A new Kef speaker? The Kef LS Luxe

[Chanur]

I don't even care about PEQ per say because I think the nicer KEF models sound fine either way. No room correction though is inexcusable at this price.

 

[singular]

So we agree that at 3 meters, the reflections are significant .
I agree with you that the easiest way to take the room out of the equation is to listen with headphones—I actually have a few pairs myself.
Of course, I don't dispute that acoustic treatment of a room is always preferable to correcting resonances via DSP; however, this isn't always possible or even desirable in a living room, where critical listening is rarely the goal.
But that’s no reason not to do our utmost to minimize room modes, and modern room mode correction —which, while they can’t work miracles, fundamentally improve performance in this area, and it’s clear that while these features have been available on competing speakers for at least five or six years, KEF has so far overlooked them—which is detrimental to the overall sound quality in the living rooms of ordinary people.

AI ?

I dont think that ordinary people can measure properly, or understand physics of sound.

May be the home cinema setup is worth for that easy measurement.

I agree that it is a way how to do that for audiophile guys.
I rather have a big screen of laptop with software as Clio, where is visible everything, than small sliders in display of my phone, where is visible nothing.

 

[Rõlnnbacke]

Spindata from kef white paper.

Source: https://images.salsify.com/image/upload/s--3dv0Hd7p--/myoxbujcbvrsfpjkmrph.pdf

Something weird happening at 6k.

Would guess the typical coaxial diffraction issues which due to symmetry are accentuated on-axis, thankfully in the listening window and off-axis they are not an issue, that's why it is usually recommended to never fully toe-in such to your listening position.

Whith the right (not) toe in, I wonder if the listening window/directivity idexes also look worse then they are because the on axis radiation is part of the listening window.. Asuming that the on axis radiation than is more a minor part of what the listener(s) hear.

Funny that the passive ls50 meta, directivity wise, is among the best speakers, even compared to studio monitors(?)

 

[singular]

Whith the right (not) toe in, I wonder if the listening window/directivity idexes also look worse then they are because the on axis radiation is part of the listening window.. Asuming that the on axis radiation than is more a minor part of what the listener(s) hear.

Funny that the passive ls50 meta, directivity wise, is among the best speakers, even compared to studio monitors(?)

Hard to comment Spinorama from 1m.

Are you going to use Luxe as studio monitors?
If yes, I assume that off axis will be your choice for nearfield.

Luxe - studio monitors...why not?
Now the frequency response off axis has a sense.
Lets make the slope flat and it could be hit.
Better then in living room btw.

 

[Gwen 22]

AI ?

I dont think that ordinary people can measure properly, or understand physics of sound.

May be the home cinema setup is worth for that easy measurement.

I agree that it is a way how to do that for audiophile guys.
I rather have a big screen of laptop with software as Clio, where is visible everything, than small sliders in display of my phone, where is visible nothing.

It is precisely because they aren’t trying to understand the physics of sound but simply want to enjoy the system that automatic calibration is a godsend for the average buyer.

 

[PaulF2020]

I must say it is quite pathetic not to have PEQ and some sort of room correction or at least an option to buy it as an add-on for this price of speakers.

 

[Rõlnnbacke]

Are you going to use Luxe as studio monitors?

No. As far I can judge spinorama's, I guess the equed passive ls50 meta wouldn't be so bad as studio monitors: https://www.spinorama.org/speakers/KEF LS50 Meta/ErinsAudioCorner/index_eac-v1-15-degree.html , That it looks like they don't really have this diffraction issues. But it possibly doesn't matter with the ls luxe or other coaxials when off axis.

 

[kemmler3D]

I don't know about the LS60, but the LS50WII lets you make SOME adjustment - in the Advanced section of the KEF Connect app you can tell it how far the speakers are from the wall, if they are on stands or not, and also whether the room is Lively, Moderate or Damped. That's pretty much it, and I would be VERY surprised if the LS60 doesn't have those setting options.

It does, but if you want to deal with room modes it's a very blunt instrument.

 

[singular]

No. As far I can judge spinorama's, I guess the equed passive ls50 meta wouldn't be so bad as studio monitors: https://www.spinorama.org/speakers/KEF LS50 Meta/ErinsAudioCorner/index_eac-v1-15-degree.html , That it looks like they don't really have this diffraction issues. But it possibly doesn't matter with the ls luxe or other coaxials when off axis.

May You see it from phase response and can say it will work.

By my sense it is speaker for use in living room and probably need new crossover.
Good thing is you can try first with EQ.

KEF LS50 Meta

„Meta“ jako metamorfóza, „meta“ jako metamfetamin, „meta“ jako metafyzický. Ale také „Meta“ jakožto metamateriály – právě z toho posledního je odvozen přídomek druhé generace ikonického modelu LS50, který anglický KEF původně zamýšlel jako zajímavou limitovanou sérii, aby nakonec strávil beze...

www.hifi-voice.com

 

[singular]

It does, but if you want to deal with room modes it's a very blunt instrument.

Nulls cannot be addressed this way.
IIR EQ works only in well damped room, or with different type of loudspeaker than is vented 2-ways.

 

[Mnyb]

I don't know about the LS60, but the LS50WII lets you make SOME adjustment - in the Advanced section of the KEF Connect app you can tell it how far the speakers are from the wall, if they are on stands or not, and also whether the room is Lively, Moderate or Damped. That's pretty much it, and I would be VERY surprised if the LS60 doesn't have those setting options.

