Hi Daniboun, and thanks for your passionate posts, very interesting. I have a question on your work that may be silly, but it's coming from a beginner: I see from the datasheet of the PSU you used has a dual output of +48v/-48v, while the 3e datasheet calls for a single power supply with Vdc to GND i.e. +48Vdc - GND. Is my interpretation correct? Whats the trick here?
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3E Audio 260-2-29A : TPA3255 / HA3588 CoilCraft / PFFB Fully differential.
- Thread starter daniboun
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antcollinet
Grand Contributor
That is quite a confusing picture. I would have interpreted that as being 96V
OP
daniboun
Major Contributor
- Thread Starter
- #844
Read the Audiophonics spec ) all described
There are two 48V outputs, so if you decide to use both, you divide the 5A current by two.
MP-H250S48 SMPS Switching Mode Power Supply Module 250W 48V 5A PFC - Audiophonics
This SMPS MP-H250S48 switch-mode power supply module is capable of delivering 48V voltage and 5A current for 250W of power. It also features PFC (Power Factor Correction).
www.audiophonics.fr
Allright then ...but in this case the notation of the PSU terminals should read +48 Vdc - GND. Shouldn't it? Just to avoid confusion ...
antcollinet
Grand Contributor
Yes - it is just the picture that is misleading.
Finally, my exact resistors and capacitors arrived from China, and now I was able to complete my project on the 3e amplifier. After replacing the elements, I really got the sensitivity I needed and the maximum power I needed of 65W per channel without clipping, which was confirmed by measurements. 3e calculated the necessary elements very well! When powered by 43V, the amplifier barely heats up, only the 1656 op-amp heats up, but I think this is normal. SAMP200 at the same supply voltage heated up noticeably more.
Now I am testing the amplifier in different scenarios and modes and I definitely like it more than the SAMP-200!
Now I am testing the amplifier in different scenarios and modes and I definitely like it more than the SAMP-200!
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Hello 3E team! Last time you helped me a lot with sensitivity settings, but there is one problem: when turning off, there is a loud pop. To check, I completely disconnect the inputs and supply only power. I know that there is a PS_CTRL power on/off regulator on the board. I ask for help in supplementing the circuit and correctly implementing this mode, preferably with the ability to delay when turning on and off to eliminate pops. I know that there are separate circuits with relays for such purposes, but I want to implement this using a signal on the PS_CTRL board and ask for a circuit for independently implementing this feature. Perhaps this has already been designed by you, but not implemented, since there are places on the board near the connector for uninstalled elements.
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How can be done this?
somebodyelse
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By swapping some components for different values. See https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ft-pffb-fully-differential.47660/post-2299867
If I understood correctly, he wants to reduce the sensitivity, and I wanted to increase it.
I apologise in advance for this post. Its long - and to most readers will be very boring and typically newbie! I promise you I have done plenty of reading and expanded my knowledge considerably and not just come here without looking - but there is a lot of information and some of it is contradictory!.
I believe I now know enough to be dangerous! And I therefore need help.. I wish to put together a high end 6 channel power amp - but I can't afford it! So this is my alternative plan..
The new amp will, for now, be fed unbalanced inputs from a Denon AVR in preamp mode, maximum output voltage around 1.5V. Gain required will be limited (pretty small room) but the five speakers (all the same) are not easy to drive. The sixth output/channel will probably not be used.
Components I have in mind excluding the bits and pieces and connectors, case etc :-
3 x 3E AUDIO 260-2-29A PFFB Stereo amplifier Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/ampl...lifier-module-tpa3255-btl-2x260w-p-17252.html
3 x Single-Ended to Balanced Converter Module XLR / RCA Stereo https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/sele...-converter-module-xlr-rca-stereo-p-18248.html allows me to use SE inputs and play with opamps, without having to modify the 3E boards . Plus go XLR later as and when I decide to get a "proper" preamp.
1 x MORNSUN LOF550-20B36 SMPS Power Supply Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/smps-power-supply/mornsun-lof550-20b36-module-p-18591.html or do I need better "quality" ? More wattage ? Higher voltage? Probably..I suspect
1 x PSU for the opamp boards (+15v-0- -15V) but what and where from? Needs to be over 600mA?
I would like to maintain as much as possible the inherent performance of these boards without getting silly. My current thoughts and worries are
Incidentally the case I am thinking of using is big. It's a full width 3U rack mount (ADA amplifier currently). Weighing 35kg..I just cant stand the transformer hum anymore - and for what it would cost to fix I can probably build this! Well nearly....
