Tropical Cyclone Maria

[RayDunzl]

http://fortune.com/2017/09/21/hurricane-maria-puerto-rico-airports-closed/

Closed till at least Friday it says.

The big guys don't fly VFR much, I suppose, nor in un-controlled airspace.

Need traffic control (radar), instrumented landing system (cloud/rain), fire/rescue at a minimum.

Need ground controllers.

Need lighting for Night Ops.

Need fuel - unless you can carry enough for a round trip from wherever.

Unless you're military, then who knows.

The Air Force/FAA set up a portable Air Traffic Control system in Haiti a few years ago, to service their earthquake needs.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/us-faa-sends-temporary-atc-tower-to-haiti-337478/

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=122599423

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/01/14/us.haiti.airport/index.html

Haiti Earthquake (2010):

Haiti Hurricane Mathew (2016):

One of our members lives in Haiti. I'd like to hear his situation. I have to assume he isn't part of the above.

 

[NorthSky]

Frantz is from Haiti. I don't know if the people from that last picture above can afford Internet monthly fees.

By the way, Puerto Rico has one of the most dangerous airports to land on in the world. ...St. Maarten too.

• http://www.wonderslist.com/10-most-dangerous-airport-landings-in-the-world/
• https://wanderwisdom.com/transportation/Most-Dangerous-Airports

Paro Airport
Paro Airport in Bhutan is sandwiched between two 18,000+ foot Himalayan mountains. This airport is one of the most dangerous places to land as planes must be maneuvered between mountains (with, of course, very strong mountain winds) to land on a tiny runway.

Planes are only allowed to land during the day when visibility is at its best. Doesn't sound quite as bad as Lukla, right? Consider this: This airport is so dangerous that only 8 pilots in the entire world are qualified enough to land here. That's some scary stuff!

Pilots need to maneuver between mountains, fly within feet of houses, and land on a narrow, 6,500-foot runway. Planes are only allowed to take off and land during the day since any flying at night has been deemed far too dangerous.

 

[RayDunzl]

Can't filter for Puerto Rico traffic (multiple airports), but...

 

[RayDunzl]

Unbelieveable...

A claimed 10,000 containers of everything at the port in SanJuan, and nobody is delivering the goods, for whatever reason.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/27/us/puerto-rico-aid-problem/index.html

That's a whole 0.003125 container for each person on the island.

Assuming, say 50,000 pounds per container, thats 156 pounds of goodies per person.

It's a start. Where are the truckers?

 

[DonH56]

Heard on the radio this morning that they cannot get truck drivers... Either they can't contact them due to all the lines/cell links down, or they can't get to the port due to roads damaged or gone. Seems like NG choppers should be able to help?

 

[RayDunzl]

Here comes the Army...

https://www.reuters.com/article/usa...itary-relief-in-puerto-rico-cnn-idUSL2N1M91C8

http://www.arnorth.army.mil/Leaders/Pages/Commanding-General.aspx

 

[RayDunzl]

Puerto Rico is about 100 x 35 miles... 3500 sq miles, equivalent to a 34 mile radius circle

3.5m population.

Comparable to these Metro Areas:

19 Montreal 4,060,692[4] 2015

Canada
20 Seattle 3,733,580[3] 2015

United States
21 Santo Domingo 3,658,648[5] 2015

Dominican Republic
22 Minneapolis–St. Paul 3,524,583[3] 2015

United States
23 San Diego 3,299,521[3] 2015

United States
24 Tampa–St. Petersburg 2,975,225[3] 2015

United States
25 Puebla–Tlaxcala 2,941,988[2] 2015

Mexico
26 Denver 2,814,330[3] 2015

United States
27 St. Louis 2,811,588[3] 2015

United States
28 Baltimore 2,797,407[3] 2015

United States

Wipe one of those out, see how it goes, especially if it were simultaneously blown 1,000 miles offshore...

I can see where it would take a little while to get things restarted.

 

[NorthSky]

Like Don just mentioned above it's a logistical issue, all communications are disabled, they cannot reach the truck drivers, only 20% are available, and even then the roads are full of debris where people are in most need.

They should use helicopters from the army and drop the goods from parachutes. Whoever is running the help support/survival show is not using his brain properly.

The Jones act was lifted, good. But, it doesn't get the help needed to the ones cut of from the rest of the world.
___

Use the army as saviors of humanity...that's their job.

 

[NorthSky]

Maybe they finally realised the situation: http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/28/politics/pentagon-general-to-lead-puerto-rico-efforts/index.html

That 3-star general has to hire helicopter pilots and drop food and water supplies to the people; there are no two ways about it. This is survival, US lives depend on it.

 

[RayDunzl]

Maybe they can hire this guy:

 

[RayDunzl]

Today's White House Press Conference: skip to 20:06

 

[NorthSky]

Tanks Ray; that young gentleman answered that gentille lady's question with aplomb...air drops.

