3e audio A7/A7 Mono Amplifier Review

[SMen]

That's precisely why I asked you to completely bypass the miniDSP Flex and test without it.

During our various blind amplifier tests, we also had a few people who swore up and down that they could immediately recognize any Class D amplifier (harsh sound, harsh treble, digital, etc.).
The tests included, among others, a Class A F5 amplifier and classic Class AB amplifiers from NAD and Yamaha.
And what was the result? Without exception, everyone found the Sabaj A30a to be one of the best—a true digital amplifier without any analog circuitry. This was along with TPA325X-based PFFB amplifiers (A7, A5, PA5/II, etc.) and the more expensive Purifi amplifiers.
No one could identify any of the Class D amplifiers; quite the opposite, in fact.

On the other hand, we once had a DAC for testing that I could distinguish from any other DAC with absolute certainty, even blindfolded, because I would get a severe headache within 30 seconds of it playing music.

I've also come to consider you resistant to advice. It seems to me that you only want one answer confirmed (A7 Mono) and everything else goes against your grain.
If you really have a problem and want to solve it, this is the worst way.

It always makes the most sense to approach something like this logically and, as a first step, remove/replace components from the system one by one to see if there's a change.

Just wondering where I've missed your tests? Interesting ... and affirms my own experience with regard to the A7, A5 and a couple of others. I apologize if it's an obvious link that I should have picked up on. I've never heard a Sabaj A30a but I am not surprised.

 

[NJ coffee roaster]

That's precisely why I asked you to completely bypass the miniDSP Flex and test without it.

During our various blind amplifier tests, we also had a few people who swore up and down that they could immediately recognize any Class D amplifier (harsh sound, harsh treble, digital, etc.).
The tests included, among others, a Class A F5 amplifier and classic Class AB amplifiers from NAD and Yamaha.
And what was the result? Without exception, everyone found the Sabaj A30a to be one of the best—a true digital amplifier without any analog circuitry. This was along with TPA325X-based PFFB amplifiers (A7, A5, PA5/II, etc.) and the more expensive Purifi amplifiers.
No one could identify any of the Class D amplifiers; quite the opposite, in fact.

On the other hand, we once had a DAC for testing that I could distinguish from any other DAC with absolute certainty, even blindfolded, because I would get a severe headache within 30 seconds of it playing music.

I've also come to consider you resistant to advice. It seems to me that you only want one answer confirmed (A7 Mono) and everything else goes against your grain.
If you really have a problem and want to solve it, this is the worst way.

It always makes the most sense to approach something like this logically and, as a first step, remove/replace components from the system one by one to see if there's a change.

I have no other DAC to test, I'm not saying it cannot possibly be the DAC.

 

[Roland68]

I have no other DAC to test, I'm not saying it cannot possibly be the DAC.

You don't need another DAC for testing, just any analog source. For example, a CD player, mobile phone, DAP/MP3 player, tuner, PC/Mac with sound, etc. – anything that outputs an analog stereo signal and has an RCA or 3.5mm stereo jack connection.

 

[NJ coffee roaster]

You don't need another DAC for testing, just any analog source. For example, a CD player, mobile phone, DAP/MP3 player, tuner, PC/Mac with sound, etc. – anything that outputs an analog stereo signal and has an RCA or 3.5mm stereo jack connection.

I own 0 analog sources, I could buy an adaptor for my mac's headphone jack but then id be evaluating the internal dac of my laptop, not a great test

 

[Roland68]

I own 0 analog sources, I could buy an adaptor for my mac's headphone jack but then id be evaluating the internal dac of my laptop, not a great test

Absolutely resistant to advice.
Don't you realize that you react to every suggestion with extreme dismissal and a whole host of spurious excuses?

The Mac's DAC is known for being extremely reliable and has always had very good test results.
Of course, it's a stupid idea to rule out the MiniDSP Flex as the source of the problem, especially for the few euros/dollars a 3.5mm jack to RCA stereo cable costs.

I wish you the best of luck with your troubleshooting, but I'm out.

 

[NJ coffee roaster]

Absolutely resistant to advice.
Don't you realize that you react to every suggestion with extreme dismissal and a whole host of spurious excuses?

The Mac's DAC is known for being extremely reliable and has always had very good test results.
Of course, it's a stupid idea to rule out the MiniDSP Flex as the source of the problem, especially for the few euros/dollars a 3.5mm jack to RCA stereo cable costs.

I wish you the best of luck with your troubleshooting, but I'm out.

It is not facepalm worthy for me to assume that the DAC in a consumer laptop would not sound great.

 

[antcollinet]

It is not facepalm worthy for me to assume that the DAC in a consumer laptop would not sound great.

1 - Yes it is - it is almost certainly transparent to human hearing with speakers - and even if not, it is not bad enough to sound bad.

2 - The point isn't to get great sound - the point is to eliminate the mini DSP as the source of the harshness.

 

[Roland68]

It is not facepalm worthy for me to assume that the DAC in a consumer laptop would not sound great.

I was shaking my head because you're completely resistant to advice and fundamentally reject all suggestions that would help narrow down your problem, not because of the DAC itself.

However, the DACs in Macs are measured at a level considered absolutely transparent.
Even very experienced users would hardly be able to distinguish it from a miniDSP (of course, without any DSP settings) in a true blind test; this has been proven often enough.

 

[spookym]

The A7se has very similar measurements and about 10% less power.
However, it only has one TPA3255 chip instead of two like the A7.
As a result, it lacks 2-ohm capability.

Personally, I would recommend the A7, or if less power is needed, the slightly cheaper A5.

Apologies for following up on a couple of week old reply.

