3e Audio A7 [TPA3255 PFFB Stereo] Finished Amplifier - User Impressions | Owner's Thread

[vbutani]

Need suggestion as some users use wiim along with A5/A7

I use Wiim Pro coax out > Musician Pegasus R2R DAC > 3e audio A5 > Dali Zensor 3 bookshelf speakers

My previous amp was Fosi V3 Stereo in same setup.

I really like the details A5 amp produce even at lower power with transparency, but I guess I'm getting overwhelmed with the details. I read that my R2R dac has good implementation for USB input so to try I used my samsung S23 mobile using Neutron music player which bypasses Android mixer and output actual bitrate to dac. I observed that sound was little warmer and High frequencies were smoother and I didn't felt any fatigue on it.
I liked it more then wiim pro coax eventhough I guess it might be less detailed not sure.
Would my DAC USB making it sound smooth ?

Can I get similar sound with any of following approach?
1, Upgarde to Wiim Ultra and use usb out to DAC
2, Gustard U18 DDC used available at similar price as Ultra so add DDC in between Wiim Pro coax > DDC USB out > Pegasus R2R DAC
I mostly listen to 16bit flac files, apple music chromecast to wiim pro, amazon music without HD as it's not available
3, Upgrade speakers from Dali Zensor 3 to ???

Please suggest, thanks

 

[SMen]

Need suggestion as some users use wiim along with A5/A7

I use Wiim Pro coax out > Musician Pegasus R2R DAC > 3e audio A5 > Dali Zensor 3 bookshelf speakers

My previous amp was Fosi V3 Stereo in same setup.

I really like the details A5 amp produce even at lower power with transparency, but I guess I'm getting overwhelmed with the details. I read that my R2R dac has good implementation for USB input so to try I used my samsung S23 mobile using Neutron music player which bypasses Android mixer and output actual bitrate to dac. I observed that sound was little warmer and High frequencies were smoother and I didn't felt any fatigue on it.
I liked it more then wiim pro coax eventhough I guess it might be less detailed not sure.
Would my DAC USB making it sound smooth ?

Can I get similar sound with any of following approach?
1, Upgarde to Wiim Ultra and use usb out to DAC
2, Gustard U18 DDC used available at similar price as Ultra so add DDC in between Wiim Pro coax > DDC USB out > Pegasus R2R DAC
I mostly listen to 16bit flac files, apple music chromecast to wiim pro, amazon music without HD as it's not available
3, Upgrade speakers from Dali Zensor 3 to ???

Please suggest, thanks

Today by coincidence I played some music through my HiBy player which also takes control of bitrate through USB and felt the same thing (smooth etc), though that was with some DSD.
I recently tried and liked the Topping Centaurus which is also R2R and the 3e A5 did not in anyway hide the qualities of the Centaurus (sometimes even lush on voices) even though the A5 strikes me as being 'super transparent' it did not overwhelm with details with the Centaurus. This was using a WIIM Mini from optical out as well as USB on my android system.

I really liked the standard 16bit flac files I played.

Weirdly I was not so happy with 24bit 192! ... so I ended up trying the AUDIOPHONICS DIGIRESCUE Reclocker ! It has just stayed in my system though I may have to book an appointment with a psychiatrist... if you are in europe you could give it a go. They have a 14 day return policy.

I have read that people using the Wiim Ultra have ended up feeding this from it's USB out through an SMSL reclocker (SMSL PO100 PRO)! So the current Ultra might not be what you want... perhaps people can chip in about Wiim room correction...

Your Dalis seem good and would appear to be revealing ... I can't help but think that ultimately "front loading" with speakers is the way I will go ... once I get a bigger house!

 

[harkpabst]

The Dali Zensor 3 have been a rather moderately priced offering, sitting between the low cost Spektor and the mid-tier Oberon series (when they were still available), with the Opticon and Rubicon series further up the price range.

While they were considered good value for money, replacing anything but the speakers first seems weird to me, honestly.

 

[SMen]

The Dali Zensor 3 have been a rather moderately priced offering, sitting between the low cost Spektor and the mid-tier Oberon series (when they were still available), with the Option and Rubicon series further up the price range.

While they were considered good value for money, replacing anything but the speakers first seems weird to me, honestly.

+ 1 kind of ... I don't have personal experience of the Dali's but maybe they are on the brighter side - @vbutani maybe check out https://www.youtube.com/@ErinsAudioCorner for 'thresholds' for different speakers at different price points.
He measures - listens - talks about in room stuff (if you have not come across his channel).

