What's the deal with microphones?

[Chromatischism]

One advantage of external gear is that there is zero latency, so you sound like a god as you are recording

I want this just for my Zoom meetings.

 

[earlevel]

There are very fine small diaphragm condenser to be had for voice work, like the Earthworks Audio SR314.

I doubt the OP is looking to spend that kind of money, so a bit out of context, but there are definitely good SDCs. In the '70s, I got to borrow a couple of KM84s and Nagra to record my grand piano, sounded awesome. The little Soyuz sound great.

But of course if we're talking budget, and we're talking voice, there is no need to muddy the water—certain advantages to going dynamic, otherwise an LDC is going to be your most likely solution. My cheapest LDC was $50 (CAD GXL-2200) on sale including tax and shipping, and really didn't sound bad (but I bought it to mode, put something like $270 into it, K47 capsule and every component upgraded).

Not so much aimed at VO, but to repeat the point that pro results don't need to break the bank, Alan Parsons said his favorite mic was the AT4033 ($400), and he could record everything with it. If I had no mic and $300, I might get an Aston Origin and be happy, though I haven't tried it on me. (Music Tribe bought them a few months back—will the price drop? Will the quality holdup?)

 

[Chromatischism]

I doubt the OP is looking to spend that kind of money, so a bit out of contest, but there are definitely good SDCs. In the '70s, I got to borrow a couple of KM84s and Nagra to record my grand piano, sounded awesome. The little Soyuz sound great.

But of course if we're talking budget, and we're talking voice, there is no need to muddy the water—certain advantages to going dynamic, otherwise an LDC is going to be your most likely solution. My cheapest LDC was $50 (CAD GXL-2200) on sale including tax and shipping, and really didn't sound bad (but I bought it to mode, put something like $270 into it, K47 capsule and every component upgraded).

Not so much aimed at VO, but to repeat the point that pro results don't need to break the bank, Alan Parsons said his favorite mic was the AT4033 ($400), and he could record everything with it. If I had no mic and $300, I might get an Aston Origin and be happy, though I haven't tried it on me. (Music Tribe bought them a few months back—will the price drop? Will the quality holdup?)

You seem to know a lot on this subject. There are so many cardioid condenser microphones on Amazon. M-Audio NOVA, AT2020, Stellar X2...

And what about lavalier mics?

 

[earlevel]

You seem to know a lot on this subject. There are so many cardioid condenser microphones on Amazon. M-Audio NOVA, AT2020, Stellar X2...

And what about lavalier mics?

I don't know...I did look at lavaliers a while back, for the convenience of recording video with dialog in another room (office/studio is a bit crowded, recoding into my iPhone would be convenient and avoid the tedium of dialog replacement). Some sound very good and natural, but of course you won't get the nice low end, if you want that bigger-than-life sound. Though people are used to having an introduction with the speaker that sounds natural, then transitioning to the big intimate sound for voice over, so you can do both. A shotgun mic would be another choice for live sections. In a treated room, a regular mic just off camera might do it.

To be clear, I don't have experience owning a lot of mics Or even using a lot—the only things I have here that has a chance of getting miked are my voice and my grand piano (but I always use sampled piano plugin when I record). V-drums, guitar through amp sims, keyboards, or just MIDI to virtual instruments. So, I'm good with talking about the technology, and specific mics I know, and general wisdom, but I run out of gas real fast after that with specific recommendations.

If not for COVID, I might would have likely driven to Vintage King (LA) and auditioned. But even direct comparison is tough for people who don't have a lot of experience—just like choosing speakers or headphones—so advice to "try them for yourself and pick the one that's right for you!" is common but not always helpful. That's why I say to spend time on the boards with pros who have big mic lockers and are always trying new ones. Give weight to people whose work impresses you. What pushed me over the edge (after already much listening) on my current mic is that I explained I didn't want to wrestle with which of my mics to use on a given song, I wanted one so good there would be no decision needed. A guy said "trust me, this mic is that"—I listened to some of his body of work, and dam, it was amazingly well done. And there are "budget" sections of these forums ("Low End Theory" on gearspace, for instance).

