PS Audio Talking Smack About Amirm

[MakeMineVinyl]

Please keep on topic , pizza , pineapple, cultural abandonment and insecurity expressed by national cuisine.. oh and pizza ..

And what about that pepperoni shortage????

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

It would be interesting to collect the education level for Paul and the others like him, to see if there is a clear pattern that can be shown, i.e., to see whether it can be shown that the people who push audiophile snake oil generally have little or no quantitative education.

There are parallels with charismatic televangelists who take peoples' money. But there are important differences. Peddlers of audiophile snake oil generally take money from young adults who have disposable income and who are not spending their retirement. Charismatic televangelists prey on old ladies living on welfare and food stamps.

In my experience high end audio people have all levels of education, but I've seen an over representation of persons who were previously stereo salesmen.

To be fair, Paul is just doing what he needs to do to sell his product (aside from the personal attacks). I don't think he is being dishonest, and they do make a solid product, but I (and people here generally) have philosophical differences over the subjective vs objective debate. There are far, far, far more glaring specimens of snake oil in audio!!!!!

 

[Veri]

Being from Buffalo, I prefer Buffalo style pizza, kind of half way between NY thin and Chicago deep dish.

that pepperoni looks so goooooood

 

[NTK]

I am attempting to advance my scientific understanding of pizza. I am trying to dig a little deeper into this paper. Does anybody has a copy of reference #6 and not mind sharing?
https://www.koreascience.or.kr/article/JAKO201626360541634.page

 

[Ilkless]

It would be interesting to collect the education level for Paul and the others like him, to see if there is a clear pattern that can be shown, i.e., to see whether it can be shown that the people who push audiophile snake oil generally have little or no quantitative education.

There are parallels with charismatic televangelists who take peoples' money. But there are important differences. Peddlers of audiophile snake oil generally take money from young adults who have disposable income and who are not spending their retirement. Charismatic televangelists prey on old ladies living on welfare and food stamps.

I can only speak to my my home country (Singapore), but as it has historically been a major centre of megabuck audiophile spending and evidence-based audio is still unheard of unlike in Europe/the US, I think it is pretty illustrative. A surprising number spending that much are guys with pretty high quantitative education - doctors, bankers, engineers-turned-management (some of which are even EEs). They just believe in the mythology, the allure of having a unique system assembled through some arcane, impenetrable process that marks them as dedicated and sophisticated. Some of these guys even manufacture explanations that are superficially plausible based on empirical concepts such as resonance control, dielectrics, skin effect etc etc to rationalise it.

Instead of propping up amps like these selling for multiple thousands, I do wish that money went to superior industrial design, haptics and build - the mechanical watch mindset to collecting, basically. No pretence that it is competing on basis of superior performance in its core function. I have always found the cognitive dissonance between garage amps by anointed gurus and the price hilarious. Mechanical watches may be ridiculous in the grand scheme of things, but at least there is an internal logic to its value and pricing as micro-mechanical art with loads of craft. Nobody is selling crusty old Russian movements with haphazard assembly for 50k. Yet in audio, that becomes a badge of honour, as Lampizator and Audio Note would attest to.

Screw the ALPS Blue Velvets everywhere nowadays, when will we return to the crazy build quality of potentiometers like the RK50 as a point of competition in high-end Japanese conglomerate amps of the past?

 

[JEntwistle]

Yep. Jason over at Schiit made his own kind of damage control move with his "blind listening" write up last February
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-3798#post-15486474

Both of them are responding to the shift in the market over the last few years where consumers now have access to independent measurements for some of their equipment, and some consumers are using them to make purchase decisions.

And I have noticed that there's a new generation of audio equipment owners coming out of video games and PC building very much interested in real world performance. Instead of merely relying on manufacturer specs.

100% agree. The train has left the station. If PS wants to rely on subjective measurements, they are catering to a dwindling market in the long run.

They would be better served by either publishing their data or explaining what they think a specific measurement means, rather than rejecting empirical data.

 

[Totoro]

Well, as an American, I shouldn't really poke fun.

In addition to the actually delicious Hawaiian pizza, we have the mixed-bag of Taco Pizza and Hamburger Pizza.

never heard of the taco or hamburger pizzas. Here in New England we have white clam pizzas, which are great.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

If PS wants to rely on subjective measurements, they are catering to a dwindling market in the long run.

I think the younger market is more tuned in to the objective technological merits in audio and other fields. The rich old farts want bling because they generally have more disposable income, kids have left the house.

https://dandagostino.com/products/momentum-mono.php

Ironically, in the "golden years" of HiFi - the 1950s / early 1960s - hobbyists were pretty objective / spec driven. The hobby went off the rails in the 1970s.

 

[scott wurcer]

never heard of the taco or hamburger pizzas. Here in New England we have white clam pizzas, which are great.

Just about to make a heirloom tomato, mozzarella, and kipper one myself.

