Choosing between the Denon X8500H, X6700H, X4700H and X3700H (Updated)

[tifune]

No Audyssey on Zone 2/3. I have looked and I don’t think any AVRs/Processors provide this. I would like to be proven wrong, however.

Thank you - any decide you know of that can do it, even if it's a dedicated pre? I assume Mini dsp SHD can be routed in such a way, but a bit of a price jump there since there's no amp. PowerSHD is only 2 channel out I believe

 

[amper42]

By chance, anyone know if Audyssey can be applied to each zone? Currently it's pretty easy to find a Monolith 5 channel amp for same price (used) as a 3700H or new for a little less than a 4700H.

Obviously this isn't a direct comparison but my situation is a single source (HTPC) with Kef R3+sub in zone 1, Kali IN-8+sub in zone2 and LSR305+sub in zone 3. It's for 2 channel playback only, I doubt I will ever make a home theater. I don't even need the extra 3 channels, I just happened to catch the used 5ch for same cost as the 2 channel. Unfortunately I can't bi-amp the R3's - wiring is already in the walls.

Ive measured our typical volume around 83dB from 20ft so I don't think I really need the extra power - only 50W RMS per the various calculators. Overall distortion seems to be in the same ballpark when staying within spec:

https://www.audioholics.com/amplifier-reviews/monoprice-monolith-7-channel-amplifier-review/3

Even accounting for published THD .08% Denon vs .03% Monolith, my room is entirely untreated stone/hardwood so masking will surely override that delta. And yes, it will stay that way due to WAF.

I believe correction would be far more useful but if it only applies to 1 zone the value proposition drops a bit. Checked the manual and google, but all I could find was this somewhat ambiguous audioholics quote suggesting it isn't possible on the 8500:

"though I still wish I could run Audyssey on Zone 2 and Zone 3 and have native Roon support!"

Not sure if that means there's no Audyssey on 2/3 or just no Audyssey on 2/3 when using roon.

You have two issues with this question:
1. Audyssey only supports Zone 1.
2. Zone 2 and 3 only work with internal amps with Denon Amp Assign, NOT with pre-outs. Unfortunately, it's a limitation of the current design. Same with 3700, 4700, 6700 "Preamp" mode in amp assign. It only supports the channels as labeled on the Chassis. It would be nice if Amp Assign supported all modes with pre-outs but currently that is not the case.

 

[tifune]

You have two issues with this question:
1. Audyssey only supports Zone 1.
2. Zone 2 and 3 only work with internal amps with Denon Amp Assign, NOT with pre-outs. Unfortunately, it's a limitation of the current design. Same with 3700, 4700, 6700 "Preamp" mode in amp assign. It only supports the channels as labeled on the Chassis. It would be nice if Amp Assign supported all modes with pre-outs but currently that is not the case.

I see what you mean - are you awaer of any devices that can support 3 "zones" of correction? I understand it may be a dedicated pre, MiniDSP, etc.

 

[Dj7675]

Anthem released a pretty neat product providing amplification, ARC room correction, and I think even subwoofer outputs..
https://anthemav.com/products-current/type=distribution

 

[opus]

After read complete posts about x4700h and x6700, I still don't know what I should choose, comparing this two there are few differences, processing of 11ch vs 13ch, dialogue lift vs dialogue enhancer, dts x pro, and mono block amp for x6700h.
Have you any experience with dts x pro? Is this a really value contribution comparing to dts x, or its just marketing solution? Do you know what is playing from center height channel, is this something similar to center channel? Because when its useless then make no sense pay aprox 1000€ more for X6700h.
VOG is supported by both of them.

Thanks opus

 

[Dj7675]

After read complete posts about x4700h and x6700, I still don't know what I should choose, comparing this two there are few differences, processing of 11ch vs 13ch, dialogue lift vs dialogue enhancer, dts x pro, and mono block amp for x6700h.
Have you any experience with dts x pro? Is this a really value contribution comparing to dts x, or its just marketing solution? Do you know what is playing from center hight channel, is this something similar to center channel? Because when its useless then make no sense pay aprox 1000€ more for X6700h.
VOG is supported by both of them.

Thanks opus

Couple of my thoughts:
If you go to 13 channels, DTSX Pro is really good. It is very noticeable when I am running 6 height channels.
Dialogue enhances works very well, but don’t use it too often
Monoblock amps... must not matter much because it seems the lower end Denon’s actually measure better in regards to amps it seems
My opinion is if you don’t plan on using/wanting 13 channels, the 4700 would be the better choice. If you have plans or want to use a mix of external amps, my vote would actually be shopping for an open box X8500 unit from an authorized dealer rather than an x6700. I haven’t looked lately but these can be found from $3k to $3200 last time I looked.

