3e audio A7/A7 Mono Amplifier Review

[Raiju]

So I finally order both fosi za3 and e3 A7 yesterday and did some good listening session.

One thing for sure the za3 plays definitly louder… to hit 90dB with A7 i had to put preamp at 90% volume while za3 preamp volume was at 70% for same dB

XLR or RCA, If RCA, what gain settings did you use?

 

[Dave TR3A]

So I finally order both fosi za3 and e3 A7 yesterday and did some good listening session.

One thing for sure the za3 plays definitly louder… to hit 90dB with A7 i had to put preamp at 90% volume while za3 preamp volume was at 70% for same dB

That is as it should be.

The Fosi ZA3’s input sensitivity is .775 VRMS while the input sensitivity of the 3e Audio A7 is 1.75 VRMS (SE) or 3.5 VRMS (balanced). That means the A7 needs a higher amplitude input to reach maximum output.

 

[peng]

So I finally order both fosi za3 and e3 A7 yesterday and did some good listening session.

One thing for sure the za3 plays definitly louder… to hit 90dB with A7 i had to put preamp at 90% volume while za3 preamp volume was at 70% for same dB

As long as your preamp has enough output voltage that is not an issue, and the A7 can definitely play louder than the ZA3 based on both specs and measurements. You just need a preamp that has higher rated output, because the A7's gain is lower than the ZA3's.

 

[Roland68]

So I finally order both fosi za3 and e3 A7 yesterday and did some good listening session.

One thing for sure the za3 plays definitly louder… to hit 90dB with A7 i had to put preamp at 90% volume while za3 preamp volume was at 70% for same dB

This is one of the reasons why the ZA3 has a higher noise floor and also amplifies the noise in the signal before you reduce it again with the potentiometer.
Not very useful.

 

[Pat La Sauce]

I also kinda of prefer the sound characteristic of the ZA3: less muddy, with sharper mid-high. The a7 has more body, though.

I also ordered an SMSL AO400. I’m gonna compare those 3 and make a choice. Thanks guys.

I lean towards dual za3 for the moment. If I run za3 in mono and decide to put sparkos opamp in them… how many opamps should I swap by unit? 1,2 or 3?

 

[Dave TR3A]

I lean towards dual za3 for the moment. If I run za3 in mono and decide to put sparkos opamp in them… how many opamps should I swap by unit? 1,2 or 3?

None.

There are many threads here on ASR showing that swapping op amps is snake oil.

 

[RandomEar]

I also kinda of prefer the sound characteristic of the ZA3: less muddy, with sharper mid-high. The a7 has more body, though.

It's unlikely that there is a difference in sound between these amps. The ZA3 does have a bit of a load dependency, but that might or might not show with your speakers. Unless you compare them level matched and blind, all you do is guessing and imagining things.

I lean towards dual za3 for the moment. If I run za3 in mono and decide to put sparkos opamp in them… how many opamps should I swap by unit? 1,2 or 3?

Op amp rolling is essentially snake oil. In amps which perform as well as that A7, you can only make it worse by rolling - and even that is very unlikely. I would not waste any money on the Sparkos, they perform no better or worse than NE5532.

 

[Pat La Sauce]

It's unlikely that there is a difference in sound between these amps. The ZA3 does have a bit of a load dependency, but that might or might not show with your speakers. Unless you compare them level matched and blind, all you do is guessing and imagining things.


Op amp rolling is essentially snake oil. In amps which perform as well as that A7, you can only make it worse by rolling - and even that is very unlikely. I would not waste any money on the Sparkos, they perform no better or worse than NE5532.

What do you mean by it’s unlikely there is a difference is sound? Here in my living room on my tower speaker the difference in sound between A7 and ZA3 is pretty obvious… at same listening level…

 

[RandomEar]

What do you mean by it’s unlikely there is a difference is sound? Here in my living room on my tower speaker the difference in sound between A7 and ZA3 is pretty obvious… at same listening level…

You think it is, but sighted listening is incredible unreliable and biased. Small differences in SPL can make an amp sound very different. I don't know how you matched levels, but doing so by ear is by far not precise enough for a fair comparison. There are many, many pitfalls for reliable testing of audio devices. Mostly because our hearing is very easy to fool.

 

[Raiju]

It's unlikely that there is a difference in sound between these amps. The ZA3 does have a bit of a load dependency, but that might or might not show with your speakers. Unless you compare them level matched and blind, all you do is guessing and imagining things.

I hear hiss from the tweeter with ZA3 and not with the A7, granted it is with my ear close to the tweeter but still. I find the ZA3 more fatiguing and hence prefer the a7 (better yet A5), yes subjective I know.

 

[Alannn]

As long as your preamp has enough output voltage that is not an issue, and the A7 can definitely play louder than the ZA3 based on both specs and measurements. You just need a preamp that has higher rated output, because the A7's gain is lower than the ZA3's.

Or even easier, increase the existing preamp output from 90 to 100%

 

[Pat La Sauce]

You think it is, but sighted listening is incredible unreliable and biased. Small differences in SPL can make an amp sound very different. I don't know how you matched levels, but doing so by ear is by far not precise enough for a fair comparison. There are many, many pitfalls for reliable testing of audio devices. Mostly because our hearing is very easy to fool.

Isn't the purpose of audio equipment to listen? Ultimately, what matters is what my ear hears, regardless of how the sound reaches it and how my ears perceives it. If, when I do tests with my eyes closed and switch between A and B, I always choose A because I prefer the sound of A, why then should I choose B? Simply because it measures better?

