Madonna is seriously underrated in the audio community.

[SKBubba]

Madonna is a guilty pleasure. I got Immaculate Collection and the Mrs. made fun of me. Then, every time a song from it came up on shuffle play I yelled out Madonna! Then she started doing it, too. Now it's growing on her.

 

[Robin L]

I've got issues with her weak voice and vague sense of pitch. If I wanna hear this sort of stuff, I'd go for Lady Gaga instead.

 

[restorer-john]

Find yourself an original 1st release copy of Like A Virgin, in a smooth edge CD case, pressed in Hannover, Germany by Polygram. The plant that subsequently became PDO (Philips DuPont Optical).

That particular pressing is perfect, unmolested in terms of compression, and really shows off the effort they went to, to produce a state of the art recording in 1984. Consider Nile Rodgers wanted to a) record in digital and b) release on all formats simultaneously- a first at the time.

You will be amazed how good Madonna sounded and was produced, especially after the first album, which was disappointing sonically.

Although it says Full Digital Recording, it is in fact subject to an analogue mixing stage in between the Sony 3324 (24 track stationary head recorder) and the Sony PCM/Umatic master. There is no real information (appears conflicting) out there on whether the master recorder was actually a PCM-1 or a PCM-F1. If it was a 1, then the master recording 14 bit recording. If it was an F1, it's a 16 bit recording.

Bob Stuart (of MQA) reckons the Studer A-80 30IPS analogue backup master was used for the CD release, but there is absolutely zero evidence (qute the contrary actually) that is true as Rodgers was adament the recording was a pure digital master. The justification Bob Stuart uses is a level difference, but the example track he uses is from a much later "remastering" not the original CD pressing from 1984. This quote essentially says the same:

Bob Stuart, MQA Founder said: “By paying great attention to the nature of sound and the way we hear, MQA opens a clear window and delivers all the detail and nuance of the original song.
“The music industry’s catalog contains millions of significant performances from the early days of CD where, sometimes, the recording was created in 44.1kHz 16bit and where no alternative existed. We are delighted that Warner Music Group is bringing this content to TIDAL.”

So, all Tidal and MQA are doing is re-packaging the same original digital CD masters, wrapping them in MQA and the consumer can only experience the original CD quality if he/she has an MQA decoder. Brilliant! (not).

Bob Stuart and the record companies know they gave away the crown jewels (the master recordings) in the early 1980s with CD. So, over the years, they've remastered them, compressed them, squashed them into the last few bits and are now trying to sell the world the first CDs all over again. Hilarious.

Just buy an original pressing Like A Virgin. You'll be happy you did.

 

[iLoveCats]

Madonna is the only artist I have blocked on Tidal! Its so tired and dated to me.

 

[digitalfrost]

Find yourself an original 1st release copy of Like A Virgin, in a smooth edge CD case, pressed in Hannover, Germany by Polygram. The plant that subsequently became PDO (Philips DuPont Optical).

Do you have a catalog number? The only german CD release I can find on disogs close to 1984 is this: https://www.discogs.com/Madonna-Like-A-Virgin/release/209804

 

[restorer-john]

Do you have a catalog number? The only german CD release I can find on disogs close to 1984 is this: https://www.discogs.com/Madonna-Like-A-Virgin/release/209804

The disc number is the same. Not sure of the matrix or hub code, I'd have pull them out and look. I'll ask my mate who also collects early originals if he can shoot me a pic of his too.

 

[restorer-john]

Do you have a catalog number? The only german CD release I can find on disogs close to 1984 is this: https://www.discogs.com/Madonna-Like-A-Virgin/release/209804

The sound btw is clearly better than the first remaster in the late 80s.

 

[tmtomh]

Do you have a catalog number? The only german CD release I can find on disogs close to 1984 is this: https://www.discogs.com/Madonna-Like-A-Virgin/release/209804

He’s probably talking about an early, made in Germany CD, which is likely listed as a US CD on Discogs because the rule there is to list the main country of intended sale rather than the country of manufacture. And as an early Warner family disc, it’s a safe bet that most of all 1980s, pre-remaster pressings have the identical mastering.

 

[Wombat]

The original release does not include the track 'Into The Groove' - Discogs.

https://www.discogs.com/master/view/18021

Look for code 9 25157 2.

The earliest releases were made in Japan and quickly augmented by production in the US and W. Germany.

High sales meant lots of consecutive releases were promptly made in 1984. Should be easy to find one.

 

[Wombat]

He’s probably talking about an early, made in Germany CD, which is likely listed as a US CD on Discogs because the rule there is to list the main country of intended sale rather than the country of manufacture. And as an early Warner family disc, it’s a safe bet that most of all 1980s, pre-remaster pressings have the identical mastering.

Discogs provides manufacture information, including country of origin and disc ID markings, near the end of the particular album listing.

 

[Wes]

She was a NYC Scenester who created her entire personna. An amazing self-made woman.

Her music is indeed under-rated.

I don't like her music.

 

[mhardy6647]

mmm -- I have Like A Virgin -- on licorice pizza. oops.
It is the only Madonna in the house, to the best of my knowledge/recollection.

William Orbit. Y'all like his shtick, y'all might like this song (and the album from whence it came). I do.