 

[AnalogSteph]

Lavs are useful if you really need to hide the mic and placing it out of shot isn't really feasible, but do note that the affordable ones tend to be unbalanced consumer jobs for camcorders or smartphones, not phantom-powered XLR. If you need that, the best bang/buck options tend to be medium/large diaphragm condenser jobs ($50-150 range... usually dynamic below that).

For Zoom calls alone, you probably would not have to get much fancier than a $60 Mackie EM-91C and a basic boom arm. That said, don't expect any miracles from the effectiveness of the supplied shockmount (some tinkering may be needed) or the longevity of a $20 boom arm. As the budget seems to extend up to about $200, I would check out the AT2035 as well ($150 including a decent shockmount... Lewitt LCT 240 PRO is quite similar overall, just a bit brighter and weaker in the low end).

Some more options up to $100 (new and used):

I'd have to agree with him that the AT2020 may be overrated - it's a decent mic but definitely not the last word in either low end response or self-noise. The trusty Samson C-01 has kept up fairly well for a sub-$100 mic, it still sounds good even if it has been surpassed by numerous more modern contenders in terms of self-noise (it's a real oldie by now).
YouTube generally is a good place to look for mic reviews and samples. Check out the Podcastage channel for sure, he has tons of reviews and comparisons up, including any of the above I think.

And for S&Gs, everyone's favorite grumpy no-BS metal dude recently came up with a little roundup, too:

And here's quite a range of different mic types compared (lav, shotgun, SDC, vintage LDC, even a ribbon):

Oh, and I absolutely reckon that you can do a lot with EQ once the mic has a decent off-axis response and is essentially devoid of high-Q resonances. You may not be able to get a $20 condenser to quite sound like a Neumann U87, but once you get to $60-80 or $150, chances for a fairly close match should be pretty decent. Modeling microphones are a thing, too... they can't always replicate the sound exactly but willl get fairly close.

NB - I would dangle LDCs from slightly above and maybe 45° off to the side (but still facing your mouth)... mounting upside down should keep most dust out of the mic. You don't want any on the diaphragm. The offset angle should also keep plosives out of the mic (even without a windscreen) and at least part of the mic + arm out of the webcam picture (or not in front of your face at least).

 

[dfuller]

1. When people talk about how microphones sound, are they really not applying EQ? Like, if they say a microphone is light in the bass...that means they aren't boosting the bass? Doesn't EQ account for 90% of a microphone's sound?

Think of it this way: you can't boost in what isn't there already.

3. Adding on to the room-rejection, this is caused by the directivity of the microphone - shouldn't the directivity basically be identical between different diaphragm sizes/types? Like shouldn't all cardioid 1" units have the same basic pattern?

Nope! The way they get that polar pattern will be somewhat different, plus capsules are built differently, plus polarization voltage (if a condenser), plus the headbasket/grille.

5. My large diaphragm condenser has a sort of pleasant thickness to it, and produces a nice loud signal, but my tiny instrument type omni condensers (made by Niaint) and my speaker measurement microphone sound far truer to life. Does anyone use small diaphragm condensors for voice or are they using the microphone as an effect unit?

The problem with small diaphragm condensers is that they're ridiculously sensitive to plosives and they have higher self-noise which makes them not particularly suitable to voice recording. And yes, using the mic as a kind of "static EQ" is a thing.

4. It seems to me that the most useful application for expensive, beautiful sounding mics would be where EQ and other processing is impractical, like a live radio show, but people use them in recording studios where everything is processed anyway? What's up with that?

Again - can't add what isn't already there. Plus, it's much, much easier to mix already-good sources than having to fix mediocre ones.

 

[Chromatischism]

I'd have to agree with him that the AT2020 may be overrated - it's a decent mic but definitely not the last word in either low end response or self-noise.

Interesting – the top review on Amazon has a video where the reviewer recorded his voice and he noted no noticeable noise and it sounded decent:

https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-AT2020USB-Cardioid-Condenser-Microphone/dp/B00B5ZX9FM/

I see from the shootout how it sounds thinner than some of the others. I thought it sounded better than he declared, though.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I'd say the Lewitt LCT240 is worth your consideration. I've a few Lewitts though not that model.

 

[dshreter]

What's the deal with microphones?