The case is big enough to fit a badger family and their squirrel cousins...so I have room to keep stuff physically spaced out.
Thank you for any help and pointers
I believe I now know enough to be dangerous! And I therefore need help.. I wish to put together a high end 6 channel power amp - but I can't afford it! So this is my alternative plan..
The new amp will, for now, be fed unbalanced inputs from a Denon AVR in preamp mode, maximum output voltage around 1.5V. Gain required will be limited (pretty small room) but the five speakers (all the same) are not easy to drive. The sixth output/channel will probably not be used.
Components I have in mind excluding the bits and pieces and connectors, case etc :-
3 x 3E AUDIO 260-2-29A PFFB Stereo amplifier Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/ampl...lifier-module-tpa3255-btl-2x260w-p-17252.html
3 x Single-Ended to Balanced Converter Module XLR / RCA Stereo https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/sele...-converter-module-xlr-rca-stereo-p-18248.html allows me to use SE inputs and play with opamps, without having to modify the 3E boards . Plus go XLR later as and when I decide to get a "proper" preamp.
1 x MORNSUN LOF550-20B36 SMPS Power Supply Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/smps-power-supply/mornsun-lof550-20b36-module-p-18591.html or do I need better "quality" ? More wattage ? Higher voltage? Probably..I suspect
1 x PSU for the opamp boards (+15v-0- -15V) but what and where from? Needs to be over 600mA?
I would like to maintain as much as possible the inherent performance of these boards without getting silly. My current thoughts and worries are
- Am I on the right track? Or way off the mark?
- Do I need to set up the slave and master settings on the boards - and/or would I be better going with individual PSU's for each module or ?? . Seems to be conflicting info out there - less wires the better as far as I am concerned.? But I think I understand how the "correct" setting may help the PSU?
- Have I got a risk of PSU bus pumping anyway withe the boards being BTL? If so?
- Assume most people would change Opamps for 1612's? How much will these opamp boards/connections drag down the overall amplifier boards performance - I guess not a lot. And my soldering isnt brilliant!
Incidentally the case I am thinking of using is big. It's a full width 3U rack mount (ADA amplifier currently). Weighing 35kg..I just cant stand the transformer hum anymore - and for what it would cost to fix I can probably build this! Well nearly....
The case is big enough to fit a badger family and their squirrel cousins...so I have room to keep stuff physically spaced out.
Thank you for any help and pointers
Roland68
Major Contributor
Unfortunately, you're on a path that's, as you say, silly.I apologise in advance for this post. Its long - and to most readers will be very boring and typically newbie! I promise you I have done plenty of reading and expanded my knowledge considerably and not just come here without looking - but there is a lot of information and some of it is contradictory!.
I believe I now know enough to be dangerous! And I therefore need help.. I wish to put together a high end 6 channel power amp - but I can't afford it! So this is my alternative plan..
The new amp will, for now, be fed unbalanced inputs from a Denon AVR in preamp mode, maximum output voltage around 1.5V. Gain required will be limited (pretty small room) but the five speakers (all the same) are not easy to drive. The sixth output/channel will probably not be used.
Components I have in mind excluding the bits and pieces and connectors, case etc :-
3 x 3E AUDIO 260-2-29A PFFB Stereo amplifier Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/ampl...lifier-module-tpa3255-btl-2x260w-p-17252.html
3 x Single-Ended to Balanced Converter Module XLR / RCA Stereo https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/sele...-converter-module-xlr-rca-stereo-p-18248.html allows me to use SE inputs and play with opamps, without having to modify the 3E boards . Plus go XLR later as and when I decide to get a "proper" preamp.
1 x MORNSUN LOF550-20B36 SMPS Power Supply Module https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/smps-power-supply/mornsun-lof550-20b36-module-p-18591.html or do I need better "quality" ? More wattage ? Higher voltage? Probably..I suspect
1 x PSU for the opamp boards (+15v-0- -15V) but what and where from? Needs to be over 600mA?
I would like to maintain as much as possible the inherent performance of these boards without getting silly. My current thoughts and worries are
If I have got this all wrong, just tell me I'm an idiot - and I'll go and sulk.. and hope you tell me what I should be doing! I don't want to buy a built unit- I want to have a go at putting one together myself.