(it has some bass, which may or may not make it through the YT filter )

 

[tmtomh]

Discogs provides manufacture information, including country of origin and disc ID markings, near the end of the particular album listing.

I understand. Regardless, there’s no unique 1980s German CD pressing of that album. The mastering appears across multiple early pressings.

 

[restorer-john]

The original release does not include the track 'Into The Groove - Discogs.

Exactly. The German pressing I referred to, I ordered as an import back in the day of course did not have that track on it. I didn't even know "Into the Groove" existed on CD until her "You can Dance" first remix disc came out in 1987. I'd moved on from Madonna at that point. It's only as the years went by and I picked up more copies of Like A Virgin, I realized how much better the first recording was.

All the popular CDs are boxed up at the moment or I'd pull out all the copies to show you guys.

 

[digicidal]

McDonald is seriously underrated in the gourmet community

Well, that would be a failure of both content and production quality... so a bit different - but I like the analogy regardless of hyperbole.

 

[witchdoctor]

I like her videos too

 

[Wombat]

For the smitten: https://www.songfacts.com/facts/madonna/like-a-virgin

 

[Doodski]

For the smitten: https://www.songfacts.com/facts/madonna/like-a-virgin

Hehe, I read about 1/3 of that article. It reminds me of this cover of a Madonna song.

 

[tmtomh]

Exactly. The German pressing I referred to, I ordered as an import back in the day of course did not have that track on it. I didn't even know "Into the Groove" existed on CD until her "You can Dance" first remix disc came out in 1987. I'd moved on from Madonna at that point. It's only as the years went by and I picked up more copies of Like A Virgin, I realized how much better the first recording was.

All the popular CDs are boxed up at the moment or I'd pull out all the copies to show you guys.

There are a ton of pressings identical to this, without Into the Groove and with the same peak and RMS levels, indicating the same mastering:

http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=madonna&album=like+a+virgin

So it's easy to get on the used market - in fact, it appears if you just search out a version without Into the Groove, that's the easy way to ID the mastering John is talking about. There are even post-1994 represses that still use the same mastering (we know they're 1994 or later because the CDs have IFPI codes on them, which were first used in late '94), so easy to get super-cheap if you don't care about getting an early pressing with the "target" face design.

Also, there is another, early mastering with Into the Groove that is just as dynamic - in fact, technically slightly more dynamic - and very similar (though not identical) DR readings and peak and RMS values. No idea if that sounds the same or slightly better or slightly worse than the one John has, but it's likely it sounds similar.

I mention this only because over at places like the Hoffman forums, there's a dedicated band of early CD collectors who constantly insist that CDs pressed at different pressing plants sound different, even when both pressings used the identical master source and in some cases the identical glass master. Unsurprisingly, it's almost always the earliest, rarest, and most expensive pressing that's said to have this magical improved sound quality even though the digital data on the disc is identical to that on other pressings.

Not saying John is making that kind of claim here - just clarifying proactively, because the Hoffman discussions often create confusion about supposed "holy grail" unique pressings that are not in fact unique.

 

[abdo123]

Find yourself an original 1st release copy of Like A Virgin, in a smooth edge CD case, pressed in Hannover, Germany by Polygram. The plant that subsequently became PDO (Philips DuPont Optical).

That particular pressing is perfect, unmolested in terms of compression, and really shows off the effort they went to, to produce a state of the art recording in 1984. Consider Nile Rodgers wanted to a) record in digital and b) release on all formats simultaneously- a first at the time.

You will be amazed how good Madonna sounded and was produced, especially after the first album, which was disappointing sonically.

Although it says Full Digital Recording, it is in fact subject to an analogue mixing stage in between the Sony 3324 (24 track stationary head recorder) and the Sony PCM/Umatic master. There is no real information (appears conflicting) out there on whether the master recorder was actually a PCM-1 or a PCM-F1. If it was a 1, then the master recording 14 bit recording. If it was an F1, it's a 16 bit recording.

Bob Stuart (of MQA) reckons the Studer A-80 30IPS analogue backup master was used for the CD release, but there is absolutely zero evidence (qute the contrary actually) that is true as Rodgers was adament the recording was a pure digital master. The justification Bob Stuart uses is a level difference, but the example track he uses is from a much later "remastering" not the original CD pressing from 1984. This quote essentially says the same:

Bob Stuart, MQA Founder said: “By paying great attention to the nature of sound and the way we hear, MQA opens a clear window and delivers all the detail and nuance of the original song.
“The music industry’s catalog contains millions of significant performances from the early days of CD where, sometimes, the recording was created in 44.1kHz 16bit and where no alternative existed. We are delighted that Warner Music Group is bringing this content to TIDAL.”

So, all Tidal and MQA are doing is re-packaging the same original digital CD masters, wrapping them in MQA and the consumer can only experience the original CD quality if he/she has an MQA decoder. Brilliant! (not).

Bob Stuart and the record companies know they gave away the crown jewels (the master recordings) in the early 1980s with CD. So, over the years, they've remastered them, compressed them, squashed them into the last few bits and are now trying to sell the world the first CDs all over again. Hilarious.

Just buy an original pressing Like A Virgin. You'll be happy you did.

From all the threads i read, this is definitely the one i least expected to turn into an MQA discussion lol.