Carver Crimson 275 Review (Tube Amp)

[Blumlein 88]

And you stopped short of listening to it. Could be that the guy that built it had a bad day. What is so wrong about giving a different one a try?

If I took everything back that was defective out of the box and did not try again, I would not have the gear I have now.

When you see the transformers used were rated for 15 watts, and people have found it not to put out anything close to 75 watts, and finally Amir tests it with similar results you really don't have to be a genius to know it isn't a 75 wpc continuous amp. Nor do we need extraordinary proof of that once that is known. Nor do you have to wonder about a 'bad' sample when you get results you'd expect of such a bottlenecked design.

 

[Blumlein 88]

John,

As much as I would love for people on this site to listen to the amplifier, some minds were made up long ago. You know Bob to be a man of great passion and integrity.
This is an open forum with participants from various backgrounds. He clearly stated
he does not care to attempt to debate here, nor should he. His tenure in the electronics
industry is well documented.


This evening, even after offering an unprecedented remedy, he was confronted with headwinds.

Kudos for offering full refunds. OTOH, here is why there are still headwinds. Quoting from Bob's post.

The 275 is a powerful, easy to listen to amplifier. I am happy with its design. In fact, this is one of the best designs I have produced. If for any reason a customer is disappointed in the performance or sound quality of this amplifier, they may return it for a full refund. The general reception of the 275 to date has been that of a high quality design, one that does not disappoint in any respect. The performance as it was measured by Amir does not do justice to the sound engineering of the 275.

It is not a powerful amplifier. It is not near the power it is claimed to be. Amir's testing shows what it is. Bob is still trying to dance around that. Bob had a reputation for integrity and out of the box thinking. For some reason he has basically thrown that all away on this amp design. WHY? I don't know. Once he has clearly tried to pull a fast one he loses the privilege of being given the benefit of the doubt in trying to remain "above the discussion of his amp". Best thing for him to do is admit the low power. Maybe he can explain why it doesn't matter, but until he does that he has not been honest with his customers.

 

[traderitch]

“….Amir tests it with similar results you really don't have to be a genious [sic] to know it isn't a 75 wpc continuous amp.”

You are correct.

 

[Holmz]

John,

As much as I would love for people on this site to listen to the amplifier, some minds were made up long ago.

This is the heralding cry of every person that denies the measurements and things such as, the unit is unsafe, and the distortions are totally out of control.

“Just listen to it” they say…

• I am not inclined to even listen to a 3k$ amp, that is not fit for purpose.
• I am not that much of a moron To even consider it.

I would suggest that the person in denial here is yourself.
You mind seems made up that somehow it is good, when all the rational evidence points to the contrary.

You know Bob to be a man of great passion and integrity.

Passion and integrity are not going to be defibrulating people.

This is an open forum with participants from various backgrounds. He clearly stated he does not care to attempt to debate here, nor should he. His tenure in the electronics industry is well documented.

And what has that got to do with this amplifier?

• It says 75W and makes 1/5th of that… What is there to debate there?
• He also said that they will fix the grounding, so there is no debate there either.

 

[traderitch]

@Holmz

I am not sure why you are trying to create a debate when there isn’t one to have at this point.

 

[voodooless]

@Holmz

I am not sure why you are trying to create a debate when there isn’t one to have at this point.

Because you keep telling us:

You know Bob to be a man of great passion and integrity.

And

His tenure in the electronics industry is well documented.

And that is supposed to make it all go away.

If he doesn’t want to debate, he should not have posted here. It’s as simple as that.

 

[Gringoaudio1]

Fixing the safety issues will not fix the undersized output transformers and resulting inability to meet power specs. or the other issues with audio quality Amir identified. If that was indeed a response from Mr. Carver it was wholly inadequate.

 

[traderitch]

If he doesn’t want to debate, he should not have posted here.

Think really hard about this statement.

 

[voodooless]

Think really hard about this statement.

….

Nope, nothing else pops in my mind… must be me then.

 

[traderitch]

….

Nope, nothing else pops in my mind… must be me then.

Not even a little bit?

”It has come to my attention that my amplifier design has come under sharp criticism on this forum.”

 

[voodooless]

Not even a little bit?

”It has come to my attention that my amplifier design has come under sharp criticism on this forum.”

So? That changes nothing.

 

[traderitch]

So? That changes nothing.

Are you messing with me?

The debate began on this forum.
He responded directly to this forum.

 

[caught gesture]

And there it is.

Patience is a virtue.

You are helping many of us develop our virtue!

 

[caught gesture]

The 275 is a powerful, easy to listen to amplifier. I am happy with its design.

Not as powerful as your misleading specifications indicate. How does one measure “easy to listen to”? What does that even mean? Are you really happy with the safety aspects of the design/manufacturing? If so, why would you be offering a recall service at surely some expense to your company?

 

[voodooless]

The debate began on this forum.
He responded directly to this forum.

Did he come here to debate? No! He made that very clear. My comment stands!

 

[SIY]

So deny, deny, deny, deflect, deflect, deflect. This is an illegally and unsafely manufactured product being sold fraudulently. Sorry, but that's still the bottom line, and content-free denials and energetically slavering shills don't change this.

Carver has done some interesting and creative work over the years, but this has just destroyed any semblance of honestly and integrity that he had. It's very, very sad.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Amir,

The promise is from Bob.
He took the time to remedy the concerns of this forum directly.

There is a network of dealers that will have the information for dissemination.

He never said anything about making the amplifiers meet its power specification.

 

[Holmz]

@Holmz

I am not sure why you are trying to create a debate when there isn’t one to have at this point.

Sorry - I was under the impression that the facts were being debated?

Are we in agreement that:

• The grounding is not present
• …and… That the power in 1/5th of what was advertised

 

[whazzup]

This and Starke Sound AD4, has been really interesting seeing how manufacturers / distributors / dealers / reviewers respond when they're caught with shortfalls in their specs. As if listening with human ears somehow means that publishing lies becomes acceptable....

 

[solderdude]

Sorry - I was under the impression that the facts were being debated?

Are we in agreement that:

• The grounding is not present
• …and… That the power in 1/5th of what was advertised

Grounding is not present and Amirs measurements show that using music the rated power is reached. Just not continuous (see measurement on the right). I assume the amp will be used playing music which it'll probably do fine (until a fuse blows when overloading).

How many people have been electrocuted with this particular amp. Sure the chassis should have been grounded (because a 3 pin IEC socket was used) or a 2 pin socket would have to be used and double insulated marking should be on there (as seen in many AVR).
In the latter case the manufacturer would have to have a production model tested to see if it complies to the rules. This most likely was never done. In fact... I would even say that a grounded device should also be tested. I suspect none of their products are tested but may well comply. We just don't know.