 

[RandomEar]

I hear hiss from the tweeter with ZA3 and not with the A7, granted it is with my ear close to the tweeter but still. I find the ZA3 more fatiguing and hence prefer the a7 (better yet A5), yes subjective I know.

A difference in tweeter hiss if you sit very close to the speakers would be plausible, as the noise level of the ZA3 is about 14 dB higher than that of the A7.

 

[RandomEar]

Isn't the purpose of audio equipment to listen? Ultimately, what matters is what my ear hears, regardless of how the sound reaches it. If, when I do tests with my eyes closed and switch between A and B, I always choose A because I prefer the sound of A, why then should I choose B? Simply because it measures better?

You're free to choose whatever you like. My point is that there likely is no difference in the sound, although you imagine there is. If you then select the one which "sounds better" today, it may not sound better tomorrow or after a glass of wine or when you're tired. Because the testing was flawed and the results were simply random. That's what good testing would avoid. This isn't about measurements, it is about realizing how flawed testing gives bad results.

 

[harkpabst]

Isn't the purpose of audio equipment to listen? Ultimately, what matters is what my ear hears, regardless of how the sound reaches it and how my ears perceives it. If, when I do tests with my eyes closed and switch between A and B, I always choose A because I prefer the sound of A, why then should I choose B? Simply because it measures better?

Or to put it even more simple: If your switch between A and B and A is only slightly louder than B, you will always prefer A. The (not so) cool thing is that this mechanism works even if you know about it and actively try to ignorwe it.

And that's just one of the many reasons why A may sound better to your than B, even if in reality there is absolutely no perceivable difference.

Having said that, it makes no sense to pick something that you don't like. Just be aware that your brain is playing tricks on you. Objectively measured, the 3E AUDIO A7 is clearly superior to the ZA3 in each and every way. Some YouTube hype helped in building a cult following for the ZA3, in particular with respect to opamp rolling. And if you want to hear a difference (even on a subconscious level) you will hear a difference. That's one more of these mechanisms we fall for.

 

[peng]

Or even easier, increase the existing preamp output from 90 to 100%

I would not say that because we don’t know how that 10% would translate into dB. It might be good enough for him but I am just not sure.

 

[Pat La Sauce]

Or to put it even more simple: If your switch between A and B and A is only slightly louder than B, you will always prefer A. The (not so) cool thing is that this mechanism works even if you know about it and actively try to ignorwe it.

And that's just one of the many reasons why A may sound better to your than B, even if in reality there is absolutely no perceivable difference.

Having said that, it makes no sense to pick something that you don't like. Just be aware that your brain is playing tricks on you. Objectively measured, the 3E AUDIO A7 is clearly superior to the ZA3 in each and every way. Some YouTube hype helped in building a cult following for the ZA3, in particular with respect to opamp rolling. And if you want to hear a difference (even on a subconscious level) you will hear a difference. That's one more of these mechanisms we fall for.

I said the ZA3 plays louder, I didn't say I preferred it because it played louder. I prefer it because I find it sharper in the mid and high range and that is a nice fit with my speaker, and I find the A7 is more rolled-off, more layback, with a less pronounced soundstage.

The a7 has more body and thats what the za3 is missing. The hype on YouTube is just as big for the A7 as it is for the ZA3.

You guys make me laugh when you say there's no perceptible difference without even having heard it, when there's a clear and obvious difference here in my living room. Of course after a glass of wine or if im tired or whatever i would maybe prefer the A7, because exatcly maybe im tired of hearing the za3 and vice versa because the sound is different and they both dont sound the same at all.

 

[harkpabst]

I would not say that because we don’t know how that 10% would translate into dB. It might be good enough for him but I am just not sure.

You're right, we don't know for sure. Yet, it's the perfect first step. It's free and - given that most all volume pots are logarithmic (for a good reason) - chances are that the last 10 % make a bigger difference than each of the previous 10 % steps.

Also, @Pat La Sauce still didn't tell us about the gain setting and/or the input used on 3E AUDIO A7.

 

[harkpabst]

I said the ZA3 plays louder, I didn't say I preferred it because it played louder. I prefer it because I find it sharper in the mid and high range and that is a nice fit with my speaker, and I find the A7 is more rolled-off, more layback, with a less pronounced soundstage.

The a7 has more body and thats what the za3 is missing. The hype on YouTube is just as big for the A7 as it is for the ZA3.

You guys make me laugh when you say there's no perceptible difference without even having heard it, when there's a clear and obvious difference here in my living room. Of course after a glass of wine or if im tired or whatever i would maybe prefer the A7, because exatcly maybe im tired of hearing the za3 and vice versa because the sound is different and they both dont sound the same at all.

This is obviously not the forum for you if you're hesitant to learn how your golden ears are filling you.

It's your choice to ignore the facts (and not ask us how many different amps we might have heard). You won't get much applause here for the "research" you have done. Sorry, please don't think this was something personal.

 

[Pat La Sauce]

You're right, we don't know for sure. Yet, it's the perfect first step. It's free and - given that most all volume pots are logarithmic (for a good reason) - chances are that the last 10 % make a bigger difference than each of the previous 10 % steps.

Also, @Pat La Sauce still didn't tell us about the gain setting and/or the input used on 3E AUDIO A7.

I’m in XLR with gain 100% and my preamp at ~90% to hit 95 dB

After long listening session today I’m gonna end up keeping the A7