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Amplifier for HD800S

compl3x

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I am currently looking for an amplifier for HD800S. I am considering the JDS Atom, Schiit Heresy , Schiit Vali, Monoprice Monolith THX 887
Looking through different websites, many people suggest that the HD800S is hard to drive / sounds bad with amps like the Atom and Magni. However, from what I see from its measurements, it looked to me that it can be driven by the amps i am considering. (Although some people pointed out that being able to drive isn't the same as sounding good)

Is it worth spending more for the THX 887 or the Vali when I have amps like the Atom and Heresy? If anyone have experience with those amps and driving the HD800S, please let me know.
 

maverickronin

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Looking through different websites, many people suggest that the HD800S is hard to drive / sounds bad with amps like the Atom and Magni. However, from what I see from its measurements, it looked to me that it can be driven by the amps i am considering. (Although some people pointed out that being able to drive isn't the same as sounding good)

This is more or less half myth and half people wishing that the HD800(S) sounded a little different but being too "purist" to condescend to EQ or mods.

People in the first camp are usually falling prey to sighted bias in listening tests hear what the expect to hear from the reports of others or the HD800(S)'s aura technical superiority revealing differences between sources. The HD800(S)'s 300 ohm impedance is actually quite an easy load to drive. Higher impedance means lower current draw from the amplifier which almost always reduces distortion. The only real limitation from a weaker amp is maximum volume since high impedance requires higher voltage for the same power. Even many smartphones will drive an HD800 quite cleanly even though they won't reach a satisfying volume.

The second camp is mostly people who wish it wasn't as bright and didn't have that 6kHz peak which gives it a sharp sound. They then (whether they really understand it or not) try fix this with various amplifier designs with objectively poor measured performance in order to hide the HD800(S)'s deficiencies with the amp's deficiencies. This often takes the form of high output impedance or high levels of distortion from poorly performing but fashionable vacuum tube circuits.

Do you already have the HD800S? If so, what amp are you using it with?
 

bboris77

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I have tried the Magni 3+, the Heresy and the Asgard 3 with my HD800s. I prefer the Asgard 3.

Edit: None of these amplifiers had any issues driving the HD800s. They are not more hard to drive than the HD600.
 
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compl3x

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This is more or less half myth and half people wishing that the HD800(S) sounded a little different but being too "purist" to condescend to EQ or mods.

People in the first camp are usually falling prey to sighted bias in listening tests hear what the expect to hear from the reports of others or the HD800(S)'s aura technical superiority revealing differences between sources. The HD800(S)'s 300 ohm impedance is actually quite an easy load to drive. Higher impedance means lower current draw from the amplifier which almost always reduces distortion. The only real limitation from a weaker amp is maximum volume since high impedance requires higher voltage for the same power. Even many smartphones will drive an HD800 quite cleanly even though they won't reach a satisfying volume.

The second camp is mostly people who wish it wasn't as bright and didn't have that 6kHz peak which gives it a sharp sound. They then (whether they really understand it or not) try fix this with various amplifier designs with objectively poor measured performance in order to hide the HD800(S)'s deficiencies with the amp's deficiencies. This often takes the form of high output impedance or high levels of distortion from poorly performing but fashionable vacuum tube circuits.

Do you already have the HD800S? If so, what amp are you using it with?
Thank you,
I was thinking of the same thing as your second point there.
I currently don't have the HD800S, but it's on the way.
My current setup is: Magni 3/Modi 3 with the Denon AH-D7200.

But I wanted to upgrade this setup to something like the Topping E30 / Atom or Heresy since they are little better than the previous Magni 3.
 
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compl3x

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What is your budget?
I could go up to the price of the Monolith THX 887 ($399). But if the $99 amps have a very close performance to the higher priced ones, I wouldn't feel like paying the extra money.
 
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compl3x

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I have tried the Magni 3+, the Heresy and the Asgard 3 with my HD800s. I prefer the Asgard 3.

