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State of the art Home Theatre - how?

Soundmixer

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Seriously? :facepalm:

Independent control of the dialog is a fantastic idea. It's much better than common workarounds of just boosting the whole center channel or turning on subtitles/closed captions.

Control of the dialog is fantastic. Any control beyond that is not helpful.
 

abdo123

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Dude, you identify LBIR and SBIR first using measurements, move your speakers (or sub(s) either further or closer to the front wall, use absorption (or diffusion) for treatment for early reflections, and THEN use room correction.



You could move the sub into the null thereby driving it, or you could add another subwoofer (or four).

Dude, this is not an insurmountable issue!

So you admit what you said is misinformation? cool.
 

Newman

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…What is your idea of SOTA? And I understand this is personal preference and why there is no consensus on this.
I think you have gone off the rails and not understand the generic meaning of SOTA. It means the current state of the art. That is what the word ‘state’ implies in SOTA. You have been musing on TUEOTAE: The Ultimate Expression Of The Art, Ever.

A SOTA discussion on AV is about what is currently on the market — and is limited to being used with recordings that are currently on the market. Or at most, recordings that have definitely been announced by the major players as coming, definitely, in the near time frame.

Also, to bring SOTA discussions further into reality, and prevent them quickly funneling into “Trinnov! And 16 Focal Grand Utopias! And 12 Super Mega Subwoofers of Choice!”, it is also very instructive to discuss “What is the SOTA in today’s AV market for (say) $10K, split between processor and speakers?” That would be very interesting. And take reliability into account, along with usability. Not helpful if we have to write our own code, or hot-wire the electronics.

cheers
 

Soundmixer

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So you admit what you said is misinformation? cool.

What I said wasn't misinformation, but it certainly needed clarity. It seems clear to me you don't understand exactly what the word misinformation means. Considering I said this previously in this conversation;

"YOu are making this so complicated it is not funny. 4 subs in an SFM setup deals very well with room modes."

Perhaps you should read the entire discussion instead of cherry-picking and then accusing somebody of misinformation.

You stated this;

"LBIR and SBIR nulls are infinitely deep, it's a complete cancelation of the wave, the only thing room correction can do here is blow up your speakers."

LBIR and SBIR not only produce nulls, but they also produce peaks. You neglected to mention that, so is that misinformation? Room correction can most certainly handle a peak even if it cannot fix a null.
 
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mga2009

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If you have a look at the service manual for your AVR and find the analog audio block schematic, you will see a configuration that is quite similar to the one depicted below.

In order to make use of the AVR's onboard volume control in conjunction with your DSP, you will simply need to choose a pair of pins on the NJU (InC and OutC, for instance) and disconnect them from the DAC and amplifier. You can then connect the input to a 2V reference from your DSP (voltage divider on VDD) and the output to one of its auxiliary ADCs.

Within your Sigma Studio project, you will need to create a new volume control object and pass the auxiliary ADC's value to its control input.

Some AVRs will leave one or more volume control IC channels unused (such as channel D above), which may enable you to perform this modification while leaving all of the original signal path untouched. It is important to bear in mind that the NJU channels can be controlled individually, so there exists the possibility that all unused channels are simply muted. This may be worthwhile to test.

Thanks! Sounds difficult. I will start by getting an "old" AVR and tapping the I2S lines, after that we will see about volume knob.

Also, this logic of tapping I2S lines and getting digital audio, is it possible to use a highish end bluray player with 5.1 audio outputs and getting the audio before the DAC?
 

Weeb Labs

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Thanks! Sounds difficult. I will start by getting an "old" AVR and tapping the I2S lines, after that we will see about volume knob.

Also, this logic of tapping I2S lines and getting digital audio, is it possible to use a highish end bluray player with 5.1 audio outputs and getting the audio before the DAC?
Provided said BluRay player includes multichannel analog outputs, yes.

1631202948832.png
 

mga2009

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Provided said BluRay player includes multichannel analog outputs, yes.

Thanks for your reply! That seems to be a cheaper way to start (of course you loose all the AVR function...

I also have one of these HDMI to multichannel I2S board, that works... but I don't have an oscilloscope to check jitter, noise and other problems that this board might have.
 

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Weeb Labs

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Thanks for your reply! That seems to be a cheaper way to start (of course you loose all the AVR function...

I also have one of these HDMI to multichannel I2S board, that works... but I don't have an oscilloscope to check jitter, noise and other problems that this board might have.
Those boards won't perform any decoding, unfortunately. They require an LPCM input.
 

mga2009

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Those boards won't perform any decoding, unfortunately. They require an LPCM input.

I know... AVR it's a better option.

But this board is an starting point for an "all" or "mostly all" digital setup with HDMI input...

I still suspect that having all my media in an HTPC, plus APO Equalizer (for digital XO) and a 16+ channel USB interface, it's a better option.
 

