CEA-2010 Subwoofer Testing Master Thread

[Jdunk54nl]

I am trying to figure out how to have a user definable easy to fill out filter option and I can't figure it out to be easy on the user end....(like boxes to fill out and then the sheet auto sorts for those options but just for that user and no one else)

Like if I wanted to sort by value or price, or output at x hz, I could select that. Then enter a min and a max value.

I know I can do this by defining the filter above in post 118, but to just have like a drop down for the column headings to choose what you want to sort by, then enter your min and max.

Something like what I have highlighted in blue on the lower right side (not here but just was where I was trying to get it to work)

 

[KaiserSoze]

Also, I will use these two for compact closed sub:
CSS SDX10, it has massive excursion, per the spec-sheet.

And if you even wanna go bigger, there is also a 12"
CSS SDX12

Those both appear to be excellent drivers for acoustic suspension subwoofers. For both, the theoretical F3 is about 40 Hz. Earlier this year I spent some time researching drivers for sealed subs, relying heavily on the loudspeakerdatabase.com. The formula I use to predict F3 is a simplification of the standard formulas you find everywhere: F3 = .73 x Fs/Qts. The only 10" driver I found with F3 in the 35-Hz ballpark but also with good sensitivity (88 dB) was the Scan-Speak 25W/8565-00. It isn't cheap, but neither are the CSS drivers. There is a Dayton 10.5" driver that looks excellent except that sensitivity is only 84 dB. Once you move up to 12" the tradeoffs relax slightly, but not by much. For anyone who doesn't object to a driver with 13.6" frame diameter and a enclosure (about 3 ft^3), the SB34NRX75-6 is special.

 

[sweetchaos]

Klipsch Reference R-112SW (on sale from $649 to $399)

It's $299 at adorama currently.

 

[hardisj]

The Monoprice subs arrived today. About 300lbs, total.

 

[MZKM]

Quick note: Erin, if you highlight row 16, then go to View - Freeze and freeze up to row 16, that should stop that from getting messed up and helps with the sorting part at least.



View attachment 84665

Edit* this does create issues with this part because then they still get sorted, but if those were just above the data then it would be frozen and fixed.
View attachment 84669
So something like this and then locking to row 19 works:

View attachment 84670

Not meaning to sidetrack the purpose of this thread, but for my speaker selector, I use a filter formula on the actual data, so you enter in the text boxes what info to filter. Rather than dealing with people needing to use a sort/filter on their own. Also, Erin currently is sharing the actual Sheet, so not sure if you sort/filter if that only affects your view or the actual master (unless you make a copy of it).

Also, looking at this screenshot, I just noticed some things I should fix (and I added dimensional info, just need to rewrite the formula to include it, which also allows for switching between imperial and metric). EDIT: Dimensions are now live.

 

[ruinevil]

Outdoor Speaker Depot has a bunch of low and middle range subwoofers. Might be worth contacting them for a few test pieces.

 

[LearningToSmile]

Therefore, I'm thinking more along the lines of doing a 12" subwoofer shootout.

If you're still looking for participants, here's an interesting one: the new Emotiva SE12 is $399.

I was aware of it but thought it was going to be a replacement for their S12 subwoofer with better connectivity(which is $699). But instead it's a lower priced option, less power(200 RMS/400 peak vs 500 RMS/750 peak) but still one active driver with additional passive radiator design. What makes it stand out other than the passive radiator construction is the included high passed line out with a selectable crossover frequency.

Emotiva seems open to sending review units to at least some reviewers(which is how I learned about this one) so it might be worth reaching out to them, particularly since it's a new model they're currently promoting.

 

[Willem]

I am still hoping for a test of the Elac Sub 10.2. The sub1010 is not for sale in Europe, but the larger 10.2 is, and for only 160 euros, so I am hoping that it will be similarly good, and even better given its larger size and more powerful amplifier. And of course I remain interested in sound quality as opposed to just extension.

 

[hardisj]

I'll try to remember to get around to those. Unfortunately, when you move out of the $200 range, it becomes harder for me to simply buy. And some companies aren't willing to send me stuff to try. So I have to buy as I go or hope someone watching will be willing to loan me theirs.

 

[Willem]

160 euros equals $186 as of today (and includes tax), but I am not sure about US prices.

 

[hardisj]

160 euros equals $186 as of today (and includes tax), but I am not sure about US prices.

289 USD.

But if you want to buy it and have it shipped to me then I’m happy to test it. Might be a bit before I can, though.

 

[Willem]

Shipping etc from the Netherlands and back would be prohibitively expensive I am afraid.

 

[hardisj]

Monoprice subwoofer testing begins this weekend. Already tested the budget 12-inch. These Monoliths hopefully will be tested tomorrow or Sunday, weather permitting.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Monoprice subwoofer testing begins this weekend. Already tested the budget 12-inch. These Monoliths hopefully will be tested tomorrow or Sunday, weather permitting.

View attachment 85908

Hmmm. How are you going to decide whether to measure with or without the plugs?

