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Review and Measurements of Audio-gd NFB2 192 DAC

artismo

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So to you people that hear it sounds better are all crazy. And they don't care the bad specs.
But nobody on ASR is curious to test if they enjoy it.
That's not honest.
You’re asking people on an objectivist site, which focuses on technical performance, scientific methodologies, and measurements, to provide subjective impressions, highly personalized assessments, and observe qualities that would only be meaningful to the individual observing it? There are plenty of places where you can go for subjective content, or even more “balanced” analysis and impressions.

Sure, no methodology or philosophy is beyond reproach. But I have to ask, in doing so, does it provide you with any measurable results?
 
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amirm

amirm

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It's just pure garbage.
You practice audio quackery. And preach the same to others. "Look what Qobuz says in their review!" By publicizing their junk audio assessments, you aid and abet in their mission. If that bothered you, think back and decide why you believe in something where you can't quote even a single scientific paper to back it.
 

August

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When the lie of snake oil is broken, the enthusiasts will always try their best to defend it. Because they can’t admit how stupid they were when they brag about these snake oils. Good engineering is not necessarily better, but bad engineering must be worse (in terms of sound performance), I think amirm does not need to be so euphemistic.
 
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August

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I am from China. Foshan City, China is a gathering place for DIYhifi equipment. The equipment engineering design that was born there is good or bad. There are many snake oil manufacturers here. I have never defended these snake oil manufacturers and are ashamed of them. They are not even promoted in China because they know they are notorious in chifi. I don't know how they are popular in foreign countries. The payment method of Payment to Delivery is very ridiculous in China.
(google translate, forgive me)
 

Hemi-Demon

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@Calexico
Why not just buy the AS-1, or the 11.38 performance version, and then ship it to amirm for testing? Audio-Gd has posted their own measurements, and they look nothing like the data produced from this site. It would be awesome if either yourself or audiophonics could send one, or both over, to confirm that amirm has this bias, that "you" keep inferring. I mean the Okto, VMV, Qutest, DX3pro and Matrix all seem to perform to standard. Do you think that the output data for all the tested Audio-Gd devices on this site have been tampered with or something? We all love audio, this site has been invaluable to the consumer who wants data to back up what they hear, and what they spend their hard earned money on. Maybe support the love of audio and send one of these over to be tested.

Maybe we can auction it off, so you could get your money back, if you did not want to keep it. Heck I would buy it myself, but I have already purchased and owned two Audio-Gd devices, and I need to move on to other companies.
 
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Calexico

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You practice audio quackery. And preach the same to others. "Look what Qobuz says in their review!" By publicizing their junk audio assessments, you aid and abet in their mission. If that bothered you, think back and decide why you believe in something where you can't quote even a single scientific paper to back it.
This is you that is quackering with your measurements fanatism. I just warn people that not all people think and experience like you. The truth is yet to discover.
 

Calexico

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Measurements fanatism:
if good engineered:
- no difference between output stages
- no difference between dac chipsets
- no advantage of filters that have slower roll off of minimum phase
- all differences that are appreciated can be emulated (if difference can be measured)
- Delta sigma has no drawbacks
- tube has no advantage
- discret output has no advantage

All of this is wrong.

you change the reality so that it fits your pseudo science.

Science is modeling the reality.
It's not changing the reality so that it fits it.
 

VintageFlanker

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What I don't understand is why people still arguing with Calexico. He's clearly wrong and lazy to do what Amir asked him to do. Amir has years and years of experience behind him and Calexico just have anecdotes behind him. Please ignore his posts. Please.
Thanks for the suggestion, really. I'm done. :eek: Didn't even kwon "ignore" was an option... and never thought I would have to use this here. :p
 
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amirm

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Science is modeling the reality.
It's not changing the reality so that it fits it.
Sadly that is a message that you seem to never want to learn. After all, if you had, you would be citing some kind of scientific reference for all that you say but we don't see any.
 

