UK law, this better sound as good as my D10, otherwise I'm complaining to Amazon, UK trading standards, advertising standards agency and any other people that can get this s**t taken off Amazon.

 

[Tidaliser]

According to Amazon UK

Amazon Anti-Counterfeiting Policy
Products offered for sale on Amazon must be authentic. The sale of counterfeit products is strictly prohibited. Failure to abide by this policy may result in loss of selling privileges, funds being withheld and destruction of inventory in our possession.

Lets see if their policy is just words or has teeth,

 

[Tidaliser]

The Aimpire AD10 even has a D10 sticker on the side of it, wow talk about a slap in the face rip off, I've contacted Amazon about getting it removed, apparently I'll be contacted via email, I hope they do "destruction of inventory in our possession " !!!

I think I've managed to cancel the order before delivery, so hopefully I won't have to even use this junk.

 

[fieldcar]

The Aimpire AD10 even has a D10 sticker on the side of it, wow talk about a slap in the face rip off, I've contacted Amazon about getting it removed, apparently I'll be contacted via email, I hope they do "destruction of inventory in our possession " !!!

I think I've managed to cancel the order before delivery, so hopefully I won't have to even use this junk.

Good luck. Amazon's support gave me a tough time and they basically said "I see no problem here, but you can return it". I basically kept saying this is the exact definition a counterfeit, but they didn't care.

As for sound, if it arrives and you got it for cheap, it's not terrible, but I want a warranty and quality control. I would still return it and order it on the approved amazon sellers found earlier in this thread.

Good luck.

 

[Tidaliser]

Well I'm not having much luck, Amazon declined my review, got an email from someone at Amazon asking why I believed the Aimpire AD10 was a fake, I explained, nothing has happened so far, no reply, AD10 still available for purchase.
Contacted the supplier on Amazon and asked why they're selling fake items, the response was basically if you don't like the DAC then send it back.

Plus according to the Amazon supplier 'Junwer' they own both brands, perhaps they do ? not sure I can be bothered to battle this, I'll certainly be way more careful now when buying from Amazon.

I can't find a single supplier of a Topping D10 in the UK, shipping time for SHENZHEN AUDIO is many weeks, I'm not prepared to wait that long.

So I decided to order a SMSL Sanskrit 10th thinking that's a reasonable DAC, I'm likely going to send that back having spent many hours trying to get it to work with my Android phone, the D10 works perfectly with Android, plug it in and the audio just auto switches to the D10. The Sanskrit works fine with USB audio player pro, but I want to stream Amazon HD music which isn't supported by UAPP or likely to be seeing as according the extreamsd Amazon HD has no public API.

Looking at alternative DACs to the D10 I couldn't find any DACs of a similar price offering the same clean signal that the D10 does, annoying / frustrating...

Any how I've opted for some cheapo USB-C headphone DACs, thinking they'll probably be no worse than the AD10, at least 1 of the 2 I've ordered should hopefully work with my Android phone. If they sound ok I've saved myself a lot of cash.

 

[Veri]

So I decided to order a SMSL Sanskrit 10th thinking that's a reasonable DAC, I'm likely going to send that back having spent many hours trying to get it to work with my Android phone, the D10 works perfectly with Android, plug it in and the audio just auto switches to the D10. The Sanskrit works fine with USB audio player pro, but I want to stream Amazon HD music which isn't supported by UAPP or likely to be seeing as according the extreamsd Amazon HD has no public API.

Looking at alternative DACs to the D10 I couldn't find any DACs of a similar price offering the same clean signal that the D10 does, annoying / frustrating...

Audiophonics has stock of (legitimate) Topping D10 in black if you're wiling to import from EU.

 

[maverickronin]

Amazon Anti-Counterfeiting Policy
Products offered for sale on Amazon must be authentic. The sale of counterfeit products is strictly prohibited. Failure to abide by this policy may result in loss of selling privileges, funds being withheld and destruction of inventory in our possession.

Good luck. Amazon's support gave me a tough time and they basically said "I see no problem here, but you can return it". I basically kept saying this is the exact definition a counterfeit, but they didn't care.

I think there's an important distinction between a knockoff and a counterfeit.

The Ampire AD10 is a clear knockoff. Amazon, should remove "Topping" from the product description, but the product itself isn't Topping branded.

 

[Tidaliser]

From UK Amazon, it's comical how the 'AD10' transforms itself into a D10, or have they omitted the 'A' and D10 is just short for AD10 ?

• XMOS XU208 + Customized Driver + ESS ES9018K2M > Adopted XMOS XU208 for USB interface and customized driver which from Thesycon for better comparability with high resolution audio files especially DSD native. Uses ESS ES9018K2M to make THD+N as low as 0.0008% @ 1kHz.
• DSD256 and PCM384 > Compatible with 16-32bit/44.1-383kHz and DSD64-DSD256 (native).
• Replaceable OP > D10 has OP amp socket, DIY lovers can change the OP amp to meet different needs.
• Connect to Active Speakers > D10 provide not only DSD and higher specification PCM compatibility but also a better sound quality than your computer’s built-in sound card or a regular DAC.
• Automatic Power On/Off / Format and Sampling Rate Indicator> Although the USB port support power after PC has shutdown, D10 still will synchronously power on/off with PC. Indicate the audio format (PCM or DSD) and sampling rate of the playing music.

 

[maverickronin]

LOL, copy and paste.

 

[FireLion]

@amirm do you mind if I share some of this on Head-Fi? I own the original and hold it in high regard and think this copying from a distributor is just plain wrong.