It has these features.

 

[pablolie]

innovation through diversification. same overall components. package different. the bait is out at minimum effort.
bite audiophile fishes!

 

[Goldhamster916]

innovation through diversification. same overall components. package different. the bait is out at minimum effort.
bite audiophile fishes!

Hm it’s the first KEF hi fi speaker with the VECO system and from reading the white paper I would say the supposed distortion reduction is pretty promising. Apart from that the system is quite an feat of engineering in my opinion.

 

[Miguelón]

On Roon Ready, the LS LUXE are expected to be Roon Ready certified by early next year. More info will follow closer to the time.

On PEQ and/or Room Correction, we are keeping notes of the feedback that we receive and recognise the value it brings to power users like ASR members.

Our SW development priorities are guided by consumer demand, and we have quite a long to-do list. That said, the recent comments on here and growing demand for the missing features certainly emphasises their importance.

I didn't know that KEF were present in our community, is wellcome to realize.

This days room correction has became a well known advantage to the non-pro audiophile public.

I guess your sales will be increased significantly with respect to the cost of PEQ implementation.

Glad to see big brands reading and taking our comments into account, here are great technical experts (not my case, I'm just an average audiophile).

 

[PaulF2020]

I didn't know that KEF were present in our community, is wellcome to realize.

This days room correction has became a well known advantage to the non-pro audiophile public.

I guess your sales will be increased significantly with respect to the cost of PEQ implementation.

Glad to see big brands reading and taking our comments into account, here are great technical experts (not my case, I'm just an average audiophile).

I totally agree, I have 3 requirements for ideal speakers nowadays:
1. Should be active
2. Should be wireless
3. Should be coaxial
4. Should have PEQ and room correction

There are few good speakers which meet 1,3, only def mets 1,2,3 and none so far meets all 4.

Also when people mention that Room correction is for advanced users, well, even some low end B&O speakers have it, not to mention their high end ones which have it for like 20 years!

 

[Miguelón]

I totally agree, I have 3 requirements for ideal speakers nowadays:
1. Should be active
2. Should be wireless
3. Should be coaxial
4. Should have PEQ and room correction

There are few good speakers which meet 1,3, only def mets 1,2,3 and none so far meets all 4.

Also when people mention that Room correction is for advanced users, well, even some low end B&O speakers have it, not to mention their high end ones which have it for like 20 years!

Is true that PEQ requieres a learning curve and some theoretical knowledge, it really can be considered for advanced users.

My point (and I guess some others can agree), is that those advanced users are more and more present in audiophile world.

So that they can be taken into account with positive benefit to cost ratio by the company.

 

[PaulF2020]

Is true that PEQ requieres a learning curve and some theoretical knowledge, it really can be considered for advanced users.

My point (and I guess some others can agree), is that those advanced users are more and more present in audiophile world.

So that they can be taken into account with positive benefit to cost ratio by the company.

Of course PEQ requires some knowledge, but again, it doesn't need to be in your face when you open the app, they can hide it in advanced settings or something. It is really a rubbish excuse for not to have it IMO.

Also to your point that speaker is not meant for advanced users, well why do they have a phase setting then in the app? Kinda geeky setting if you ask me, probably even more "geeky" than PEQ.

Just think about this, who is their target audience with those speakers? B&O user ? Well B&O has room correction. Buchardt type of audiophile? well those folks have PEQ and room correction too.

 

[PaulF2020]

My family hates my Kefs because there's no power switch, and so do I.

Literally every time I want to use them, I have to go to my phone, open the app, and click on the power.

How much money can it POSSIBLY save, to have a speaker that turns itself off every five minutes? A penny?

And you CAN'T TURN THIS OFF. The speaker simply will not let you keep it powered on permanently.

My Kefs are the first set of active speakers I've ever owned that don't have an audible hiss. But they couldn't spend a single second to consider that maybe there are customer who just want to turn on their TV and have it work?

I've been a Kef fanboy all of my life, and nothing has disgusted me more than the absolute atrocious software in their speakers. It's AWFUL.

What? You're saying they will not wake up on signal input?

 

[Patrick Bateman]

There's a lot of people in this thread saying:

1) they're ugly

2) they could have made them spherical

If you look at the horizontal and vertical polars, there isn't much evidence that either statement is true.

First off, to get polars that look this insanely perfect, you don't get to that by accident. Kef undoubtedly ran hundreds or thousands of sims, and the winning shape was selected based on a fixed criteria. Someone had to sit down and say "I want EXACTLY this beamwidth" and then software iterated over thousands of variations until the "correct" variation was selected. (Obviously, the enclosure largely determines the beamwidth of the loudspeaker, once the frequencies being played are longer than the diameter of the driver on the baffle.)

Second, the vertical and the horizontal are not identical. The vertical fit's into a narrower beamwdith.

Put all of that together: There was only ONE solution.

In a few years, someone will probably figure out how to make these look better, but at the moment, it looks to me that their primary goal was a specific beamwidth, and a software optimizer found the solution. A single solution.

 

[dasherzx]

So uhh. Wen klippel.
And what’s the place of manufacture? And I’d like to state that this question is pure curiosity. I own $5k speakers manufactured in china…