Hypex nCore vs Class A amps

[0bs3rv3r]

Thanks for the quick reply,I was not looking to modify op-amps i just didn't see one and was curious .
Also in the tech brochure there was no mention.
I might sound naive and or irrelevant but i am not .
Being used to toroids so long for all my amps (DIY or ready made) the little power sps on board seems not enough to drive such a load.
I am not speaking engineer wise just a mention.
Last month i tried an ice power base amplifer (smaller )and was not very happy their sound sounded very artificial.
Currently i use a a pair of DIY self made tripath 2020 base monoblocks (90 watts per channel) and I am very happy with their sound ,they play
better then my Mark Levinson monblocks .
So after reading all the hype about hypex was curious if such a module base amp will be better then my tripaths ?

Why the fixation on opamps? They aren't something you have to have in an amplifier?

I'll bet the power supply is perfectly adequate and correct.

Not surprised you prefer the Tripaths. They are surprisingly hard to beat. I too wonder about the Hypex, and even more so, the Purifi. I expect it is better, but yet to hear it myself.

 

[6feet]

Here is experience with the Ncore 500 mono blocks. I burned in the amplifier for nearly 300 hours with music and Burnin tones. Here is my verdict of what I hear from this amp. Please don't take my comments as an attack as this is not my intention. I wanted these amps to really be ready for prime time and I am disappointed.

The good
Dynamic
Gutsy
Solid bass
Silent, emits no self noise at speakers or amp
Good imaging

The not so good
Treble and bass seem disconnected most of the time from the midrange
No midrange bloom or emotional expression
Dark sounding contrary to a living presentation or the illusion of
Weird treble and or hard at times
Not a huge soundstage

Mostly sounds that the balance is bass heavy and propped up treble.
I am disappointed that it didn't outplay my class A/B amplifier that runs in class A for the first Watt as I was considering replacing my amplification with NCORE amps. Maybe in the future but not yet. YMMV.

I am posting comments as to help others and not to bash products.

 

[Willem]

Were these observations/impressions the product of blind or sighted listening? By the way, you do not mention the identity of the amplifier you were comparing them to, or the speakers you used. Audible differences between good amplifiers tend to be quite small or even non-existent.

 

[Julf]

Here is experience with the Ncore 500 mono blocks.

Your personal, subjective and unverified perception is noted.

 

[VintageFlanker]

I burned in the amplifier for nearly 300 hours with music and Burnin tones.

Wow. Poor amps... I guess you heard huge improvements after the first 100hours point, then 200h etc.

Please don't take my comments as an attack as this is not my intention.

I guess it's not.

No midrange bloom or emotional expression

Don't have a clue what that means.

Mostly sounds that the balance is bass heavy and propped up treble.

Strange. Usually, some audiophile say the exact opposite about class D... That also shows how much irrelevant uncontrolled/subjective listening is.

I am posting comments as to help others and not to bash products

.
Don't worries, products will be fine! The problem however, is your comments don't help anyone since these are only subjecive, probably biased, listening. With absolutely no information about your listening conditions (room, speaker, level matching etc...)
Welcome, anyway.

 

[6feet]

Wow. Poor amps... I guess you heard huge improvements after the first 100hours point, then 200h etc.

I guess it's not.

Don't have a clue what that means.

Strange. Usually, some audiophile say the exact opposite about class D... That also shows how much irrelevant uncontrolled/subjective listening is.
.
Don't worries, products will be fine! The problem however, is your comments don't help anyone since these are only subjecive, probably biased, listening. With absolutely no information about your listening conditions (room, speaker, level matching etc...)
Welcome, anyway.

I know my comments won't please but I really wished they would of been otherwise. The admin can always erase my post if it bothers too much. If these amps work for you then great. No ill will intended here.

 

[Julf]

I know my comments won't please but I really wished they would of been otherwise. The admin can always erase my post if it bothers too much. If these amps work for you then great. No ill will intended here.

It has nothing to do about pleasing or not, but notice this forum is called "Audio Science Review Forum", not "Random personal perceptions and beliefs Forum". Science is based on objective facts and verified evidence.

 

[VintageFlanker]

I know my comments won't please but I really wished they would of been otherwise. The admin can always erase my post if it bothers too much. If these amps work for you then great. No ill will intended here.

@6feet, you have to understand ASR is not the good place for pleasing, feeling, bothering, etc. We're trying to discuss here objective performance of products. Of course, listening impressions are welcome if controlled.

 

[6feet]

It has nothing to do about pleasing or not, but notice this forum is called "Audio Science Review Forum", not "Random personal perceptions and beliefs Forum". Science is based on objective facts and verified evidence.

The first post was asking for opinions on comparing ncore to class A or AB.

 

[Willem]

We do hope that you will stay to familiarize yourself with the methodological arguments. The audiophile world is full of alternative 'facts', and ASR is a refuge for those who stick to science and scientific methodology as the most reliable means to obtain emperical knowledge on audio science (because science it is).
Methodologoically there are two important principles here. The first is that measurements are important, and with modern virtually perfect audio electronics almost always more accurate than human hearing. The second is that with listening tests, just as e.g. in pharmaceutical trials, these have to be double blind to avoid expectations bias.

