Rythmik L12 Subwoofer Review

[QMuse]

Yeah, for sure. I'm not in the camp that would cross subs over at anything above 120hz. And even then I'd prefer to keep to 80 or 100hz in most cases. I can see the argument though, that if you already have multiple subs, especially if you're using 4 in the corners, that you might be able to achieve better quality 100-200hz by using the subs that high. Localization also seems like less of an issue in that case.

I certainly wouldn't attempt it with 1 sub though, lol.

Best 4 sub integration I have seen so far on this forum has been done by a user which has "Dallas" in his nick (I don't remember the exact nick) and IIRC he had 2 subs crossed at 60Hz (or so) and other 2 crossed higher. I believe sub integration was done with custom Acourate filters. This was indeed a very fine job with sub integration. If you search the forum thoroughly I'm sure you'll find it.

 

[Bartl007]

I enjoy very much the speaker and amplifier/AVR reviews, but not a lot of useful information in my opinion that would guide purchase decisions for consumers in this subwoofer review.

Keith is a smart guy and did it well many years ago:

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/way-down-deep-i

And as previously mentioned Josh Ricci's data-bass.com does it right.

 

[QMuse]

Best 4 sub integration I have seen so far on this forum has been done by a user which has "Dallas" in his nick (I don't remember the exact nick) and IIRC he had 2 subs crossed at 60Hz (or so) and other 2 crossed higher. I believe sub integration was done with custom Acourate filters. This was indeed a very fine job with sub integration. If you search the forum thoroughly I'm sure you'll find it.

EDIT: I remembered, nick was @dallasjustice. Look for his post about how he did it, very impressive setup.

 

[amirm]

I enjoy very much the speaker and amplifier/AVR reviews, but not a lot of useful information in my opinion that would guide purchase decisions for consumers in this subwoofer review.

Keith is a smart guy and did it well many years ago:

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/way-down-deep-i

And as previously mentioned Josh Ricci's data-bass.com does it right.

Keith is smart but that kind of testing could only be justified in the age of print magazines and profitable models. Today's online world won't support large scale testing. And at any rate, outdoor testing limits reviews to just summer months or so.

With my rig, I can test subs very quickly so throughput can be incredibly high.

The problem is that they are so damn heavy. Just took this one down and shipped it. Boy, was it painful to deal with. I can get a crane to lift things and that might help but eventually I need to ship these things back. So not sure I want to do a lot of them or at least heavy ones (this one weighed 60 pounds).

 

[deafenears]

The problem is that they are so damn heavy. Just took this one down and shipped it. Boy, was it painful to deal with. I can get a crane to lift things and that might help but eventually I need to ship these things back. So not sure I want to do a lot of them or at least heavy ones (this one weighed 60 pounds).

Boston Dynamics robot to complement the Klippel?

That or see you compete in the next Strongman competition.

 

[Rick Sykora]

If you have no way to test without suspending the subwoofer (and risking serious injury), suspend the testing (at least until you get a crane or something).

From what I have read, you have plenty of other interesting things to test. Also, more time to determine a more meaningful subwoofer test suite!

 

[Kvalsvoll]

I appreciate the effort, and ASR has contributed towards bringing knowledge and sense into evaluation of sound equipment.

This test, however, does not provide useful information. I suggest reading on data-bass on how and why subwoofers are measured, as well as look at some of the measurement sets.

I published a short article on the blog-section on my web page about Relevant Subwoofer Specifications. In short, the message is that maximum output capacity across the frequency range is what matters.

 

[thewas]

Best 4 sub integration I have seen so far on this forum has been done by a user which has "Dallas" in his nick (I don't remember the exact nick) and IIRC he had 2 subs crossed at 60Hz (or so) and other 2 crossed higher. I believe sub integration was done with custom Acourate filters. This was indeed a very fine job with sub integration. If you search the forum thoroughly I'm sure you'll find it.

You must see this guys sub system http://hannover-hardcore.de/infinity_classics/!!!/Dokumentation SBA-01.pdf
Here are more papers of him http://hannover-hardcore.de/infinity_classics/!!!/

 

[A800]

118dB @ 5Hz.
Not too bad.

 

[digicidal]

Well then I'd probably go with https://jblpro.com/en/products/lsr310s
Anyone has experienced jbl subs?

Don't let that $350 shipping figure throw you... he quoted that on two F18's - those are like ~8ft³ and weigh 133lbs each. I would guess you could get a couple L12's shipped for around half as much or even less - since size and weight are much less.

