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Anthem AVM60 Review (AV Processor)

Golfx

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You will love the a110. I got it in late December to use as just a prepro. It is working trouble free.
I was dragging my feet to see how the AVM 70/90 tested but boy am I glad I didn’t go that buggy route.
 

tparm

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You will love the a110. I got it in late December to use as just a prepro. It is working trouble free.
Thanks! mine just arrived. I will use with my A 52+ 5CH amp and use onboard amps for front wides and four ceiling channels. Eventually would to add a 2CH amp (probably A 21+ as I likely will never be able to afford an MC312) but for now I am set. I move into my new home that is being built in July so I really won't have full impressions until then as I am in a townhouse until then.
 

Golfx

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Thanks! mine just arrived. I will use with my A 52+ 5CH amp and use onboard amps for front wides and four ceiling channels. Eventually would to add a 2CH amp (probably A 21+ as I likely will never be able to afford an MC312) but for now I am set. I move into my new home that is being built in July so I really won't have full impressions until then as I am in a townhouse until then.
Congrats on your new home!
 

walt99

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So 110 has the two speaker presets?
I really don't see the need for this, the AVM70 had it but my new A110 just switches automatically to the speaker mode for the source selected, ie when playing 2 ch it goes to 2ch mode and when playing HT mode it plays all the speaker as set up. So even though the 70 had that it seems the A110 does the same thing without having to assign the mode. What am I missing?
 

ivo.f.doma

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Also disconnects the power amplifiers, resets the PRE / PRO mode and assigns another Audysey equalization curve?
My 18 year old Pioneer VSX-AX3 has it.
 

tparm

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I really don't see the need for this, the AVM70 had it but my new A110 just switches automatically to the speaker mode for the source selected, ie when playing 2 ch it goes to 2ch mode and when playing HT mode it plays all the speaker as set up. So even though the 70 had that it seems the A110 does the same thing without having to assign the mode. What am I missing?
On my X4700 I used the two presets for a subwoofer in both sealed and open formats. Sometimes when watching live music videos or upsampling music to a surround format (blasphemy I know) I preferred my subs in sealed mode. It can be achieve by loading different profiles from the Editor app but it is an additional step. By adding the X16 and listening Pure Direct 2CH only this may be less of an issue.
 

peng

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Short answer: the room is corrected below the transition frequency and the speakers are corrected above it, which may or may not be good :oops:

Longer answer:

First, you may want to read that article: Overview and Approach to Room Acoustics | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum. Below the transition frequency, the measured response is mostly determined by the room. Above, the speakers mostly determine the response. As an example, you could refer to my earlier post in this thread (ARC results): above 250Hz the responses of the left and right speakers (in red: before correction) are mostly identical. If room correction is applied above the transition frequency, the speakers rather than the room are equalized. This is not a bad thing per se as it makes the system more transparent. On the other hand, you may have chosen your speakers because your like their tonality and this is lost after room correction.

There are also two additional points to consider. Firstly, good speakers pairs have typically a matched frequency response (both amplitude and phase) to allow for a good imaging. Room correction may alter this matching because often the correction is applied on each speaker independently: amplitude matching will stay good or improve but it is unclear what happens with phase matching (likely it worsens). Imaging may be altered/degraded with room correction. On the other hand, phase matching isn't as critical as amplitude matching, so it may not be audible. Secondly, speakers and microphones tend to become directive at high-frequency. If measurements are not taken very carefully, the room correction may correct measurement artefacts rather than real issues at high frequency (for example, Anthem historically limited the highest frequency correction to 5kHz).

I read about the phase thing stuff too. I don't know about Anthem ARC but I know Audyssey XT32 never messed up imaging, phase etc., based on my experienced, also supported by numerous REW plots I have done on my D+M AVRs/AVPs. May be it would do it to other's but not to my two rooms. In those forums talks about phase and stuff, I don't recall seeing anyone posted supportive evidence (such as graphs), not even in the low frequencies, let alone the high frequencies that as you alluded to, likely not critical anyway. There seem to be so much hearsay on the internet, I am sure some are true, or true under some conditions but too many are just misconceptions/myths.
 

Rottmannash

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yanm

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I read about the phase thing stuff too. I don't know about Anthem ARC but I know Audyssey XT32 never messed up imaging, phase etc., based on my experienced, also supported by numerous REW plots I have done on my D+M AVRs/AVPs. May be it would do it to other's but not to my two rooms. In those forums talks about phase and stuff, I don't recall seeing anyone posted supportive evidence (such as graphs), not even in the low frequencies, let alone the high frequencies that as you alluded to, likely not critical anyway. There seem to be so much hearsay on the internet, I am sure some are true, or true under some conditions but too many are just misconceptions/myths.

I am actually reading the Toole’s book and there is some allusion to phase: in mono at least, some people can detect differences in the phase response but only with very specific test sound - not really with music. Most likely mismatch in the phase responses does not influence the imaging... but I’ve not yet seen a mention of that, one way or the other (most of Toole’s speaker analysis methodology is based on mono).

On the other hand, I think I understand better why automated equalisation at high frequency may be a bad idea. Regarding the irregularities in the frequency response, Toole makes the distinction between resonances and interference. Resonances have similar shape on-axis and off-axis and thus in the sound power. Interferences have resonance-like shape in e.g. the on-axis but not necessarily in the off-axis nor the sound power. Equalising resonances works well and sound quality is perceptually improved. If, on the other hand, the automated room correction system tries to correct interferences it may actually creates additional resonance-like artefacts in the sound power, which degrades the perceived sound quality. One of the examples he gave of interferences was related to cross-over regions... which are indeed typically above the room transition frequency. He also made a strong case for equalising the response predicted from anechoic measurements rather than from in-room measurements - which is unfortunately impractical for most of us...

