High-end passive bookshelf speakers vs mid-range active studio monitors

[Pearljam5000]

I was wondering how would mid priced active studio monitors like Genelec 8050B/8350A, or Neumann KH310, compete with high end, high priced passive speakers like the Focal Diablo Utopia and Dynaudio Heritage Special etc?
Basically they're both 2-way speakers(except the KH310) that should perform very well.
How and why would these Focals be better than the studio monitors i mentioned? I mean they cost much more so they should sound definitely better.

 

[SKBubba]

$17,000 for a pair of bookshelf speakers? I don't care how good they sound. For that kind of money they'd better make me coffee, take out the trash, and make my car get 50mpg.

 

[LTig]

In highend audio there is no relation between price and performance.

 

[FrantzM]

ASR ( Anti Scientific Reply) coming in:

The Neumann KH 310A, Genelec 8351 , JBL 708p will likely wipe the floor with thing with money left for a pair of SVS or Rythmik subwoofers.
Heck, I’d like a blind comparison with a pair of JBL LSR 308 ....

 

[LTig]

Regarding this Focal speaker I'm sure it will fail the spinorama test. 2-way without wave guide is a recipe for bad off axis FR.

 

[LTig]

ASR ( Anti Scientific Reply) coming in:

The Neumann KH 310A, Genelec 8351 , JBL 708p will likely wipe the floor with thing with money left for a pair of SVS or Rythmik subwoofers.
Heck, I’d like a blind comparison with a pair of JBL LSR 308 ....

You could get a pair of Neumann KH420 and several KH750 subs and still have money left.

 

[VintageFlanker]

How and why would these Focals be better than the studio monitors i mentioned? I mean they cost much more so they should sound definitely better

I don't know about Diablo Utopia. I believe that @PierreV owns a pair, maybe may comment on this.

Cheaper Sopra n°1 measure very well, on the other hand:

And IMHO, looks better:

Regarding this Focal speaker I'm sure it will fail the spinorama test. 2-way without wave guide is a recipe for bad off axis FR.

Measurements from SoundStage seem to show otherwise.

 

[LTig]

Cheaper Sopra n°1 measure very well, on the other hand:View attachment 127552

Well yes, but where is the Bass? FR drops below 80 Hz. Hey, even my tiny Genelec 8020a offer more bass ...

 

[PierreV]

I don't know about Diablo Utopia. I believe that @PierreV owns a pair, maybe may comment on this.

I own a pair of Focal, yes, but not that model, the Scala.

 

[Descartes]

I own a pair of Focal, yes, but not that model, the Scala.

View attachment 127554

Very nice setup

 

[VintageFlanker]

Well yes, but where is the Bass? FR drops below 80 Hz. Hey, even my tiny Genelec 8020a offer more bass ...

They don't.
Just about any anechoic measurements from NRC/SoundStage show the same drop off. They advertise them as not reliable under 100Hz.

See the massive KEF R11:

Or Revel F206:

 

[richard12511]

I own a pair of Focal, yes, but not that model, the Scala.

View attachment 127554

Wow! Jealous.

 

[richard12511]

I don't know about Diablo Utopia. I believe that @PierreV owns a pair, maybe may comment on this.

Cheaper Sopra n°1 measure very well, on the other hand:View attachment 127552

And IMHO, looks better:

Measurements from SoundStage seem to show otherwise.

Those do actually look excellent, which is surprising for a 2 way with no waveguide. Maybe there's something to inverted dome and grill. Not quite Genelec/Neumann good, but almost.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Love how the Utopia magnets look lol

 

[richard12511]

I own a pair of Focal, yes, but not that model, the Scala.

View attachment 127554

Which do you like more?

 

[PierreV]

Which do you like more?

Can't honestly say. In sighted tests I would have sworn the Giya. When I tested blind the differences almost vanished.

 

[q3cpma]

I was wondering how would mid priced active studio monitors like Genelec 8050B/8350A, or Neumann KH310, compete with high end, high priced passive speakers like the Focal Diablo Utopia and Dynaudio Heritage Special etc?
Basically they're both 2-way speakers(except the KH310) that should perform very well.
How and why would these Focals be better than the studio monitors i mentioned? I mean they cost much more so they should sound definitely better.
View attachment 127548

There's just no comparison between companies that are completely performance oriented and those who are shackled (or protected) by a mostly design oriented customer base.

 

[jonfitch]

I think if the directivity of the drivers are comparable, if you were to run room correction on them they should be equally preferable.

For example if you compared say TAD CR1 and Dutch and Dutch 8C and corrected them both with Dirac Live 3.0 could you really say one or the other is the better speaker?

 

[q3cpma]

I think if the directivity of the drivers are comparable, if you were to run room correction on them they should be equally preferable.

For example if you compared say TAD CR1 and Dutch and Dutch 8C and corrected them both with Dirac Live 3.0 could you really say one or the other is the better speaker?

Hard to say, Dirac can't make the TAD cardioid/CD like the D&D, nor does it give an integrated subwoofer. On the other hand, the D&D can't magically become coaxial.

 

[Head_Unit]

how would mid priced active studio monitors...compete with high end, high priced passive speakers

Tricky question. I suspect the devil is in the details of exactly which versus which. Active speakers can in theory have advantages, however all speakers are limited by the quality and linearity of their transducers. Active internal crossovers cannot make cheaper drivers sound better than far better (presumably far more expensive) ones.

It would be more fair to compare budget-to-budget, active speakers vs passive PLUS amplification.

Now, DSP can perhaps make up shortcomings of lesser drivers to some extent but I don't think that has percolated too much to lower price points-at least not really sophisticated DSP for linearisation.