 

[amper42]

After read complete posts about x4700h and x6700, I still don't know what I should choose, comparing this two there are few differences, processing of 11ch vs 13ch, dialogue lift vs dialogue enhancer, dts x pro, and mono block amp for x6700h.
Have you any experience with dts x pro? Is this a really value contribution comparing to dts x, or its just marketing solution? Do you know what is playing from center hight channel, is this something similar to center channel? Because when its useless then make no sense pay aprox 1000€ more for X6700h.
VOG is supported by both of them.

Thanks opus

The Denon 6700 is a nice receiver. If you plan to use it's internal amps and have low sensitivity speakers it might be worth the extra money? However, if you plan to use the receiver in preamp mode then the internal amps don't really matter. I use the Denon 4700 in preamp mode with a 7.2.4 configuration and it does a great job. The movie voices are clear and I don't have to fiddle with increasing the volume on the center channel. It automatically detects the movie sound mode and switches to it whether its DTS:X, ATMOS or whatever I throw at it.

In addition, it works well in stereo mode or with Auro-3D using 7.2.4. You can always spend more, but I have no complaints about the 4700. The $20 AC Infinity MULTIFAN S7, Quiet Dual 120mm USB Fan keeps it cool and it fits my needs. My best advice is go with the 3700 if you won't use Auro-3D, otherwise get the 4700. Personally, I don't see the added value in the 6700 if you plan to use the new excellent preamp mode included with the 3700, 4700 and 6700.

 

[opus]

Couple of my thoughts:
If you go to 13 channels, DTSX Pro is really good. It is very noticeable when I am running 6 height channels.
Dialogue enhances works very well, but don’t use it too often
Monoblock amps... must not matter much because it seems the lower end Denon’s actually measure better in regards to amps it seems
My opinion is if you don’t plan on using/wanting 13 channels, the 4700 would be the better choice. If you have plans or want to use a mix of external amps, my vote would actually be shopping for an open box X8500 unit from an authorized dealer rather than an x6700. I haven’t looked lately but these can be found from $3k to $3200 last time I looked.

Which speaker layout are you using for height speakers? Front, middle and rear, or you are using center height and vog? I plan to use mainly internal amps, and for future maybe will buy stereo external amp for front. I would like to go to 13 channels but x6700h cost 1000€ more than x4700 and this is my dilemma.

 

[amper42]

Which speaker layout are you using for height speakers? Front, middle and rear, or you are using center height and vog? I plan to use mainly internal amps, and for future maybe will buy stereo external amp for front. I would like to go to 13 channels but x6700h cost 1000€ more than x4700 and this is my dilemma.

If you are looking for more bang for the buck, I would suggest using the $1000 saving from the 4700 purchase to buy yourself a Purifi stereo amp for the fronts.
https://vtvamplifier.com/product/vtv-amplifier-purifi-eigentakt-stereo-amplifier-based-on-eval-1/
or
https://www.marchaudio.net.au/p452

I'm using the March Audio P452 Purifi based amp with my fronts on the Denon 4700 and it offers lots of clean power. Much more than I could expect from the Denon 6700. I'm using the monoprice cables to connect the 4700 to the P452.
https://www.monoprice.com/product?c_id=301&cp_id=30110&cs_id=3011010&p_id=4777&seq=1&format=2

 

[opus]

If you are looking for more bang for the buck, I would suggest using the $1000 saving from the 4700 purchase to buy yourself a Purifi stereo amp for the fronts.
https://vtvamplifier.com/product/vtv-amplifier-purifi-eigentakt-stereo-amplifier-based-on-eval-1/
or
https://www.marchaudio.net.au/p452

I'm using the March Audio P452 Purifi based amp with my fronts on the Denon 4700 and it offers lots of clean power. Much more than I could expect from the Denon 6700. I'm using the monoprice cables to connect the 4700 to the P452.
https://www.monoprice.com/product?c_id=301&cp_id=30110&cs_id=3011010&p_id=4777&seq=1&format=2

Thanks for answer, this is one of solution to buy x4700 + external stereo amp for the fronts. I dont plan to drive full 11 channels with external amps. I have small room and as well small bookshelf speakers, currently using 5.0.4 without sub. Unfortunately my x4300h is gone, and looking for new one .