It's true that they were way too slow, and unorganized to provide help quickly. All those containers....bring helicopters and pilots too with them containers from them boats. And tanks too with shovels in front to clear up the roads, and hydro people to restore power in hospitals...with generators.
Simply put bring the US Army, Pronto, with sufficient personal and equipment and gas.

 

[NorthSky]

• https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...r-calling-puerto-rico-relief-effort-good-news

 

[RayDunzl]

 

[amirm]

It is disgrace to have US citizens suffering so much due to incompetence of not knowing how to aid them in an island.

 

[NorthSky]

Us, on the mainland with our communications enabled, our cell towers intact, our news channels from our TV sets, our phone lines...we know.
Them, in Puerto Rico, with nothing, they even know it more.

The army should have been there fully deployed within the first 48 hours, not more. They are human beings, US citizens, just like in Texas and in Florida.

I agree with you Amir; it is gross negligence and an insult for what we stand for...Saving lives quickly in emergency situations. Here it is a huge human failure. ...In my very honest opinion and in the opinion of all my neighbors and friends and family I talked to.

 

[DonH56]

Mobilizing a large force is difficult particularly when all the landing infrastructure is gone (runways, fuel supply, traffic control, power for lights and such). Yah it's a little island but what, 3M+ people? That is a lot of people! I'm inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt whilst recognizing the hardship those in Puerto Rico are going through. Always easy to second-guess and back-seat drive... My brother was in the National Guard for years and dealt with a number of emergencies. There's always another side.

 

[NorthSky]

Experts have already given their expert opinions.
____

On the latest:
• http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/te...s-in-puerto-rico/ar-AAsEJsd?OCID=ansmsnnews11
• http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/tr...ds-maria-efforts/ar-AAsCvQ5?OCID=ansmsnnews11

The scoop: Inefficiency, Turtle pace (extremely slow), a disorganised administration...
There are no other explanations; the army should have been there a long time ago, period. ...Like in Texas and in Florida, ...full deployment personal with equipment and gas. When the communication system is down and the roads blocked call the army with their helicopters and pilots, pure and simple; everyone flying above can see.

What! They have no plan for US citizens living on islands? What year are we in, 1524...or 2017?
Elon Musk is building a spaceship to transport the next colony on Mars.
AI is recording data @ the speed of light.
OLED 4K TVs have been with us for the last five years.
And we cannot give assistance to desperate US people in a timely fashion because they live on an island? Gimme a break.
Is it because they're poor and have financial difficulties? I sure hope not, but your boss/chief made sure to mention it in his arrogant tone.

■ http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/30/us/puerto-rico-responds-to-trump-tweets/index.html

 

[DonH56]

Could or should more have been done sooner? Maybe, I do not have all the information. Note the gov't cannot send in the National Guard without a request from the governor (that was a big issue during Katrina relief efforts -- the gov of LA waited too long to ask for the NG, and it was too late to mobilize them before the storm hit). No doubt you have all the answers, but I certainly do not, as it seems to me a very large problem. And I've given up trying to figure out who is an "expert" in the news these days.

Both your links attribute the problem to a lack of transportation infrastructure on the island. The news I have seen shows containers and ships waiting because there is no infrastructure to get the goods to the people, no way to contact the people to let them know where the goods are, or even to know where the people are. Helicopters are flying missions to reach people, flights and boats are working to bring aide, but it is a huge task. Having been a Red Cross Mass Shelter Volunteer I know how hard it can be to mobilize even a small effort, for just tens to thousands of people, and having to deal with millions of people is very daunting to me.

Once when visiting the shuttle ground control room my boss asked if they trained for a Challenger scenario. They said "no, there's no way to train for a disaster of that magnitude, it just puts undue stress on everyone, and our time is better spent focused on problems we can solve". I had family that dealt with Katrina and all that mess, and have seen the problems in other disasters (like blizzards right at my place that kept anyone from getting in or out for nearly a week), and it is difficult to convey the magnitude of problems without "being there". Yes, it is very frustrating for those dealing with it (been there), but lashing out at the relief helpers is not going to help, just makes us (them) feel worse.

I have better things to do than to engage in a political pissing contest. Perhaps this part of the story should be moved to the fight club.

 

[NorthSky]

Please forgive me Don; I shouldn't blame the administration. Helpers are waiting to help but they need the directives and the equipment.

I have no business to be here, to live, I should be banned for life.
I have no clue why this is happening, it's probably an issue with global warming.
Yes, this is a Fight Club subject of no importance. Life keeps on rolling. This has nothing to do with Audio Science. It should not be part of this world.

My sincere apologies, I will never do that again.
I feel so guilty, you are right and I am wrong.
_____