FrantzM

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I know... AVR it's a better option.

But this board is an starting point for an "all" or "mostly all" digital setup with HDMI input...

I still suspect that having all my media in an HTPC, plus APO Equalizer (for digital XO) and a 16+ channel USB interface, it's a better option.
Well … you still have the issue of decoding the latest codecs. At this point in time these are not available to the general public.
 

Weeb Labs

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You might be able to obtain a CS49844A or similar decoder via AliExpress but datasheets are not publicly available, which complicates implementation.
 

archerious

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192kbps

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Kal Rubinson

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Today, one can eliminate the Lynx card and the stack of stereo DACs in favor of:
1. Using Jriver and the PC's USB output to a multichannel DAC such as the Okto DAC8 Pro or the exaSound e68 (or s88).
2. Using Jriver and your LAN to direct multichannel output to an exaSound s88.
 

Andysu

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I consider my system to be State of the Art. High SINAD of 115 dB+, high output voltage capability (+24 dBu), DC coupled DAC and amplifiers, ultra low distortion speakers and subs, high sensitivity speakers and subs, high output capability (~140 db), and basically unlimited bass routing capability.

I have the following system for audio:

Processor: StormAudio ISP with AVB board (16 analog & 32 channels of digital output via AVB)
AVB Interface for HTPC: RME Digiface AVB
AVB Network Switch: Luminex GigaCore 10
DAC: RME M-32 DA Pro (AVB from StormAudio or directly from HTPC - 32 channels of DA conversion)
Speaker Amps: 17 channels of Cherry MEGAschino MONO, MEGAschino Stereo, and Maraschino 60v MONO amps
Subwoofer Amps: 3 ea SpeakerPower SP2-4800 (2x2400 watts)
Main Speakers: 3 ea RTJ Audio 410RM
Surround Speakers: 16 ea RTJ Audio 110
Subwoofers: 6 ea of RJT Audio 18Sub
where are the pictures of your set up ? i just read a list and take it with bag of salt . pictures please if bragging lol
 

Andysu

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Like a lot of people on this site, I am amazed that there is no really State Of The Art home theatre solution.
Even $17,000 AV processors perform far worse than a $100 DAC.
I would love to have some input on how could we do a SOTA HT.
For a stereo system it's not too hard - with AES outputs we can do all the equalisation and crossover before the DAC.
Plenty of nice DACs with >120 dB performance.
Active speakers and we're done.

For home theatre with active speakers we end up with a lot of channels if we have 7.1 or more system x 2 or 3 way.
But a harder problem is the source material, we seem more or less stuck with an AVR for all the licenses for the latest Dolby and DTS lossless CODECs.
And the onboard DAC implementation in even the most expensive is not SOTA.
And the license rules mean no accessible PCM streams we can send to be equalised, crossed-over and then DACed in a SOTA DAC.

So far the best approach seems to be to use the excellent @Weeb Labs videos to hack an AVR to extract the I2S streams, possibly convert to AES.
Once we have I2S or AES then what?
We need volume control, usually done in the AVR after the DAC AFAIK.
So a multichannel DAC with volume control, maybe the Okto 8 once it becomes re-available.
But for multi-way active speakers, can multiple units be tied to work in unison?
What about the DSP and crossover?
Does this sound like a project anyone else would be interested in?

David
bragging rights . lets see your home theatre system . i posted mine here https://www.audiosciencereview.com/.../thx-cinema-with-pro-cinema-audio-gear.21127/

more channels . my super star 360fm does 360 channels which is more than atmos 125 and it can both tx/rx and has light of speed power around the earth seven times in just 1 second
 
OP
Dave Zan

Dave Zan

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Provided said BluRay player includes multichannel analog outputs, yes.
Those boards won't perform any decoding, unfortunately. They require an LPCM input.
I assume that if a BluRay player decodes the audio for multi channel analog then their HDMI output will also be decoded to LPCM.
So an HDMI extractor should work, do you (or anyone) have any experience to confirm or disprove this?
What I am more interested in is if any AVRs also produce a decoded HDMI stream.
It would make sense to put this on the HDMI so it would be possible to use an HDMI sound-bar as (last resort!) speaker option.
Of course, the main point of an AVR is to use proper speakers, so does any one actually do this?
The benefit is that it would be possible to do your modification on a cheap 7.1 HDMI audio extractor and not risk an expensive AVR to a clumsy mistake.
And to not have to repeat the modification if the AVR is replaced.
lets see your home theatre system . i posted mine here
Only if you use correct capitalisation, punctuation and a question mark.:)(Jokes aside, do you realise your stuff has readability problems?)
Actually not much to see, I have an old Harman AVR that I wish to replace, hence this thread.

Best wishes
David
 
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