3e audio A7/A7 Mono Amplifier Review

[Old_School_Brad]

My sample has been here for quite a while. So the accessory situation may have changed.

The power supply is considered an accessory to an amplifier? That seems like quite a stretch.

 

[Audionaut]

The power supply is considered an accessory to an amplifier? That seems like quite a stretch.

Why?
The main component is the amplifier.
The power supply unit is freely selectable, as with many of these TPA325x amplifiers.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

Why?
The main component is the amplifier.
The power supply unit is freely selectable, as with many of these TPA325x amplifiers.

Well, is the power supply required for the amplifier to function?

Does it affect the amount of power the amplifier can deliver?

If the answer to both is yes -as it usually is -then calling it an "accessory," even if it comes as an external brick, doesn’t really make sense to me.

 

[ICIETDIYEUR]

Old_School_Brad: To think we haven't even touched on CE certification yet...

 

[Audionaut]

Well, is the power supply required for the amplifier to function?

Does it affect the amount of power the amplifier can deliver?

If the answer to both is yes -as it usually is -then calling it an "accessory," even if it comes as an external brick, doesn’t really make sense to me.

Both of your questions can be answered in the affirmative, but in this case the power supply unit remains an external and freely selectable component.

A car will not be able to drive without tires and the quality, profile and width of the tires influence the achievable performance of the car. Nevertheless, tires are accessories and can be purchased from different manufacturers at any time. Just like the power supply units for this 3e audio amplifier.

It will work just as well with a no-name 24 Volt 5A power supply unit as with a 48V 10A power supply unit from Aiyima or the enclosed 52V 9A power supply unit, which is not available for purchase.

But we don't have to argue about that. I know what you mean.

 

[Crook]

I think we really need the manufacturer to comment now. As a buyer of this product, the potential for fake components is a very serious issue for me, regardless of whether I am happy with the measured or in use performance. That said, there does appear to be a hard push on this from parties with a clear link to a 3e competitor, which I also find a little disingenuous tba. Thanks.

 

[howard416]

What if they actually have enough NOS to sustain the planned production runs? As long as all the produced/sold units have them, it’s not fraud, right? Or at least until they update the specs for future units.

Of course, it would be hard to know for sure either way.

 

[SylphAudio]

I agree with Sokel's statement.

Any serious DIY enthusiast, or even a manufacturer, knows very well that ELNA has long since stopped producing SILMIC II.

There were stocks, for example at 'HIFI COLLECTIVE,' but there's barely enough left to equip a single device...

Lester of SYLPH AUDIO, for his part, had informed his customers that his PCBs would be equipped with SILMIC II as long as they were available and that they would subsequently be replaced with NICHICON UFG (fine gold series): this is called 'transparency' (as far as customers are concerned).

Amirm: I suggest you contact either ELNA, MOUSER, DIGIKEY, FARNELL, TOPPING, or SMSL (your choice) to ask them this question

You will see that I can therefore affirm that any device or single component resold under the ELNA SILMIC II name is not authentic.

This is therefore a 'commercial claim' intended to benefit from the reputation for the quality of its components in an unjustified and abusive manner.

In France, we call this counterfeiting and/or false advertising, and with the consequences that this entails

Some distributors will try to justify themselves by sending you a photo of a box with the original delivery slip from ELNA, but if you do a search with GOOGLE images you will quickly realize that it comes from the 'meanders of the internet'.

Once again, I remind you that neither TOPPING or SMSL uses this reference in these devices and that this is not by chance...

Elna Silmic II RFS with black and gold jacket is sourced from Asia as per this post https://www.diyaudio.com/community/goto/post?id=6577397

I can confirm since the Elna Silmic II we sourced from LCSC have black and gold jacket.
Elna Silmic II that we sourced from Mouser/Digikey USA have brown and white jacket.

Silmic II with Date codes later than 2022 is probably fake.

 

[daniboun]

Silmic II with Date codes later than 2022 is probably fake.

So what is the probability that the post-2022 Elna Silmic II could come from NOS (new old stock) mentioned by Audiophonics, which also sells your modules?

 

[SylphAudio]

So what is the probability that the post-2022 Elna Silmic II could come from NOS (new old stock) stock mentioned by Audiophonics?

I quite don't understand, there's a date code (batch) printed on the capacitor itself, like YYWW (year-week)

or you can open one and peek on the inside.

 

[daniboun]

I quite don't understand, there's a date code (batch) printed on the capacitor itself, like YYWW (year-week)

Sorry, I may have expressed myself badly... I'll rephrase ) Do you think that the Elna Silmic II capacitors mounted on the 3E Audio modules are fake?

