killdozzer
Major Contributor
Looks aside, I love the guy. In my life, I probably laughed the hardest at his stand up of all other stand ups.
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Which speakers are the Classical Music Pros using?
- Thread starter tuga
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Or Front to Back, which I tend to consider as related. I understand the effectively anechoic (except for the floor) environment between the speakers and the engineer, but I am a little confused by why the ceiling and rear wall diffusers are claimed only interact with the engineer, not the the speakers in any way. https://www.audiotechnology.com/tutorials/hearing-double-2
Unless someone posts a measurement it'll be a mistery and I hardly believe that. I can see it with the ceiling, but on the back? Not so sure. Maybe they are angled in a specific way.
But yes, the concept is basically floor and front wall are reflective with baffle wall mount and everything else is anechoic.
You can go listen outdoors if you have the space (speaker mount is going different probably, unless you wish to make a wall just for speakers) and have some kind of resemblance I think.
But yes, the concept is basically floor and front wall are reflective with baffle wall mount and everything else is anechoic.
You can go listen outdoors if you have the space (speaker mount is going different probably, unless you wish to make a wall just for speakers) and have some kind of resemblance I think.
Maybe stretching the definition 'classical', but definitely 'pros'. Does anybody recognise the speakers? Picture from this New York Times article: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/27/arts/music/abba-reunion-voyage.html
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Galliardist
Major Contributor
Define it then?
Björn Ulvaeus and Benny Andersson (the 'B's in ABBA) in Andersson's studio in Stockholm, Sweden.
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bo_knows
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Looks like TAD speakers (TAD-CR1TX-EB). Did not recognize the ABBA superstars. Dang, it.
LOL
killdozzer
Major Contributor
The small ones might be Yamaha's with that white driver. There's what I believe is an ATC sub built in wall behind them. And these towers are at the tip of my tongue...
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Yes, the dreaded 80s-90s "studio standard" NS-10... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_NS-10
killdozzer
Major Contributor
Still today my musician friends have those delusions about making something sound good on such a screechy sounding speakers and it must sound good on most speakers. I let them have it, they would start hating me if I corrected them all the time and they don't own those Yamaha's so it's not like something bad is going to happen bc of this urban legend.
Geert
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As a matter of fact, if you can make something sound better on NS10's it will sound amazing on better speakers (except for the low end which you can judge on these speakers). Making a pop song sound amazing on NS10's takes hard work.
Not saying you should use NS10's as the final reference, and definitely not for mastering.
Not saying you should use NS10's as the final reference, and definitely not for mastering.
killdozzer
Major Contributor
I think this is the wrong approach. Making something sound good on a piece of gear with pronounced sound signature makes it sound good only on that specific piece of gear.
I see it like this; NS10 are commonly referred to as having unpleasant, ear-gnawing highs. So you would obviously attenuate highs in the mix. Then you play that music on some speakers that don't have such tweeters and you miss highs.
I believe this is the whole idea behind Floyd Toole trying to come up with a standard which could, for the most part, guarantee that recorded music sounds similar in your listening room as it sounded in the studio.
Geert
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It's how it's been done for ages, and it lead to amazing sounding records.
No, because the problem with the highs is a known problem, so with the NS10's you focus on the mid's and getting a punchy bass out of a small speaker. (Some engineers even put a piece of toilet paper over the tweeter). And like I said, it should not be your final reference.
Indeed, so if you only use amazing sounding studio monitors to create a mix you might find out the result sounds crap on lesser speakers, like the one people will be using 99% of the time. That's where the NS10's come in, or why engineers and musicians like to check a mix on their car stereo.
killdozzer
Major Contributor
Completely wrong. You can't use a bad speaker to prevent bad sound on other bad speakers unless it is that exact same bad speaker. That's just a rabbit hole. Not to comment on toilet paper.
You obviously don't understand what Toole is proposing since it has nothing to do with using amazing sounding studio monitors.
Sorry, but what you write makes no sense to me.
Ages don't mean much and amazing sounding records are not due to NS10s.
OP
tuga
Major Contributor
- Thread Starter
- #536
Oxford Dictionary defines it as
"Serious music following long-established principles rather than a folk, jazz, or popular tradition."
Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words
The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!
www.lexico.com
Larousse:
Se dit, par opposition à la musique folklorique, légère, de variétés, au jazz ou à la musique contemporaine, de la musique, des œuvres des musiciens composées dans le cadre de la tradition musicale occidentale.
As opposed to folk, light, variety music, jazz or contemporary music; music, works of musicians composed within the framework of the Western musical tradition.
Wikipedia has an entry too:
Art music (alternatively called classical music, cultivated music, serious music, and canonic music[1]) is music considered to be of high aesthetic value.[2] It typically implies advanced structural and theoretical considerations[3] or a written musical tradition.[4] In this context, the terms "serious" or "cultivated" are frequently used to present a contrast with ordinary, everyday music (i.e. popular and folk music, also called "vernacular music").[2]
"Art music" is mostly used to refer to music descending from the tradition of Western classical music. Musicologist Philip Tagg refers to the elitism associated with art music as one of an "axiomatic triangle consisting of 'folk', 'art' and 'popular' musics".[5] He explains that each of these three is distinguishable from the others according to certain criteria.[5] According to Bruno Nettl, "Western classical music" may also be synonymous with "art music", "canonic music", "cultivated music", "serious music", as well as the more flippantly used "real music" and "normal music".[1] Musician Catherine Schmidt-Jones defines art music as "a music which requires significantly more work by the listener to fully appreciate than is typical of popular music". In her view, "[t]his can include the more challenging types of jazz and rock music, as well as Classical".[6]
The term "art music" refers primarily to classical traditions (including contemporary as well as historical classical music forms) that focus on formal styles, invite technical and detailed deconstruction[3] and criticism, and demand focused attention from the listener. In strict western practice, art music is considered primarily a written musical tradition,[4] preserved in some form of music notation, as opposed to being transmitted orally, by rote, or in recordings (like popular and traditional music).[4][7]
Art music - Wikipedia
Geert
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I'm not philosophizing here, I'm telling you how it's being done. From 30 years studio expirience. An NS10, or whatever speaker, is just a tool in your toolbox. And a fool with a tool is still a fool.
You have no clue. Until this "standard which could, for the most part, guarantee that recorded music sounds similar in your listening room as it sounded in the studio" exists we need to revert to other means to assure a mix translates well.
ZolaIII
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Meh you can use NS10 as only reference speaker (you don't need to love them) and it will sound good on anything else. You won't do a low end on those or for that reason any others, you will use hedaphones for that. They are old school closed enclosure (no bass port's) so very little refractions and right time domain (paper cones). You are over thinking it really. What do you do do when you're ideal "flat" speakers give you to much refraction in bass? You lower it down, you lower it and if you want to extend it a bit more. It's not a quite a same thing if it's naturally already sound like that (introducing more noise to keep noise under control which basically every signal processing is to original signal). Other benefits would be opposite specter of not critical listening on lower volume levels.
Perfect speakers are mith, this are most in perfect ones to tie them all down. And it translates great to hedaphones too with little amusement you bring in mids.
At least that's my humble opinion and you have right to disagree.
Perfect speakers are mith, this are most in perfect ones to tie them all down. And it translates great to hedaphones too with little amusement you bring in mids.
At least that's my humble opinion and you have right to disagree.
I think most people equate "classical" music with "orchestral" music. Why the big fuss over semantics? Grow up!
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