JohnYang1997

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Measurements fanatism:
if good engineered:
- no difference between output stages
- no difference between dac chipsets
- no advantage of filters that have slower roll off of minimum phase
- all differences that are appreciated can be emulated (if difference can be measured)
- Delta sigma has no drawbacks
- tube has no advantage
- discret output has no advantage

All of this is wrong.

you change the reality so that it fits your pseudo science.

Science is modeling the reality.
It's not changing the reality so that it fits it.
Show some ABX results to show if it's wrong or not. I did test proving there is difference between filters in dx3pro and there are measurements supported. Very minor difference. If you can show 95+% accuracy of ABX for different filters along with measurements then we talking. Now you are just talking out of your ass without any support of evidence from controlled listening test nor scientific references.
Show me perfectly engineered output stages. There are literally less than handful strictly transparent amplifier in the world. Most are less than ideal. And you say you prefer somewhat less ideal measured ones makes no sense at all.
Delta sigma does have limitations but its benefits out weights the drawbacks which allowing the performance to be so good. Poorly designed deltasigma will measure like shit and will sound like shit. R2R especially discrete ones are never live up to remotely close. If you go back to pcm1704 and try implement to the full potential it will beat all discrete r2r as well as poorly implemented delta sigma. It doesn't matter how you achieve it, it's the resul that matters.
Measurements do as well have limitations, not that you can't measure it just that the design of an measurement and the interpretation of the measurements are not so perfect. Like the ess imd hump. It doesn't affect on traditional imd test at max level but shows clear modulation in different tests when with full level. Different construction of multitone signal also has affect.
Measurement is not everything, but without measurement it's likely to achieve nothing at all. None of the companies avoid at least using some sort of measurements in the designing phase and/or production. If you say otherwise then make one yourself.

Then tubes have minimal advantage not only because it needs high voltage to extend the linear region, it has very low gain. So in comparable circuits BJT will be better. Same with mosfets. It's not cut and dry that tube is always worse but the result is what matters. Measurements will clearly show the better one. This is not at the limitation of measurements, far from it. Whether you can use tubes to make really good performance is obviously possible. But just you need to work harder.

Discrete output has no advantage if you can make same or better performance using ICs. For the most part, ics don't have better power dissipation ability nor enough biasing current to allow low distortion at low impedance load. But it's not saying it's impossible. Especially for headphones, tpa6120 within a composite feedback loop will beat any discrete design within its designed condition. Some discrete designs are indeed very good like Schiit ragnarok. It's miles ahead the magni in terms of performance but you are essentially using a power amplifier for headphones. How much power does it dissipate?
The thing can go on and on. Just because you don't understand something doesn't mean it doesn't work. Just because you don't feel comfortable about some concepts doesn't mean it's wrong.
 

solderdude

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Incorrect potshots with no basis other than anger towards technical measurements that don't seem to support their (sighted) subjective findings and beliefs. Mostly based on group thinking supporting their 'evidence'.

I hope someday you learn how to test correctly (blind, statistically valid and with rigor and understanding) and then you'll understand.
 

Purité Audio

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@Calexico, you can choose to listen to whatever you like, ultimately it is about enjoying your music.
Looks of listeners enjoy ‘effects’.
Keith
 

Wombat

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Phew. :oops:

No-one understands me.

Cotton-Teddy-760x500.jpg
Cotton-Teddy-760x500.jpg
 
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Wombat

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That's not me that don't recommand an audio gd dac without listening to it.


You have made that very clear, ad nauseam. It is the bigger picture that you don't see. :facepalm:
 

Frank Dernie

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What I don't understand is why people still arguing with Calexico. He's clearly wrong and lazy to do what Amir asked him to do. Amir has years and years of experience behind him and Calexico just have anecdotes behind him. Please ignore his posts. Please.
I blocked him some time ago, which makes this thread a bit difficult to follow, but he just was pointlessly irritating me and the same old ridiculous BS and seemed unable to stop. Forum diarrhoea.
He seemed very stupid to me and as a person with Asperger’s I struggle to deal with stupid or ignorant, it is a big weakness of mine but I have learned to live with it.
 
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