Edit: None of these amplifiers had any issues driving the HD800s. They are not more hard to drive than the HD600.
Thank you for your input.
Any reason why you preferred Asgard 3 over the others?
 

maverickronin

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Thank you,
I was thinking of the same thing as your second point there.
I currently don't have the HD800S, but it's on the way.
My current setup is: Magni 3/Modi 3 with the Denon AH-D7200.

But I wanted to upgrade this setup to something like the Topping E30 / Atom or Heresy since they are little better than the previous Magni 3.

The Magni/Modi stack will be just great and and E30/Atom pair would make a nice "peace of mind" upgrade as well.

If you do have any problems with the HD800S's sound you can improve it quite it bit with either EQ or reversible mods depending on your source isn't easily EQable.

I could go up to the price of the Monolith THX 887 ($399). But if the $99 amps have a very close performance to the higher priced ones, I wouldn't feel like paying the extra money.

If you're planning on sticking with The HD800S for a while go with something like the Atom, Heresy, or the Geshelli Archel 2.

If you like to listen really loudly and plan on picking up some power hungry planars in the future than one of the THX's may be called for.
 

bboris77

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Thank you for your input.
Any reason why you preferred Asgard 3 over the others?
Politically correct, ASR-friendly answer: Better volume pot, built-in transformer, the form factor (does not move around when plugging/unplugging headphones.

Subjective opinion for which will annoy some people since currently available scientific measurements cannot substantiate it: Less sibilant treble compared to the Heresy which is a great bonus when it comes to the HD800S.
 

solderdude

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currently available scientific measurements cannot substantiate it:

LOL ... also future scientific measurements nor blind tests will. Asgard 3 and Magni 3 are the same circuit, just a bigger box and 1dB more headroom.
 

bboris77

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LOL ... also future scientific measurements nor blind tests will. Asgard 3 and Magni 3 are the same circuit, just a bigger box and 1dB more headroom.
I was comparing it to the Heresy. However, I had no idea that the Asgard 3 and the Magni 3+ are exactly the same circuit...are you a 100% sure?
 

solderdude

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Yep, just look at the PCB's on the Schiit website.
 

Zensō

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If you’d like a clean all-in-one that sits unobtrusively on a desk and performs as well as the larger stacks mentioned above, you might want to look at the JDS Element II. It’s more expensive than the standalone amps, but if you sell your current DAC the pricing isn’t much different.
 

LTig

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I am currently looking for an amplifier for HD800S. I am considering the JDS Atom, Schiit Heresy , Schiit Vali, Monoprice Monolith THX 887
Looking through different websites, many people suggest that the HD800S is hard to drive / sounds bad with amps like the Atom and Magni.
As others have written this is utter BS. I got a HD800 in 2014 and expected the same problem - how to find a matching amp. To my big surprise the HD800 did sound better than any other headphone I own (HD580, DT990 pro, K271 studio, ...) regardless of the feeding source (DIY preamp, Edirol UA25, Mackie 1402 VLZ pro, even including my smartphone:eek:).
Is it worth spending more for the THX 887 or the Vali when I have amps like the Atom and Heresy? If anyone have experience with those amps and driving the HD800S, please let me know.
I'd say no, use what you already have.

I noticed an improvement in smoothness after I EQed the 6 kHz peak with my RME ADI-2 PRO fs (DAC/ADC, EQ, headphone amp) so this would be worth to do. No simple amp offers this though, and the cheapest way is probably a passive filter designed by @solderdude if I remember correctly.
 
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compl3x

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As others have written this is utter BS. I got a HD800 in 2014 and expected the same problem - how to find a matching amp. To my big surprise the HD800 did sound better than any other headphone I own (HD580, DT990 pro, K271 studio, ...) regardless of the feeding source (DIY preamp, Edirol UA25, Mackie 1402 VLZ pro, even including my smartphone:eek:).
I'd say no, use what you already have.