They’re not micro, and they’re not even phones! - Jerry Seinfeld (maybe)

 

[Chromatischism]

If I had no mic and $300, I might get an Aston Origin and be happy, though I haven't tried it on me.

Aston Origin vs Rode NT1?

Still, the more I think about it, if I'm sitting at the computer desk, maybe it would be better to go with a dynamic mic so it doesn't pick up as much of the computer fan noise, the air conditioner, the keyboard, the kids next door, etc. Thoughts?

 

[earlevel]

Aston Origin vs Rode NT1?

Still, the more I think about it, if I'm sitting at the computer desk, maybe it would be better to go with a dynamic mic so it doesn't pick up as much of the computer fan noise, the air conditioner, the keyboard, the kids next door, etc. Thoughts?

Yeah, I haven't heard the NT1, but it's sure popular. The Aston was arbitrary, seemed surprisingly good for the money, but all depends if it floats you boat... [ PS—and to be clear I mean for singing. ]

I have an SM7B. It sounds good. It's not exciting, but it's pleasant, and works for vocals, dialog, maybe anything (going to be awkward for mic'ing drums, I must admit—large, heavy, awkward shape). There's a youtube video...can't think of the engineer/producer (wasn't Greg Wells, but someone who reminds me of him)...female single, big name mics, a huge boutique condenser at $3k or so. One take, all those mics up simultaneously. She listened back—"I like this one" (the SM7B). He says, "ok, you chose the 'do no harm' mic...". The cheapest mic up there by far.

Of course, Michael Jackson used an SM7 (I think not B!) for Thriller, an unconventional choice at the time, or at least for someone like Michael Jackson at peak powers. Legend has it though, that it was Michael's toe-tapping that prompted Bruce Swedien to ditch the condenser and pull out the SM7. You can use an SM7B in a less than stellar room, it won't pick everything up, but just be on-axis and reasonably close. You need more gain than you average mixer or interface gives you, though. Cloudlifters are popular for boosting to a less capable pre, or most professional pre's have enough, and some mixers and digital interfaces. Shoot for 70 dB gain, but at least 60-65.

If anyone needs an idea of what an SM7B sounds like for dialog, pull up a Joe Rogan podcast, one on everybody.

 

[Chromatischism]

The SM7B + Motu M2 looks like a good combo for desk work in an untreated room.

After watching several videos I'm not a huge fan of the sound compared to the NT1, though. The NT1 just sounds more realistic. But, it would pickup low-level background noise a lot more.

Here's a video where a female singer chose the NT1:

Then there's the NT-USB which really simplifies your setup:

Doesn't appear to sound as nice, though:

 

[Willem]

I do a lot of speech recognition work and to get reliable results a very good microphone with a lot of ambient noise rejection is needed. For this application the Sennheiser ME3 is perfect. It is also great for video conferencing, in part because it suppresses the "bathroom" sound. I use it with an external ADC into the computer. For other uses such as video recording I am lusting after a Sennheiser MKE600, but now that we are so much into online work and video conferencing, a second ME3 may have to be a higher priority. There is one thing to pay attention to with the ME3 and it is the plug that has a special locking ring (it is essentially a stage microphone). This may not fit into every sound card/ADC.

 

[Trell]

NB - I would dangle LDCs from slightly above and maybe 45° off to the side (but still facing your mouth)... mounting upside down should keep most dust out of the mic. You don't want any on the diaphragm. The offset angle should also keep plosives out of the mic (even without a windscreen) and at least part of the mic + arm out of the webcam picture (or not in front of your face at least).

The offset angle tip is a very nice tip more people should follow, and it also allows not using a pop filter with a little practice. It's common to see people hiding behind a big dynamic mic behind a big pop filter and wonder what the person looks like.

I don't put my mics upside down but I do put a cloth over them when not in use and they are out in the open. I'm only using the mic a few hours a week when working from home but often enough so that I don't want to pack it away after each use.

Edit (again, typos): Below is a quick shot made of the Rode NT1 mic with their excellent shock mount (popfilter taken off) that used to be sold along with it as a package. The other mic is the front addressed Earthworks Audio SR314 (a SCD) that I've been using for some time. The heavy mic table stand for the SR314 is adjustable in height and before I bought the SR314 I used the stand for the the NT1.