 

[ICIETDIYEUR]

Hello Lester

Thank you for your very specific comments

Don't you find it surprising, however, that companies like TOPPING and SMSL don't use these excellent capacitors in their devices, but rather references that remain available from NICHICON ?

Although I should point out that electrochemical capacitors used in audio connections (connected in series) cannot function properly since there is no potential difference that allows electrolysis to work (at least 2 to 3 V between the terminals are required for ionization).

Only polypropylene (film) capacitors are capable of this, and the only reference with this 10µF value is the MKS2 from WIMA (Germany), rated at 50V.

It is small enough to be installed on this type of PCB, but it is 'rather expensive'

I simply wanted to clarify that my comments are in line with the technical and functional interest of the devices that can be offered for sale, therefore necessarily efficient and qualitative

 

[SylphAudio]

Hello Lester

Thank you for your very specific comments

Don't you find it surprising, however, that companies like TOPPING and SMSL don't use these excellent capacitors in their devices, but rather references that remain available from NICHICON ?

Although I should point out that electrochemical capacitors used in audio connections (connected in series) cannot function properly since there is no potential difference that allows electrolysis to work (at least 2 to 3 V between the terminals are required for ionization).

Only polypropylene (film) capacitors are capable of this, and the only reference with this 10µF value is the MKS2 from WIMA, rated at 50V.

It is small enough to be installed on this type of PCB, but it is rather expensive

I've tried WIMA before for the input cap and I find the bass plasticky, not worth the additional cost.

On Nichicon UFG, the highs do sound good although the Elna Silmic II sounds much clearer overall (if all else are equal).

 

[ICIETDIYEUR]

Lester, we talked about this a few years ago and I still agree with you, but this is a purely subjective opinion, although I think it is also noticeable, but let's not digress into another topic that won't fit into this thread...

... I seem to remember that these (Nichicon UFG) are the ones used in the TOPPING PA5, whose SINAD is a target value for class D amplifiers

 

[daniboun]

Don't you find it surprising, however, that companies like TOPPING and SMSL don't use these excellent capacitors in their devices, but rather references that remain available from NICHICON ?

Funny you should ask this question ) Does O-Noorus use high-end capacitors? I'm asking you again because you seem to have been involved in the development of the upcoming D3 Pro which you promoted here: link



As far as I know I see this for the D3

 

[ICIETDIYEUR]

I informed O-NOORUS (ALEXANDER) of this a while ago and provided him with references to replacements available from authorized dealers.

This is also one of the reasons for the delay in the release of D3 PRO in addition to the desire to obtain better results in terms of measurements.
I shared with him my knowledge of CE certifications since I have worked with the inspection bodies concerning electrical devices, more specifically concerning the NF standard on which they depend.

PS: unless I'm mistaken, the photo you're showing is of D1, which is what led me to contact ALEXANDER when it was released.
I don't know D3 since I only bought D1 at that time but I think ALEXANDER must have used the same circuit type and components when they were released.

Alexander has announced his commitment to improving and taking these customers' feedback into account.
My conversations with him only confirm what he said.

I think this is a rare, even unique, opportunity for all of us to be able to have a positive exchange directly with a manufacturer

What do you think ?

 

[sejarzo]

Are listings like this for fake caps? https://www.amazon.com/Silmic-Degree-Temperature-Capacitor-high-end/dp/B0BW66WSR6

Seems at least a bit fishy to me. All this vendor sells via Amazon are "audio grade" caps listed as being "generic" in the brand field, other than one listing for some high tensile strength bolts.

 

[ICIETDIYEUR]

We agree that Amazon is not an authorized ELNA distributor (that's not their mission).

Is this also the case for the supplier who resells them through this site ?

ELNA has the answer...

 

[V.b.]

If a speaker gets overdriven (with clean power) by playing music, there is something wrong with the speaker, the gain structure, the user... but not usually the amp.

Well, this is the point: with clean power.

Let's say you play loud and you have some peaks around 25 volts. As long as the speaker impedance is 4 ohm everything is ok.

If you check the graph, when it goes around 2 ohm, the amplifier cannot sustain over 19v and starts clipping. And we are talking heavy clipping 200-300 watts. Maybe it goes in protection and restarts

But that is not clean power.

BTW, A5 can be stable to 22 volts. I would rather have that one.

V

 

[V.b.]

That's what was said above) that being said the A7SE was not measured. You are extrapolating by analogy.

Yes, you are right. Working with what I have available.