I noticed an improvement in smoothness after I EQed the 6 kHz peak with my RME ADI-2 PRO fs (DAC/ADC, EQ, headphone amp) so this would be worth to do. No simple amp offers this though, and the cheapest way is probably a passive filter designed by @solderdude if I remember correctly.

Good to know, that makes things easier. thank you so much.


The Magni/Modi stack will be just great and and E30/Atom pair would make a nice "peace of mind" upgrade as well.

If you do have any problems with the HD800S's sound you can improve it quite it bit with either EQ or reversible mods depending on your source isn't easily EQable.



If you're planning on sticking with The HD800S for a while go with something like the Atom, Heresy, or the Geshelli Archel 2.

If you like to listen really loudly and plan on picking up some power hungry planars in the future than one of the THX's may be called for.

I think I will go with the E30/Atom combo after i test it on my current setup. Thank you for clarifying.



If you’d like a clean all-in-one that sits unobtrusively on a desk and performs as well as the larger stacks mentioned above, you might want to look at the JDS Element II. It’s more expensive than the standalone amps, but if you sell your current DAC the pricing isn’t much different.

The Element II was on my list before, the clean setup makes it a great choice. However, I have a room for separate amp / DAC setup which usually yields to better measurements. Thanks for the suggestion though. :)
 

Tks

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All those choices are great. The performance metrics aren't relevant at this tier if all you're concerned with is audibility. Only thing you need to consider is upgrades to balanced (if that's something you would want in the future), if not, then just get whatever looks the best, or has the connections you want.

Though the 887 has been out-competed. The massdrop 789 is $100 less.
 

odyo

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This is more or less half myth and half people wishing that the HD800(S) sounded a little different but being too "purist" to condescend to EQ or mods.

People in the first camp are usually falling prey to sighted bias in listening tests hear what the expect to hear from the reports of others or the HD800(S)'s aura technical superiority revealing differences between sources. The HD800(S)'s 300 ohm impedance is actually quite an easy load to drive. Higher impedance means lower current draw from the amplifier which almost always reduces distortion. The only real limitation from a weaker amp is maximum volume since high impedance requires higher voltage for the same power. Even many smartphones will drive an HD800 quite cleanly even though they won't reach a satisfying volume.

The second camp is mostly people who wish it wasn't as bright and didn't have that 6kHz peak which gives it a sharp sound. They then (whether they really understand it or not) try fix this with various amplifier designs with objectively poor measured performance in order to hide the HD800(S)'s deficiencies with the amp's deficiencies. This often takes the form of high output impedance or high levels of distortion from poorly performing but fashionable vacuum tube circuits.

Do you already have the HD800S? If so, what amp are you using it with?
What is your opinion on very sensitive big planar Hifiman Ananda ? It's 25 ohm and 103db sensitivity and very big planar driver. Looking for an amp which can deliver high current and less distortion/noise ?
 

Jimbob54

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What is your opinion on very sensitive big planar Hifiman Ananda ? It's 25 ohm and 103db sensitivity and very big planar driver. Looking for an amp which can deliver high current and less distortion/noise ?
Should play nice with just about any sold state, shouldnt it?
 

maverickronin

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What is your opinion on very sensitive big planar Hifiman Ananda ? It's 25 ohm and 103db sensitivity and very big planar driver. Looking for an amp which can deliver high current and less distortion/noise ?

They're website just says "Sensitivity: 103dB". :facepalm:

Knowing HiFiMan, and noting else about that model, it could just as easily be 103dB per watt.

"Sensitivity" is usually specified in dB per volt, but that's not really all that high, especially for only 25 ohms...

They could mean efficiency instead, which is usually dB per milliwatt, which actually wound make it easy to drive for a planar...

Rtings seems to measure everything but efficiency, so idk what it actually is though. Anyway, at 25 ohms, here's the difference between 103dB/mW on top and 103dB/V on the bottom.

juEpOmh.png
 
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