- Am I on the right track? Or way off the mark?
- Do I need to set up the slave and master settings on the boards - and/or would I be better going with individual PSU's for each module or ?? . Seems to be conflicting info out there - less wires the better as far as I am concerned.? But I think I understand how the "correct" setting may help the PSU?
- Have I got a risk of PSU bus pumping anyway withe the boards being BTL? If so?
- Assume most people would change Opamps for 1612's? How much will these opamp boards/connections drag down the overall amplifier boards performance - I guess not a lot. And my soldering isnt brilliant!
Incidentally the case I am thinking of using is big. It's a full width 3U rack mount (ADA amplifier currently). Weighing 35kg..I just cant stand the transformer hum anymore - and for what it would cost to fix I can probably build this! Well nearly....
The case is big enough to fit a badger family and their squirrel cousins...so I have room to keep stuff physically spaced out.
Thank you for any help and pointers
Stay away from those ridiculous modules; you don't need them with the 3E audio boards.
Do you really think such cheap boards do anything useful in front of the 3E audio amplifiers other than add noise and distortion?
You should really refrain from swapping op amps in such sophisticated amplifiers as these; you'll only make things worse. Replacing op amps is usually pointless, and without adapting the entire circuitry of the op amp, it's the opposite of sensible.
I would use one power supply per amplifier, but 550 watts is too high. 350-400 watts is sufficient. Whether 36/38 or 48 volts depends on what power you need.
You can look for used Mean Well power supplies, for example, on eBay. Maybe you can get something from the HRP series for a good price.
As for your ADA amplifier, see what you can get for a used/broken one. You might be surprised.
Roland. Thanks for the reply. I only sulked for an hour...
With regard to the opamp boards - either I use the ones I suggested or modify the boards? I need Opamps one way or another to run SE inputs? These boards are not set up for SE input only balanced from reading the manual?
Thanks for the comments on the PSU's - will look into that. Honestly I like the sound of seperate PSU's. Apart from potential ground loops it stops other areas of concern.
The ADA amp is perfect ( long story but I got it 5 years ago and it was new - still in its box and plastic wrapped. ) It is though 20 years old and stuff decays; ask me how I know !?
. The toroid is crazy loud though and I can hear it in the next room. Unless people have got their AV located somewhere else than their viewing area they wont buy it - they will buy something shiny and new! I haveto say having opened it up the other day I have never ever seen cap's that big! Proper scary!again thanks for your input
..and I just found this thread. Most helpful on PSU's. Thanks.
Help with Power Supply
Hello, guys, first Time poster and Newbie... I was planing on building an amp using the 3E Audio 480-1-9A Modules in the next Months and I was browsing some Parts when I came across these Power supplies on local classifieds and they were Mean Well which I understood is a good brand, but they...
www.audiosciencereview.com
Update and the usual cautionary warning... I have gone with an HRP650-N3 PSU. If that does what its supposed to re peak supply and does it fast enough that should be more than sufficent. Guess only listening will tell me if its OK to me.
Cautionary bit? I blew an amplifier board.. lots of magic smoke. Dont ever think "what happens if I just....." When the amp is still on! Up till that point it had been going swimmingly.
Question? Does the 3E board discharge the caps at shutdown or do they remain charged?
I have also gone for the SE to balanced adaptor boards to provide SE inputs. I did the first amplifier board ( that is now defunct) "properly" by fitting 4562's and removing the two resistors. Very pleased with result. But there was a definite level of terror while I was doing it and I just simply figure the chance of me doing the other three without a disaster is close to nil! Plus I will go balanced source at some point and it's a lot easier to unplug stuff than unsolder opamps when I do! I do appreciate I will be taking a hit performance wise. Probably.
Cautionary bit? I blew an amplifier board.. lots of magic smoke. Dont ever think "what happens if I just....." When the amp is still on! Up till that point it had been going swimmingly.
Question? Does the 3E board discharge the caps at shutdown or do they remain charged?
I have also gone for the SE to balanced adaptor boards to provide SE inputs. I did the first amplifier board ( that is now defunct) "properly" by fitting 4562's and removing the two resistors. Very pleased with result. But there was a definite level of terror while I was doing it and I just simply figure the chance of me doing the other three without a disaster is close to nil! Plus I will go balanced source at some point and it's a lot easier to unplug stuff than unsolder opamps when I do! I do appreciate I will be taking a hit performance wise. Probably.
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