[ADVICE] Better audio than ALC1220

[MrZammler]

Hi!

Newbie here, need some advice please!

I've built a new PC based on Asus B450-I (mini itx) board. It uses the ALC1220 chip for sound.

Before that, I had an old Core2Duo PC, which had a Creative X-Fi titanium Fatal1ty Pro card. Now; my hearing isn't the best. I don't have expensive speakers or expensive IEMS. But without being able to pinpoint exactly how, the ALC1220 sounds worse than the Creative card. I think I remember the creative being brighter and maybe more spacious than the ALC1220. But really I'm not 100% sure...

So the question is: Am I mad? The 1220 is supposed to be an OK sound chip, is it worse than the Creative card? If yes, would an external x-fi HD USB card be close to sound like the Fatal1ty, or should I got maybe for the Topping D10s? Or is it just my imagination and there won't be any real difference in the end?

Thanks a lot!!

 

[NTK]

Welcome to ASR!

The chip is only one part of the whole equation. The rest of the implementation matters a lot too. For example, you can take a look at Amir's review of the Dell XPS 8930. Its audio performance was absolutely atrocious — pitiful headphone output power, huge output impedance. These defects are absolutely audible. Not to say it is representative of your Asus motherboard, but without measurements, you never know.

What are you driving with your PC? Headphones, amp, active speakers?

 

[weasels]

I run USB from my PC to a Topping D10. IMO it's the best sound I've had from my PC, with much lower noise than any sound card I've ever had.

https://apos.audio/collections/brand-spotlight-topping/products/topping-d10s-dac

 

[Killingbeans]

The 1220 is supposed to be an OK sound chip, is it worse than the Creative card?

Two really bad implementation of any two different chips will sound equally bad. A good engineer can make a perfectly transparent audio output using just about any chip, while a bad engineer (or one with a different design goal) can make any audio output become garbage, no matter what chip is being used.

You can't tell for sure without measurements. But like NTK says, it could also depend on how you are interfacing with the PC.

 

[ScofieldKid]

This should be roughly where you are... Topping E30 + L30 would be a step up, in my opinion...
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...te-z390-aorus-motherboard-audio-review.13083/

 

[MrZammler]

Hi!, thanks for your replies!

I'm driving a set of speakers (which I plan on changing some time later), and a cheap Fiio IEM (F3 - Also planning on upgrading to the FH3).

So, new question, to try and understand... A DAC is supposed to be flat? I.e. the best implementation of one is to not "color" the sound? Is it then after that, a matter of EQ (do people use EQ?) and/or speakers and headphones? And so, a DAC's performance is measured on how close to the source it can output the digital signal?

Thanks!

 

[Killingbeans]

So, new question, to try and understand... A DAC is supposed to be flat? I.e. the best implementation of one is to not "color" the sound?

Yes, that's the primary task of a DAC. Of course, if you like the sound of a non-flat DAC, it's not a crime, but using a piece of gear as permanent EQ is a bit silly, if you ask me. Some manufacturers deliberately design DACs with colored sound and tries to fool people into believing that it equates to higher quality. Often they claim that the difference being heard is caused by "flatness" beyond the known boundaries of physics, and that's why you should have no objection to the obscene price tag. Obviously that's complete BS.

Is it then after that, a matter of EQ (do people use EQ?) and/or speakers and headphones? And so, a DAC's performance is measured on how close to the source it can output the digital signal?

Yes, (yes,) yes and yes

 

[MrZammler]

Ah, thanks, Things are starting to make sense now

So the plan is to get a D10s, get that out of the way, and start building from there, many thanks!

I suppose now the difference I saw between the ALC1220 and the Creative card was mainly due to implementation. So having a d10s will be a good baseline to go from there. I'll also try some EQ (I'm on linux and will need to add it to alsa).

 

[Chrispy]

Just generally, the most critical component in good audio are the speakers....curious, what are you using?

 

[MrZammler]

Borderline embarrassed to say, but it's a very old Logitech Z4 set...

Looking to replace with something newer (2.0) but currently in negotiations with wife (strong opinions on looks )

 

[Willem]

Start your decision making process with 1, the purpose for which you want to have sound (music, or just videoconferencing), 2 the budget, 3 the speakers, and only then 4) the necessary electronics. Of these, the speakers are the most expensive and most important part.

 

[Chrispy]

Borderline embarrassed to say, but it's a very old Logitech Z4 set...

Looking to replace with something newer (2.0) but currently in negotiations with wife (strong opinions on looks )

I'd start with speakers myself....

 

[L5730]

In my opinion, it's a good idea to have multiple sound devices on Windows at least.
You can then have all Windows bings and bongs, the web browser etc. all feeding the onboard sound device, with some low power desktop speakers.
A secondary audio device, such as a USB DAC can then be used with your music player exclusively.
You won't get a nasty shock of a big loud alert kicking through your music listening session, and it also stops some sync interfering with competing sounds trying to playback through one device.
If you use EqAPO, you can assign different EQ to the different devices too, which is just a convenience.

I have an X370 with ALC1220 onboard audio. Using the front panel for some 32 ohm headphones, I dialled in an EQ that sounded pretty decent.
Once I got the Tempotec Sonata HD Pro portable micro-USB DAC/Headphone amp, I have had to start again with the EQ settings. Tonally, the Tempotec is cleaner and precise. I think the Realtek has a high-ish output impedance (the slider doesn't work) and there is probably some DSP that can't be turned off going on somewhere. Things sound 'right' with the Tempotec.

For a line out, the Topping D10 (probably now unavailable, don't buy the knock-off "Aimpire"!!), D10s or E30 would all be nice low-price options.

The general idea, I think, is to find as clean and neutral playback chain as possible and within budget. One listens to known 'good' sounding music or 'reference' recordings, and settles in with their setup. One can change EQ here and there for taste. Then it's a case of just living with the lesser good sounding recordings.