 

[Guddu]

+ 1 kind of ... I don't have personal experience of the Dali's but maybe they are on the brighter side - @vbutani maybe check out https://www.youtube.com/@ErinsAudioCorner for 'thresholds' for different speakers at different price points.
He measures - listens - talks about in room stuff (if you have not come across his channel).

I have had Dali Zenzor 3 in the past and I found them definitely on the brighter side as well.
I think speaker upgrade will help in this case.

 

[antcollinet]

Need suggestion as some users use wiim along with A5/A7

I use Wiim Pro coax out > Musician Pegasus R2R DAC > 3e audio A5 > Dali Zensor 3 bookshelf speakers

My previous amp was Fosi V3 Stereo in same setup.

I really like the details A5 amp produce even at lower power with transparency, but I guess I'm getting overwhelmed with the details. I read that my R2R dac has good implementation for USB input so to try I used my samsung S23 mobile using Neutron music player which bypasses Android mixer and output actual bitrate to dac. I observed that sound was little warmer and High frequencies were smoother and I didn't felt any fatigue on it.
I liked it more then wiim pro coax eventhough I guess it might be less detailed not sure.
Would my DAC USB making it sound smooth ?

Can I get similar sound with any of following approach?
1, Upgarde to Wiim Ultra and use usb out to DAC
2, Gustard U18 DDC used available at similar price as Ultra so add DDC in between Wiim Pro coax > DDC USB out > Pegasus R2R DAC
I mostly listen to 16bit flac files, apple music chromecast to wiim pro, amazon music without HD as it's not available
3, Upgrade speakers from Dali Zensor 3 to ???

Please suggest, thanks

Use the EQ in the Wiim to tone down the highs a little bit - that is all you need to do. Better still, use it to implement room correction with a suitable target curve.

Playing about with different digital interfaces, or different streamers is not going to make any difference to the sound.

 

[Guddu]

Use the EQ in the Wiim to tone down the highs a little bit - that is all you need to do. Better still, use it to implement room correction with a suitable target curve.

Playing about with different digital interfaces, or different streamers is not going to make any difference to the sound.

Just to add, I got WiiM Pro Plus yesterday... tried room correction with initial setup and results are bizarre, specially treble/highs.
Better to try PEQ to tame down certain freq. than WiiM's room correct... in my experience.
I am yet to try room correction limiting to base/mid-base yet.

 

[antcollinet]

tried room correction with initial setup and results are bizarre, specially treble/highs.

Room correction is definately not a plug and play experience. It takes some time to learn how to get the best from it.

 

[EddNog]

Room correction is definately not a plug and play experience. It takes some time to learn how to get the best from it.

The DSPeaker Anti-Mode X2D gets pretty close. The only issue is adjusting the level of the subwoofer to where it needs to be to match the speakers. I’m not sure why mine doesn’t do that right, but once I do, it is as good as it gets (and curiously it does everything else perfectly with regards to bass management and room correcting the sub, although I found it best to adjust phase myself prior to calibration), and significantly better than the room correction in my WiiM Ultra. Unlike DIRAC, which needs upwards of nine readings from multiple locations to perform its calibration, the Anti-Mode X2D only needs to perform a calibration from one spot (your listening position). If you want to adjust your calibration for a wider sweet spot, it provides that option as well, but it’s not a requirement. Finally unlike the older Anti-Mode 2.0 or the regular Anti-Mode X2, there’s no poorly performing analog output on the X2D to deal with, since you get to supply your own DAC with proper analog output stage.

-Ed

 

[T&T]

Was just about to buy two ZA3s or a set of V3 monos but recently got wind of the 3e A7 monos and am reconsidering. Not sure if the auto on/off would be an issue for me just for listening to music and am a little leery of Ali Express but these seem like the best iteration of the 3255 chip.

I used to own 2 V3 monos and them I get 2 ZA3 to be used in mono...I sold my V3 monos, to AB I left one speaker with V3 and another on the ZA3 and the decision was made.... the ZA3 wins them I did the same rolling opamps on both ZA3 with different opamps, opa1656, lme49860, Muses02, V7 vivid ect, and surprise my favorite was opa2604 on Right channel one opamp and one opamp on XLR....all test were done using XLR connection no rca

 

[SMen]

The V3 monos just sound slightly different to the A5. In terms of power through my efficient speakers I sense no increase / decrease between the two. The V3 Monos are more 'forgiving'. I suspect the A5's are more revealing of better quality 'upstream' sources - just a couple of user impressions... no desire to offload either models. Too darn useful.

 

[harkpabst]

and surprise my favorite was opa2604 on Right channel one opamp and one opamp on XLR....all test were done using XLR connection no rca

That's a surprise indeed, because there is no XLR opamp, even if the notoriously clueless Passion for Sound claims otherwise in his Burson Audio commercials on YouTube.