Would you be able to explain more of your reasoning?

I was under the impression that the need to drive 2-ohms is a bit of a corner-case for a sub-set of people whose speakers have such low impedance and that most don't need this.

So if you intend to drive speakers with for example, a 6 ohm nominal impedance, why would you buy an A5 over an A7SE?

I do realise the impedance profile of a loudspeaker is more complicated than the a quoted single nominal impedance figure implies.

 

[Roland68]

Apologies for following up on a couple of week old reply.

Would you be able to explain more of your reasoning?

I was under the impression that the need to drive 2-ohms is a bit of a corner-case for a sub-set of people whose speakers have such low impedance and that most don't need this.

So if you intend to drive speakers with for example, a 6 ohm nominal impedance, why would you buy an A5 over an A7SE?

I do realise the impedance profile of a loudspeaker is more complicated than the a quoted single nominal impedance figure implies.

With your last sentence, you've already answered your own question. Take a look at the B100 thread; the problems become clearer there.

There are plenty of 8-ohm speakers that have an impedance minimum of 2 ohms or less. This can quickly lead to problems or even the amplifier shutting down, even at normal volume.
If the speakers' impedance curve is known (based on real-world tests, not manufacturer specifications) and you don't plan on changing them, there's nothing wrong with the cheaper SE models, and the TPA325X are also very robust and insensitive.
My PA5/II amplifiers haven't shut down or caused any problems, even with speakers that have critical impedance.

Especially with sales, the price differences are often so small that I wouldn't try to save money.
But that's just my personal opinion.

 

[TheHighContemplator]

I just ordered a pair of the A7 Mono amplifiers. Should be here Sunday next week. Cheers to Amir for the review, and everyone whose comments gave me the confidence to pull the trigger. I was going to go with the Topping B100's, but I'm saving a few hundred dollars (CAD) and getting more power.

For the almost 30 year old PSB 800's these amps will be powering, I think I'll be in good shape.

 

[Dave TR3A]

I just ordered a pair of the A7 Mono amplifiers. Should be here Sunday next week. Cheers to Amir for the review, and everyone whose comments gave me the confidence to pull the trigger. I was going to go with the Topping B100's, but I'm saving a few hundred dollars (CAD) and getting more power.

For the almost 30 year old PSB 800's these amps will be powering, I think I'll be in good shape.

I’d be very interested in your impressions after listening to them. I, too, have been considering those two choices.

 

[jmtocali]

After 3 months as my main set of amplifiers I’m very happy with them. Currently with an Wiim Ultra as source and using the RoomFit correction. Powering a pair of KEF R3 Metas.

 

[EachDawn]

Oh no, I definitely have not tried everything, I have just thoroughly exhausted the eq option. Days before I posted here I spent many, many hours in REW with a mic.

My goal of the post was to figure out if there was something else non-eq related I could be missing before I try to swap amps. This is definitely not perceptive bias, based on the reviews here I had the best expectations for these amps and they're overall amazing performers. I did not know until recently, way after I got the amps, that there is a group of people who for whatever reason find class d fatiguing and can't figure out why, I'm worried that I may be in that group. Unless, somehow its my minidsp flex, which I doubt, but maybe?

For what it's worth, I have been testing the E3 A7 Mono and also find them harsh compared to my Rotel 1582 MKII—then again they also started sparking and shutting off when I had them placed on a metal rack, so there may be something profoundly wrong with mine.

 

[ziggurcat]

I just ordered a pair of the A7 Mono amplifiers. Should be here Sunday next week. Cheers to Amir for the review, and everyone whose comments gave me the confidence to pull the trigger. I was going to go with the Topping B100's, but I'm saving a few hundred dollars (CAD) and getting more power.

For the almost 30 year old PSB 800's these amps will be powering, I think I'll be in good shape.

I honestly wish that there was a stereo version of the B100s because that thing measures phenomenally (and since I use these amps in a desktop system situation, it seems very silly to use mono amps).

 

[Jarrett]

I honestly wish that there was a stereo version of the B100s because that thing measures phenomenally (and since I use these amps in a desktop system situation, it seems very silly to use mono amps).

I agree! The new Mini seems suspiciously cheap, the B100 should be stereo, the PA5 II discontinued leaving not much offering from Topping for stereo. Weird.

 

[TheHighContemplator]

I’d be very interested in your impressions after listening to them. I, too, have been considering those two choices.

I'm fairly positive they A7 Mono's will do everything I need. Worst case scenario, they're defective and I go with the Topping option.

I honestly wish that there was a stereo version of the B100s because that thing measures phenomenally (and since I use these amps in a desktop system situation, it seems very silly to use mono amps).

Honestly, I'm just getting the Mono version because I've always wanted mono amplifiers. Maybe there's a crosstalk advantage, but probably not very audible. Who knows. I'd have to perform a double blind experiment to be sure.

The reason I want the B100's is very much because its distortion is not frequency dependent. I've rarely seen that in an amplifier, and definitely not with such low distortion. If I could afford to splurge on the B200's, I would do it in a heartbeat.

 

[3eaudio]

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[TurtlePaul]

I just got my A7 a week ago. Happy so far. The auto standby and volume bypass are great features that I was looking for. I can turn off my CD player and walk away. The auto standby seems well tuned that my MiniDSP 2x4 HD never wakes it up without a signal but it always wakes on music.

For CD audio, it is nice to know that I am a bit or two beyond 16-bit resolution across the entire electronics chain. Bravo to 3e figuring out the PFFB and getting performance that matches earlier Hypex designs and in line with Toppings offerings without the potting compound.

 

[xanalog]

Anyone interested in multi-channel, give us your vote.

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