 

[Dj7675]

Which speaker layout are you using for height speakers? Front, middle and rear, or you are using center height and vog? I plan to use mainly internal amps, and for future maybe will buy stereo external amp for front. I would like to go to 13 channels but x6700h cost 1000€ more than x4700 and this is my dilemma.

Using FH/TM/RH

 

[opus]

Reason why I consider x6700h is front center height channel, because my center channel is below 120 inch screen and dialogs in movies are not in center of screen and crossing fingers that front center height could solve it. Does anyone have experiences with front center height channel?

 

[amper42]

Reason why I consider x6700h is front center height channel, because my center channel is below 120 inch screen and dialogs in movies are not in center of screen and crossing fingers that front center height could solve it. Does anyone have experiences with front center height channel?

I found high quality Front Left and Right speakers can make a big difference in the clarity of dialog. If your center channel is not doing the job (even with sound level elevated), then I would try pointing the center toward you. If that doesn't work I would think about replacing my front speakers rather than expect a center height channel to make a difference.

 

[Bello]

I would highly recommend the 6700H over the 4700H. My personal hands-on experience, extensive sound testing, several weeks on both systems side by side . Hands down the 6700H is the better all-around performer. Based on my technical expertise concerning performance, component layout, heat. The 6700H will out last, likely out perform the 4700H in every category, within time. Oh, did I mention HEAT? Even in Pre amp mode. I believe the 6700H is money spent wisely +++ Like a fine bottle of red wine, memorable.

If you can swing the cost don't look back, period. Overall best choice.

 

[opus]

I found high quality Front Left and Right speakers can make a big difference in the clarity of dialog. If your center channel is not doing the job (even with sound level elevated), then I would try pointing the center toward you. If that doesn't work I would think about replacing my front speakers rather than expect a center height channel to make a difference.

Ou I express it wrong, I mean horizontal front layout is perfect FL C FR and FRH FLH, but in vertical way of my screen, pleas imagine center channel is below screen and no center channel above screen, and from that I cannot hear sound of dialogs from middle of screen but below.

 

[Bear123]

Reason why I consider x6700h is front center height channel, because my center channel is below 120 inch screen and dialogs in movies are not in center of screen and crossing fingers that front center height could solve it. Does anyone have experiences with front center height channel?

How about using an AT screen and use matching LCR, positioned properly?

 

[Dj7675]

How about using an AT screen and use matching LCR, positioned properly?

I have a 120inch wide screen as well. I have always toyed with the idea of an AT screen just never went through with it. It would probably better, but I have had good success with angling the center speaker up. It has always appeared to be coming out of the center of the screen to me. Always a trade off with AT screens. I would think there would be some video degradation (brightness) and depending on seating distance brings up the possibility of seeing the screen texture too. I know too that the screen would also affect the higher frequencies as well (although I would thing this could be addresses with EQ).

 

[opus]

I have a 120inch wide screen as well. I have always toyed with the idea of an AT screen just never went through with it. It would probably better, but I have had good success with angling the center speaker up. It has always appeared to be coming out of the center of the screen to me. Always a trade off with AT screens. I would think there would be some video degradation (brightness) and depending on seating distance brings up the possibility of seeing the screen texture too. I know too that the screen would also affect the higher frequencies as well (although I would thing this could be addresses with EQ).

Honestly I have same thoughts about high frequencies, anyway I bought x6700h and my plan is test front center height channel, hopefully this will help. I will post result, first impression x6700h is amazing .

 

[AllCourtGuy]

Does the x3700h put off significantly less heat compared to the x4700h due to less power, or is it not noticeable? Also how does the x3700h compare to the x6700h as far as heating up? My av will be in a wooden cabinet with 5 inches clearance above the unit. I know I can install fans, but should I just skip Denon AVRs altogether?

If I should opt out of Denons, then what other AVR do you recommend? Hoping to be 7.1 someday next year, but not starting that way.

 

[opus]

Hi, I spend last days with testing, FCH and VOG, using atmos/dtsx/imax/auro sound format. Like I promised, would like to share it with you, could say that for my cinema, make not really sense to have this layout. I am little bit dissapointent from it, dialog from FCH is not noticable like I expect, and even during atmos sound FCH ang VOG are quiet. Maybe for large cinema room make sense, my room is about 25m2, and all front speakers are placed around of 120 inch screen.
Next step I would like to place speakers TML+TMR and next round maybe SHR+SHL for comparison. Just for info current speaker layout 7.1.6