There is an "RCA to balanced" opamp, which isn't used at all when feeding the amp through XLR.

Welcome to the club of victims of "I know what I hear".

 

[SMen]

That's a surprise indeed, because there is no XLR opamp, even if the notoriously clueless Passion for Sound claims otherwise in his Burson Audio commercials on YouTube.

There is an "RCA to balanced" opamp, which isn't used at all when feeding the amp through XLR.

Welcome to the club of victims of "I know what I hear".

OK I am scratching my head here ...

don't we have an op amp from RCA in order to convert to balanced from single ended, and then two op amps (one each) for the left and right which are fed directly from the left and right XLR's? So yes the XLR's bypass the RCA op amp ... but there are still op amps before each 325* which the balanced connections go through?

of course Fosi went and confused things further with the V3 monos with two op amps before each 3255 but let's not go there. I never understood this.

I think this might just be language and translation. I love my A5 and for whatever reason, I am sure it sounds more transparent than the V3 monos - but they sound very nice all the same

 

[harkpabst]

OK I am scratching my head here ...

don't we have an op amp from RCA in order to convert to balanced from single ended, and then two op amps (one each) for the left and right which are fed directly from the left and right XLR's? So yes the XLR's bypass the RCA op amp ... but there are still op amps before each 325* which the balanced connections go through?

of course Fosi went and confused things further with the V3 monos with two op amps before each 3255 but let's not go there. I never understood this.

I think this might just be language and translation. I love my A5 and for whatever reason, I am sure it sounds more transparent than the V3 monos - but they sound very nice all the same

Yes, but:

1. There is no XLR opamp an the ZA3 (or any other amp mentioned).
2. If someone replaces one opamp "on right channel" and "one opamp on XLR" (which is really "on RCA" so to speak) and then doesn't use the RCA input at all, then the replacement of the latter opamp had even less influence than that of the former: absolutely zero

Was that more clear?

 

[SMen]

Yes, but:

1. There is no XLR opamp an the ZA3 (or any other amp mentioned).
2. If someone replaces one opamp "on right channel" and "one opamp on XLR" (which is really "on RCA" so to speak) and then doesn't use the RCA input at all, then the replacement of the latter opamp had even less influence than that of the former: absolutely zero

Was that more clear?

I think that probably...

I used to own 2 V3 monos and them I get 2 ZA3 to be used in mono...I sold my V3 monos, to AB I left one speaker with V3 and another on the ZA3 and the decision was made.... the ZA3 wins them I did the same rolling opamps on both ZA3 with different opamps, opa1656, lme49860, Muses02, V7 vivid ect, and surprise my favorite was opa2604 on Right channel one opamp and one opamp on XLR....all test were done using XLR connection no rca

more clarity needed in this explanation.

 

[EddNog]

Yes, but:

1. There is no XLR opamp an the ZA3 (or any other amp mentioned).
2. If someone replaces one opamp "on right channel" and "one opamp on XLR" (which is really "on RCA" so to speak) and then doesn't use the RCA input at all, then the replacement of the latter opamp had even less influence than that of the former: absolutely zero

Was that more clear?

My friend, I think you’re confused on one small aspect of the ZA3.

The ZA3 uses an op-amp for the XLR input and not the RCA input. This is because it has to convert differential input signals down to single-ended in order to press them through the volume attenuator (potentiometer). Since RCA input is already single-ended, it bypasses this op-amp. In basic terms, ZA3 is the exact opposite of V3 Mono in how, “it op-amps the inputs.”

-Ed

 

[harkpabst]

My friend, I think you’re confused on one small aspect of the ZA3.

The ZA3 uses an op-amp for the XLR input and not the RCA input. This is because it has to convert differential input signals down to single-ended in order to press them through the volume attenuator (potentiometer). Since RCA input is already single-ended, it bypasses this op-amp. In basic terms, ZA3 is the exact opposite of V3 Mono in how, “it op-amps the inputs.”

-Ed

Thanks, judging from Fosi's (meager) documentation it looks like I've been mixing up the specification, indeed. So, the ZA3 appears to be different not only from the V3 Mono but also from the 3e Audio A5/A7.

Embarrassingly, I not only have to apologize to T&T, but also to Passion for Sound. I kept the original postings as I wrote them for reference but marked all text as invalid.

Irrespective of this due correction I continue to question the usefulness of opamp rolling in general.

 

[T&T]

My friend, I think you’re confused on one small aspect of the ZA3.