 

[hardisj]

Hmmm. How are you going to decide whether to measure with or without the plugs?

I'll measure sealed and ported. Not sure if I'll measure all variations of ported.

There's also a couple features on the back that I will need to test (namely, the THX vs Extended EQ settings). I won't bother testing crossovers. I'll leave that wide open.

 

[sweetchaos]

Hey Erin,
At some point in the future, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the "servo" technology that some subs have.
I heard somewhere that the distortion is up to 10x less when compared to a non-servo sub.
Marketing (and biased opinions of people online) aside, when you do get to review some servo subs (Rythmik comes to mind), can you touch on the results of the servo technology in more detail?
I guess the fundamental question is...is servo subwoofer worth the extra money, when compared to similar priced subwoofers?
I know in your budget 10" shootout, you mentioned the Yamaha NS-SW100BL's servo technology and how it doesn't seem to win against the competition, so Yamaha's implementation doesnt work well.
Besides myself, I know a lot of people who never experienced a servo sub, so your reviews and thoughts on the servo implementation will help us understand whether it's worth the extra money.
Thanks.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Hey Erin,
At some point in the future, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the "servo" technology that some subs have.
I heard somewhere that the distortion is up to 10x less when compared to a non-servo sub.
Marketing (and biased opinions of people online) aside, when you do get to review some servo subs (Rythmik comes to mind), can you touch on the results of the servo technology in more detail?
I guess the fundamental question is...is servo subwoofer worth the extra money, when compared to similar priced subwoofers?
I know in your budget 10" shootout, you mentioned the Yamaha NS-SW100BL's servo technology and how it doesn't seem to win against the competition, so Yamaha's implementation doesnt work well.
Besides myself, I know a lot of people who never experienced a servo sub, so your reviews and thoughts on the servo implementation will help us understand whether it's worth the extra money.
Thanks.

I would likewise find a study of this type interesting. Being the natural skeptic that I am, I've never bought in to the servo-sub. It seems like it is an attempt to overcome the physical limit of the driver's linear range of excursion, and to me it seems that the right way to do that is to make the driver itself more linear, over a wider range of excursion.

 

[q3cpma]

Hey Erin,
At some point in the future, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the "servo" technology that some subs have.
I heard somewhere that the distortion is up to 10x less when compared to a non-servo sub.
Marketing (and biased opinions of people online) aside, when you do get to review some servo subs (Rythmik comes to mind), can you touch on the results of the servo technology in more detail?
I guess the fundamental question is...is servo subwoofer worth the extra money, when compared to similar priced subwoofers?
I know in your budget 10" shootout, you mentioned the Yamaha NS-SW100BL's servo technology and how it doesn't seem to win against the competition, so Yamaha's implementation doesnt work well.
Besides myself, I know a lot of people who never experienced a servo sub, so your reviews and thoughts on the servo implementation will help us understand whether it's worth the extra money.
Thanks.

While I'm also curious, I'd wager that Yamaha's problem is more amplifier clipping than anything else.

 

[hardisj]

Honestly,

Hey Erin,
At some point in the future, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the "servo" technology that some subs have.
I heard somewhere that the distortion is up to 10x less when compared to a non-servo sub.
Marketing (and biased opinions of people online) aside, when you do get to review some servo subs (Rythmik comes to mind), can you touch on the results of the servo technology in more detail?
I guess the fundamental question is...is servo subwoofer worth the extra money, when compared to similar priced subwoofers?
I know in your budget 10" shootout, you mentioned the Yamaha NS-SW100BL's servo technology and how it doesn't seem to win against the competition, so Yamaha's implementation doesnt work well.
Besides myself, I know a lot of people who never experienced a servo sub, so your reviews and thoughts on the servo implementation will help us understand whether it's worth the extra money.
Thanks.

To be honest, that's something I would like to provide more details on as well. Unfortunately, without a way to A/B "with servo" and "without servo" I can't definitively provide any two cents on the matter. Other than what I did in the video, which is to compare "as is" and assume the engineers implemented the servo technology that resulted in a way that is better than without it. (even though it's not great anyway)

 

[hardisj]

In other news, I measured the FR of all the monoprice subwoofers today in all ported and sealed variations. I set the subs up for "THX" which basically bypasses any on-board levels and crossovers but I did implement the THX and Extended EQ options. Basically, I tested every variation other than on-board crossovers. Every. One. 18 measurements.

I don't know that I'll bother testing each variation of port open in the CEA tests. But for FR, I thought it might be interesting to compare.

Also, I am going to have to futz around with the FR data in my sheets. I used a higher resolution window in the measurements today which means my x-axis values are no longer the same as my old test data and therefore the new data can't just be plopped in and plotted the same. Meaning more work if I want to provide that data for everyone to have and filter on. Yippee. (sarcasm) And, no, it's not as easy as loading in to REW and having it dump the data because ... that would be too easy, now wouldn't it. I tried. And with some things I'm seeing, I may just punt altogether on providing that data other than as raw txt.