 

[North_Sky]

Lots of wood fire oven pizzerias here. It is very cold here in the winter and winters are long. I expect frost in the next couple of weeks. Summer is short here. People that come here anew are very shocked at what it feels like and they usually don't have a proper parka or down hoody jacket. I see it every winter, peeps walking about in jean jackets or leather with a cotton hoody underneath in burning cold temps. It gets so cold and dry that going outside takes your breath away for the first 20 seconds or so. We have had very little snow for the past few years.

Living in Edmonton during winter it's best to have a pizza oven...a very hot one and fast.
And if you play hockey outside ... tough lock, in particular for the goalie, the spare one sitting on the bench ...

 

[JustJones]

I remember the first time I had spinoccoli pizza at UNO's , surprised me was pretty good. I do like NY style better though.

 

[North_Sky]

Sure its the pizza thread! Isnt it?

That's what I've read and that's also what the video in the first post was all about...pizza oven.

 

[North_Sky]

It does pump the brand. I'm surprised a admin at Wikipedia never came down on that page for that.

The Wiki guys need more testing kits ...

 

[Doodski]

And if you play hockey outside ... tough lock, in particular for the goalie, the spare one sitting on the bench ...

lol... Amazingly I see lots of cyclists out there scooting around when it's freakishly cold. The snow gets really hard, dry and squeeks when walking on it so the cyclists have a good surface to ride on. I don't know if they have to use special lube but at those temps regular oils and lube goes stiff.

 

[usersky]

I just had a tunafish pizza. It measured well, about 32cm across. Happy to report: no pineapple.

 

[raistlin65]

I think the younger market is more tuned in to the objective technological merits in audio and other fields. The rich old farts want bling because they generally have more disposable income, kids have left the house.

https://dandagostino.com/products/momentum-mono.php

Ironically, in the "golden years" of HiFi - the 1950s / early 1960s - hobbyists were pretty objective / spec driven. The hobby went off the rails in the 1970s.

I think it's more the availability of objective measurements today and the opportunity the internet gives for hearing various points of views.

For decades, the primary source of information was the manufacturer specs, marketing prose, and what the audio store retailer was telling you. Or maybe they had a friend that told them what to buy. So a lot of people were enculturated to trust that information. It's hard to break them out of that now.

 

[watchnerd]

never heard of the taco or hamburger pizzas. Here in New England we have white clam pizzas, which are great.

I've had those, and liked it.

I've also had a red clam pizza.

 

[North_Sky]

100% agree. The train has left the station. If PS wants to rely on subjective measurements, they are catering to a dwindling market in the long run.

They would be better served by either publishing their data or explaining what they think a specific measurement means, rather than rejecting empirical data.

But PS Audio do rely on objective measurements...scientific data.
See here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-talking-smack-about-amirm.15649/#post-498917

I'm sure they aren't alone in that audio business department, irrelative of financial status (division between the rich and the poor...inequality), and regardless of the sensorial stimulus (emotive and physics) pleasure resulting ... and the pain more or less experienced in the bank account (credit plastic card). I'm talking in an objective pleasurable musical satisfaction here ... what else. ...An audio illusion?

Because music matters

 

[North_Sky]

lol... Amazingly I see lots of cyclists out there scooting around when it's freakishly cold. The snow gets really hard, dry and squeeks when walking on it so the cyclists have a good surface to ride on. I don't know if they have to use special lube but at those temps regular oils and lube goes stiff.

They don't use hot pizza pasta sauce for lube?

 

[KaiserSoze]

In my experience high end audio people have all levels of education, but I've seen an over representation of persons who were previously stereo salesmen.

To be fair, Paul is just doing what he needs to do to sell his product (aside from the personal attacks). I don't think he is being dishonest, and they do make a solid product, but I (and people here generally) have philosophical differences over the subjective vs objective debate. There are far, far, far more glaring specimens of snake oil in audio!!!!!

More glaring than that thing with the LED that you plug into the wall to soak up the noise on the power mains? I mean, I practically fell out of my chair laughing when I first saw that thing. On several levels it is ludicrous. If you seriously wanted to suppress noise by dissipating it as heat, a simple resistor would probably work better than that silly LED. A power resistor in series with a capacitor, shunting the 120VAC to ground somewhere in the house. The basic idea is truly ludicrous. And I only watched that one video where he was talking about how to connect a subwoofer, and some of what he said there was hokey as hell. The subwoofer has its own amp of course, but according to him you want to supply the subwoofer amp with signal taken at the output of the main stereo amp, so that it will have the same signature or some B.S. of that sort. This is just plain looney. Only someone who is loony bins could think this makes sense. Before you even consider that it means that you would have to supply the main stereo amp with a full-range signal from 20 Hz, which means that if you want to use a high-pass filter on the main stereo speakers you'd need to do it passively, post-amplification. That would be dumb as hell.