 

[Tom C]

A portion of the value of the an ASR review is the discussion among experts that follows the review. This is a unique community, as in can’t be found elsewhere, and I for one found the discussion for this review to be a worthwhile read.
BTW, I believe Rhythmic’s site says the reason they use the servo system they do is that it minimizes the delay between sensing the cone action and generating a reaction. Is that assertion flawed? Is a system using accelerometers providing feedback to a controller just as fast or faster (less lag/latency)?

 

[amirm]

A portion of the value of the an ASR review is the discussion among experts that follows the review. This is a unique community, as in can’t be found elsewhere, and I for one found the discussion for this review to be a worthwhile read.

I am glad you recognize that. I almost wrote that post myself. If we just go by what others are doing, we would not do any testing at all.

BTW, I believe Rhythmic’s site says the reason they use the servo system they do is that it minimizes the delay between sensing the cone action and generating a reaction. Is that assertion flawed? Is a system using accelerometers providing feedback to a controller just as fast or faster (less lag/latency)?

I actually have a much older servo sub that uses accelerometer.

 

[Milt]

Thanks for the sub tests, Amir
I would make one of my subs available to Amir as I'm fairly close, but schlepping them into the house with a heavy duty hand truck was PITA enough.
To go through boxing, unboxing, boxing again & getting them in my car?
Forget it. My subs weigh 104lbs net each

 

[amirm]

Thanks for the sub tests, Amir
I would make one of my subs available to Amir as I'm fairly close, but schlepping them into the house with a heavy duty hand truck was PITA enough.
To go through boxing, unboxing, boxing again & getting them in my car?
Forget it. My subs weigh 104lbs net each

Yeh, anything past 50 pounds becomes a major chore.

 

[Xyrium]

Had a pair of F12's in my stereo rig, worked well overall. Some gut shots:

 

[DonH56]

Nice to see a member of the Rythmik family reviewed. I have five F12's around the house and have been a customer since 2010. Brian Ding, the man behind Rythmik, and I share similar day jobs and we spoke (phone and email) for a bit before and after my first purchase. My first sub was a DIY servo using a second voice coil so similar to Brian's design. I really wanted a servo design for the performance and tewakability it offered, plus it made a great project for one of my classes. I eschewed accelerometer approaches (e.g. Velodyne) due to various drawbacks they had. Many years later (like, 30) when I started looking for a new sub I wanted servo and the synergy with Brian made Rythmik a natural.

Thanks @amirm nice to see the Klippel getting lots of use!

 

[wwenze]

Hmm if all subs really perform similarly (or at least based on limited testing criterion)

Then the goal becomes "how cheap can we go" for a target SPL and size

Which still means more testing

 

[gags11]

Thanks for the review, Amir!

I used to have a 15” Rythmik sub in my 2 channel system. Of course this is subjective, but Rythmik is the best sub have heard for music.

I am kind of crazy, but now I put the sealed Rythmik with a SVS ported sub in my theater. No science behind it, but I love the combo.

 

[Bartl007]

Keith is smart but that kind of testing could only be justified in the age of print magazines and profitable models. Today's online world won't support large scale testing. And at any rate, outdoor testing limits reviews to just summer months or so.

With my rig, I can test subs very quickly so throughput can be incredibly high.

The problem is that they are so damn heavy. Just took this one down and shipped it. Boy, was it painful to deal with. I can get a crane to lift things and that might help but eventually I need to ship these things back. So not sure I want to do a lot of them or at least heavy ones (this one weighed 60 pounds).

I agree completely with the difficulty in getting future subwoofers tested with respect to shipping cost, weight, space for testing, back strain, etc.

Frankly it's a pain in the ass to do it right and that's why so few people publish subwoofer reviews with meaningful information.

Alluding to Keith's article was more of a suggestion of what metrics and methodology I find useful in subwoofer reviews/measurements.

As you're requesting feedback for what to be measured, I would request compression sweeps, group delay, maximum SPL/industry standard CEA-2010 measurements as well as subjective impressions of overload behavior (amp/driver limited), any squeeks, groans, rattles, port turbulence, bad noises,etc.

http://www.brentbutterworth.com/cea-2010-measurement-manual.html

Admittedly, it's not easy to do in a domestic space.

I wouldn't blame you one bit for avoiding subs for the time being given the challenges involved.

I love the site, keep up the good work.

 

[q3cpma]

I enjoy very much the speaker and amplifier/AVR reviews, but not a lot of useful information in my opinion that would guide purchase decisions for consumers in this subwoofer review.

Keith is a smart guy and did it well many years ago:

https://www.soundandvision.com/content/way-down-deep-i

And as previously mentioned Josh Ricci's data-bass.com does it right.

Thanks for this link, very nice roundup. That Genelec HTS6 sure isn't for girlies.