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KEF LS50 Meta vs KEF R3

thewas

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i think the preference score improved because KEF re-voice the ls50 in the metas..,
Correct, the meta material doesn't directly affect the frequency response and thus the score but the drivers distortion and spectral decay which don't influence the currently limited to frequency response FR Harman score.
 

Daverz

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Not meaning to hijack the thread, but I currently have Buchardt S400s and am wondering if I should take advantage of the sale price to pick up the R3s. It's a sideways move pricewise, but the R3 look to be smoother on axis and to has smoother directivity. Horizontal dispersion width seems similar, though much better vertical dispersion for the R3. I have a 2.1 setup with the SVS SB-1000 Pro crossed over at 80 Hz and use DRC-FIR for room correction. Listening chair and speakers are in an equilateral triangle with 2.3 meter sides.
 

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sweetchaos

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I currently have Buchardt S400s

Spinorama:
Dash line = Buchardt S400
Continuous line = Kef R3
both.png

both2.gif
Preference Score (if goes up to 10):

Kef R3:
Without EQ: Preference Score is 6.5 and would be 8.2 with a perfect subwoofer.
With EQ: Preference Score is 7.0 and would be 8.6 with a perfect subwoofer and the same EQ.

Buchardt S400:
Without EQ: Preference Score is 5.6 and would be 7.6 with a perfect subwoofer.
With EQ: Preference Score is 6.5 and would be 8.5 with a perfect subwoofer and the same EQ.

So if you EQ the S400's, and add the perfect sub, it will match EQ'd Kef R3's with a perfect sub.

Bass extension:
Kef R3: 35Hz at -6dB (winner)
Buchardt S400: 43Hz at -6dB

Distortion:
Seems R3 is a bit cleaner...but not by much.
both.gif

Plus, they both have similar horizontal directivity....so not much difference there.
update: r3 has a smaller horizontal directivity than S400.

So overall, not a major upgrade, but still an upgrade to get the R3's.
 
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Daverz

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Spinorama:

Thanks for the animated plots! Yeah, I'm aware of the EQ for the S400 based on improving the preference score. However, I didn't hear an audible difference with it's applied. I'm also somewhat suspicious of the meaning of a single metric like that. Perhaps I should put the money into more DRC software (e.g. Acourate) and gear.
 

richard12511

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Not meaning to hijack the thread, but I currently have Buchardt S400s and am wondering if I should take advantage of the sale price to pick up the R3s. It's a sideways move pricewise, but the R3 look to be smoother on axis and to has smoother directivity. Horizontal dispersion width seems similar, though much better vertical dispersion for the R3. I have a 2.1 setup with the SVS SB-1000 Pro crossed over at 80 Hz and use DRC-FIR for room correction. Listening chair and speakers are in an equilateral triangle with 2.3 meter sides.

Would be a very interesting comparison if you do. I'd love to hear your thoughts on the differences.

Rereading the Buchardt review, it actually measures better than I remembered. It was a very early review, and I think too much was made of that 500-530Hz peak. How critical is that error, really? The JBL 4309 - for example - had a much wider(800-1500Hz?) and taller peak that was found to be of almost no consequence to either Amir or @napilopez. Re-examining this 500Hz peak now with the hindsight of that JBL speaker, I would guess it's a very difficult peak to hear with most music.

I bet the 1500Hz DI error is probably more audible. Even that error is not that bad. The KEF R3 also has a 1500Hz DI error, though it's in the opposite direction, and less severe. Side by side, I'd say the KEF does measure slightly better, but the difference is small, and they both measure very well for the price.

The Buchardt looks to have wider horizontal dispersion(120°?) than the KEF(90°?). Looking at your layout, I could actually see wide dispersion working well. You do have different right and left walls(which usually favors narrow dispersion), but the right wall is open, and the left wall is angled away such that the first arriving reflections will likely bounce several times before hitting the ear.
 

stevenswall

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Maybe its a trade?

Point source coaxial vs wider dispersion

The first it's harder to do well
Note: the 8260 uses a point source coaxial driver like The Ones.... Just adds a much bigger woofer and wider dispersion.
 

thewas

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Side by side, I'd say the KEF does measure slightly better, but the difference is small, and they both measure very well for the price.
Like you say the biggest difference is the wideness of radiation plus of course the vertical which is better controlled on the coaxial KEF:

index.php


index.php
 
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D

Descartes

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Like you say the biggest difference is the wideness of radiation plus of course the vertical which is better controlled on the coaxial KEF:

index.php


index.php
Can you show the LS50 Meta as well!
 

Ata

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sweetchaos

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Where did you see that?
It's speculation at this point...
 
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Ata

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Oh, OK, we are still waiting on that, it did not happen in October and for a moment I thought I missed an announcement...
 

tecnogadget

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Where did you see that?
Nowhere, people just love to make assumptions bases on nothing. I wish KEF had never released LS50 “Meta”…freaking lovely metamaterial…im part of the Kef Owners group and there isn’t a week where two or three times people ask the same thing…should I go “Ls50 Meta or R3”?
This last 5 years kef became that much mainstream now the vast majority of their customers are amateur that read a few guides on the internet, KEF customers used to be more loyal or fanboy enough to know about the company history and upgrade cycles and where they are going, and what’s their goals or company values.
 

sweetchaos

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im part of the Kef Owners group and there isn’t a week where two or three times people ask the same thing…should I go “Ls50 Meta or R3”?
Okay…is that a bad thing?

How’s that different from people asking which Genelecs to buy?
“Should I buy 8030 or 8330 or 8040 or 8340?
Oh wait, what about 8331 or 8341 or 8351 or 8361?”

The members of ASR community try to help each other decide on how to spend their hard-earned money.

Otherwise, we’ll all be in the Kef, Genelec forums, asking the same questions.
 
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