(edits: improving legibility and corrected typos)
 
Last edited:

peng

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On the other hand, I think I understand better why automated equalisation at high frequency may be a bad idea. Regarding the irregularities in the frequency response, Toole makes the distinction between resonances and interference. Resonances have similar shape on-axis and off-axis and thus in the sound power. Interferences have resonance-like shape in e.g. the on-axis but not necessarily in the off-axis nor the sound power. Equalising resonances works well and sound quality is perceptually improved. If, on the other hand, the automated room correction system tries to correct interferences it may actually creates additional resonance-like artefacts in the sound power, which degrades the perceived sound quality. One of the examples he gave of interferences was related to cross-over regions... which are indeed typically above the room transition frequency. He also made a strong case for equalising the response predicted from anechoic measurements rather than from in-room measurements - which is unfortunately impractical for most of us...

(edits: improving legibility and corrected typos)

In additional to your points, the way I read and interpret it, at least he did not totally discount EQ'ing the frequencies above Schroeder's the issue seems to be more about the difficulty for the REQ system to collect the proper information it needs to create the right filters. It's been a while so I don't remember the details. If I have time to re-read that part, I could then quote the part I am referring to. I wish he would do a follow up on the latest Dirac, AARC and Audyssey now that they all provide user customization. I bet he would agree with customization, EQ above the transition frequency can in fact work depending on how it is used. The way I use customization is a bit like how amp designers use negative feedback.:D It is complicated to explain but I think it works, working for me anyway.
 

yanm

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In additional to your points, the way I read and interpret it, at least he did not totally discount EQ'ing the frequencies above Schroeder's the issue seems to be more about the difficulty for the REQ system to collect the proper information it needs to create the right filters. It's been a while so I don't remember the details. If I have time to re-read that part, I could then quote the part I am referring to. I wish he would do a follow up on the latest Dirac, AARC and Audyssey now that they all provide user customization. I bet he would agree with customization, EQ above the transition frequency can in fact work depending on how it is used. The way I use customization is a bit like how amp designers use negative feedback.:D It is complicated to explain but I think it works, working for me anyway.

Exactly, I think that was his point: if you have a spinorama measurements you can do proper equalisation because you’ve all the information. In-room measurements, even with spatial averaging, are missing critical pieces of information (e.g., resonances vs interferences) for proper equalisation above the transition frequency....

With ARC, one can customise the target curve only so much for high frequency: tilt, tilt start frequency, and maximal equalisation frequency or, in case a full-bandwidth correction, high-frequency roll-off. As far as I know, one cannot exclude certain zone of the spectra from the correction... I don’t know about Dirac or Audyssey.
 

SimpleTheater

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FYI Anthem has kindly contacted me. I am following up. Nothing else to report. :)

I can’t help but laugh at the incompetence of Anthem’s marketing department. Two of my neighbors are building home theaters and were aware of Anthem from a dealer about an hour away that sells high-end products. I let them know about this review and the dealer convinced them that none of this matters. One of them was ready to order this week and asked me what was Anthem’s response to the review and when I said it’s just crickets now, he pulled the trigger on a Denon 8500. I should make a commission on Denon AVR sales because when people see my Yamaha and hear me recommend a Denon, it seems to pack an aura of authority. Kind of like seeing someone driving a Camry and they tell you “I should have gotten the Accord.”
 
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I can’t help but laugh at the incompetence of Anthem’s marketing department. Two of my neighbors are building home theaters and were aware of Anthem from a dealer about an hour away that sells high-end products. I let them know about this review and the dealer convinced them that none of this matters. One of them was ready to order this week and asked me what was Anthem’s response to the review and when I said it’s just crickets now, he pulled the trigger on a Denon 8500. I should make a commission on Denon AVR sales because when people see my Yamaha and hear me recommend a Denon, it seems to pack an aura of authority. Kind of like seeing someone driving a Camry and they tell you “I should have gotten the Accord.”
I share your disappointment. However, ASR should also have been much more proactive about getting another sample of used Anthem equipment, and samples of Anthem's new line. If you're going to open a can of worms by testing used equipment and discovering odd results then be a genuine enthusiast resource and test other samples - from sources other than Anthem - and let's get down to results we can actually draw conclusions from. Otherwise, this whole 'controversy' seems like the hair-pulling of over-wrought high school girls.
 
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amirm

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I share your disappointment. However, ASR should also have been much more proactive about getting another sample of used Anthem equipment, and samples of Anthem's new line.
That request was made after Anthem investigated the issue. I now have both another sample of AVM60 and AVM70. Have not had time to unbox either though due to extreme workload with countless time critical reviews.

If you're going to open a can of worms by testing used equipment and discovering odd results then be a genuine enthusiast resource and test other samples - from sources other than Anthem - and let's get down to results we can actually draw conclusions from. Otherwise, this whole 'controversy' seems like the hair-pulling of over-wrought high school girls.
There is no indication (from Anthem) that something was wrong with the sample that I tested with regards to performance measurements. As I noted, the sample had just come back from Anthem service. It is actually back there again to debug some of the things that failed at the end of the video (setup button not working, etc.).
 

Descartes

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That request was made after Anthem investigated the issue. I now have both another sample of AVM60 and AVM70. Have not had time to unbox either though due to extreme workload with countless time critical reviews.

There is no indication (from Anthem) that something was wrong with the sample that I tested with regards to performance measurements. As I noted, the sample had just come back from Anthem service. It is actually back there again to debug some of the things that failed at the end of the video (setup button not working, etc.).

What is your ETA for your updated review?
 
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