 

[6feet]

We do hope that you will stay to familiarize yourself with the methodological arguments. The audiophile world is full of alternative 'facts', and ASR is a refuge for those who stick to science and scientific methodology as the most reliable means to obtain emperical knowledge on audio science (because science it is).
Methodologoically there are two important principles here. The first is that measurements are important, and with modern virtually perfect audio electronics almost always more accurate than human hearing. The second is that with listening tests, just as e.g. in pharmaceutical trials, these have to be double blind to avoid expectations bias.

I am not blind to measurements and know that the specifications on the N core are exemplary. I expressed my opinion on what I experienced and this does not mean that these are bad amps. They have huge qualities and may make some systems sing. It just didn't happen for me in my rig and I was truly wishing otherwise. If anyone wants to buy these modules they are for sale. Cost price and I pay shipping.

 

[q3cpma]

I am not blind to measurements and know that the specifications on the N core are exemplary. I expressed my opinion on what I experienced and this does not mean that these are bad amps. They have huge qualities and may make some systems sing. It just didn't happen for me in my rig and I was truly wishing otherwise. If anyone wants to buy these modules they are for sale. Cost price and I pay shipping.

What we are saying is that finding a shrink that can cure your delusions will certainly be cheaper than changing gears.

 

[CharlesC]

Some makers of the 252 amps include a small board between the inputs and the main board. What is the purpose of these boards? Also do they often use a transformer to boost RCA voltages up to XLR levels (I noticed the gain switch on the IOM unit in Amir’s review)? Thanks.

 

[Willem]

I agree that the sonic impression is delusional, but there is no need to be rude.

 

[thefsb]

What we are saying is that finding a shrink that can cure your delusions will certainly be cheaper than changing gears.

I would prefer to educate and appeal to reason than refer to a shrink.

 

[thefsb]

The first post was asking for opinions on comparing ncore to class A or AB.

It actually asked about experience. That can mean many things including experience with reliability, heat output, power sufficiency for particular applications and even controlled subjective comparisons.

But even if OP had asked for opinions, one can, given the context of ASR, assume that the opinions solicited should be scientifically and practically defensible. Your list of descriptions under "The good" and "The not so good" headings use the familiar audiophile language that I and some other ASR participants find frustratingly opaque. I think some of us gather here specifically because we want to avoid that without abandoning the pursuit of equipment better suited to our purposes.

And I think you're welcome to make what may seem an unscientific proposition so long as you're ready to explain it with reason in something like a Socratic Q&A. What's not satisfying is to say "that's my opinion and we're all entitled to our opinion" and leave it at that because, while I believe that is true, some opinions are more useful than others.

 

[thefsb]

I am not blind to measurements and know that the specifications on the N core are exemplary. I expressed my opinion on what I experienced and this does not mean that these are bad amps. They have huge qualities and may make some systems sing. It just didn't happen for me in my rig and I was truly wishing otherwise. If anyone wants to buy these modules they are for sale. Cost price and I pay shipping.

Post them here https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?forums/audio-equipment-for-sale.29/ and I expect with that offer they will sell.

 

[Stretchneck]

Here is experience with the Ncore 500 mono blocks. I burned in the amplifier for nearly 300 hours with music and Burnin tones. Here is my verdict of what I hear from this amp. Please don't take my comments as an attack as this is not my intention. I wanted these amps to really be ready for prime time and I am disappointed.

The good
Dynamic
Gutsy
Solid bass
Silent, emits no self noise at speakers or amp
Good imaging

The not so good
Treble and bass seem disconnected most of the time from the midrange
No midrange bloom or emotional expression
Dark sounding contrary to a living presentation or the illusion of
Weird treble and or hard at times
Not a huge soundstage

Mostly sounds that the balance is bass heavy and propped up treble.
I am disappointed that it didn't outplay my class A/B amplifier that runs in class A for the first Watt as I was considering replacing my amplification with NCORE amps. Maybe in the future but not yet. YMMV.

I am posting comments as to help others and not to bash products.

So what is your class A/B amplifier?

 

[ahofer]

I made the same sort of comparison between a @March Audio (Hypex) p252 and a Pass-designed Adcom 5802. I also thought I heard drier bass and a thinner top when I first connected the Hypex. However, it was interesting was how my initial impressions of a difference evaporated when I level-matched the output with a db-meter and became adept at rapidly switching between the two amplifiers. Once I had worked that out I honestly couldn't tell the difference. I would recommend you try it, it could radically change your priorities about where to put your hobby dollars. I'm at about 80% speakers in my system now. My personal opinion is that it makes little sense to increase the electronics/speakers ratio based on what we hear when we make more careful comparisons and admit our ability to project the visuals and our impressions of a particular recording onto the audible sound. While it is an opinion, it is aligned with the results of a massive body of research and experimentation, often cited in these pages.

 

[pma]

Speaking about class A "in general" only, makes absolutely no sense. The implementation can be very good or awkward, regardless operational class of the output stage. If implemented properly, class A avoids the only issue of a good linear amplifier - crossover distortion. At the expense of heat, so going above some 30W in a pure class A is almost impossible. So, the class A has no future if we do not use extremely sensitive speakers.