The ZA3 uses an op-amp for the XLR input and not the RCA input. This is because it has to convert differential input signals down to single-ended in order to press them through the volume attenuator (potentiometer). Since RCA input is already single-ended, it bypasses this op-amp. In basic terms, ZA3 is the exact opposite of V3 Mono in how, “it op-amps the inputs.”

-Ed

Yes 1 opamp on xlr, so charging that one and the right channel...using 2 opamps only in za3 works fine and changing the opamp on xlr make a difference too, so pull out the other 3 opamps 2 for sub and the left channel opamp
Note this only done to be used in Mono.

 

[SMen]

Need suggestion as some users use wiim along with A5/A7

I use Wiim Pro coax out > Musician Pegasus R2R DAC > 3e audio A5 > Dali Zensor 3 bookshelf speakers

My previous amp was Fosi V3 Stereo in same setup.

I really like the details A5 amp produce even at lower power with transparency, but I guess I'm getting overwhelmed with the details. I read that my R2R dac has good implementation for USB input so to try I used my samsung S23 mobile using Neutron music player which bypasses Android mixer and output actual bitrate to dac. I observed that sound was little warmer and High frequencies were smoother and I didn't felt any fatigue on it.
I liked it more then wiim pro coax eventhough I guess it might be less detailed not sure.
Would my DAC USB making it sound smooth ?

Can I get similar sound with any of following approach?
1, Upgarde to Wiim Ultra and use usb out to DAC
2, Gustard U18 DDC used available at similar price as Ultra so add DDC in between Wiim Pro coax > DDC USB out > Pegasus R2R DAC
I mostly listen to 16bit flac files, apple music chromecast to wiim pro, amazon music without HD as it's not available
3, Upgrade speakers from Dali Zensor 3 to ???

Please suggest, thanks

I've been thinking some more about this and over the weekend - when 3e Audio started a thread announcing that they were making these units with PFFB they measured a number of op amps. When I was trying op amps I never kept OPA1656's in place.

In fact this op amp has gained lots of traction because of DIY'rs subjectively liking it with other 3255 implementations.

The A5se comes with NE5532's - I'd wager OPA1656 in the non-se is marketing rather than for measured performance (and cost differentiation). 3e themselves showed (essentially) no difference in the measurements they released.

I played with Muses02's over the weekend (just to infuriate everyone ). I thought the OPA1656's sounded louder for some reason. I might just bung in some NE5532's!

Basically, I am with you on the highly 'pristine' nature of the A5.

I bet the A5's and A7's could easily have been distributed with NE5532's ... and then I might have swapped in OPA1656's and just thought "Nah, I think I'll go back to the NE5532s"!!

It is what has happened all times previously.

And plenty of commentators here would be saying "no point in swapping out the NE5532's" (had they come as standard in the first place)!

I might have been imagining the higher gain of course, but my listening impressions changed. Yes I know volume matching etc ... maybe next weekend / month.

 

[LeStereolith]

So, after reading ALL the comments several times (just to be sure I made the right decision) in attendance of delivery from Audiophonics.fr of two A7 Monos, they arrived about two hours ago. Just Running them in and installing my SS3602‘s that I still had as a reserve. To be honest not hearing too much of a difference compared to the included opamps. Sold my V3 monos recently, before I even considered the A7 as I hadn’t even heard of them. To avoid auto shut off after 5 minutes, I decided to run the amps at almost maximum volume and this seems to have resolved the auto shut off that has been discussed here in length, and controlling volume with my Wiim Ultra. Also there is a PO100 from SMSL, going to my Weiss 204 DAC. From there I go to my Swiss made Stereolith (dot com) which is 20 still today 20 years ahead of 3D holographic imaging that is currently possible. It’s a stereo Loudspeaker where left and right speakers are in the same chassis. It’s more complicated than that, also setting of pass filters and proportions, I have no room nodes whatsoever. I don’t know how the inventor (also worked at Revox back in the good old days. The man is a genius and he mentions something about esoteric atomic states that remove the sound nodes.

Anyway, the sound with 3e A7 is really quite impressive. Mostly I have to listen low volume because of the owner of the house I live in underneath my uninsulated floating wooden floor. But I did briefly hit 70 db’s and man I could sense what an amazing Amp the A7 monos are. So clear, with body and clean stable colorless sound. I have to say I am really impressed and ecstatic I hit the BUY button. Nice to be in the club of A7 owners. All the best to you all.

PS: It’s difficult to imagine how good the Stereolith (very smalll company with bespoke production), really performs without hearing it in person. Also, regardless of your position in the room, still sounds like you’re there live. If you are interested and you contact Stereolith, tell them Tomasz sent you