By putting the mic on the side you can even have it out of camera view by adjusting the camera zoom and mic stand height, if one prefer. For me a table stand is not in the way like boom arm would in my small office.

 

[Trell]

Aston Origin vs Rode NT1?

Still, the more I think about it, if I'm sitting at the computer desk, maybe it would be better to go with a dynamic mic so it doesn't pick up as much of the computer fan noise, the air conditioner, the keyboard, the kids next door, etc. Thoughts?

The polar pattern of the mic is important if you want to avoid pickup noise from computers etc where you put the noise source in the mics rejection zone, apart from the obvious of removing the source of the noise. My Earthworks SR314 have excellent side and rear rejection, many shot-gun mics are very directional (some are even used for voice over). The rear of my mic is pointing towards the window as to not pickup so much sound from the outside. Keyboard is to the side of the mic to reduce keyboard noise, though learning to type softly goes a long way in any case

You can even apply a high pass filter at 80Hz or so that can reduce rumbling from air conditioner and some heavy traffic. Not all audio interfaces has this though some mics have a switch for that.

https://www.lewitt-audio.com/blog/polar-patterns

 

[Chromatischism]

The polar pattern of the mic is important if you want to avoid pickup noise from computers etc where you put the noise source in the mics rejection zone, apart from the obvious of removing the source of the noise. My Earthworks SR314 have excellent side and rear rejection, many shot-gun mics are very directional (some are even used for voice over). The rear of my mic is pointing towards the window as to not pickup so much sound from the outside. Keyboard is to the side of the mic to reduce keyboard noise, though learning to type softly goes a long way in any case

Yeah, I heard the difference pretty clearly here. Watch when he backs away from the mic:

You can even apply a high pass filter at 80Hz or so that can reduce rumbling from air conditioner and some heavy traffic. Not all audio interfaces has this though some mics have a switch for that.

Good point, I'll have to look for that.

 

[Tks]

I'd say the Lewitt LCT240 is worth your consideration. I've a few Lewitts though not that model.

I discovered Lewitt thanks to you when you were selling one or two of 'em. Seems like a company making really cool mics.

Btw are they your favorite? Barring scientific mics, would you say they're the best overall?

 

[Tks]

I also got a question about mics (well kinda).

You know how on Youtube and video podcasts/radio, everyone and their mother has desk mics. I see super expensive ones sometimes. But no matter what, all of them are actually garbage by the way they're being used. Firstly, they all sound like the person has a mic down their throat. Anytime they move the sound changes insanely.

But then you have people making videos with shotgun/boom mics (or whatever you call those that are off-screen and being held up by a mechanical arm slightly off camera.)

Almost EVERY single one of those microphones are far more consistent when watching peoples videos that use them.

So my question is, honestly besides seemingly these "throat" desk mics I suppose having a sound field pattern that doesn't have to take into account room reflections so much - what is honestly the wisdom behind using these stupid mics where your lips have to be borderline committing visual induendo with the mic? Keep in mind, this goes for those studio-type situations where a person is in a foam padded room, but they're still having their mouth an inch away from the mic, or an inch away from whatever filter is between you and the mic.

Why would anyone use these sorts of mics? Is it honestly people not wanting to buy arms to hold up a mic off-screen. Because if it's all about the sound field pattern (i get that a shotgun mic can use the same one, and is highly directive), then to hell with that pattern because the hit to sound "naturalness" is just awful. I don't want to hear that muffled sound due to how close people have their mics in their face..

 

[Trell]

I also got a question about mics (well kinda).

You know how on Youtube and video podcasts/radio, everyone and their mother has desk mics. I see super expensive ones sometimes. But no matter what, all of them are actually garbage by the way they're being used. Firstly, they all sound like the person has a mic down their throat. Anytime they move the sound changes insanely.

But then you have people making videos with shotgun/boom mics (or whatever you call those that are off-screen and being held up by a mechanical arm slightly off camera.)

Almost EVERY single one of those microphones are far more consistent when watching peoples videos that use them.

So my question is, honestly besides seemingly these "throat" desk mics I suppose having a sound field pattern that doesn't have to take into account room reflections so much - what is honestly the wisdom behind using these stupid mics where your lips have to be borderline committing visual induendo with the mic? Keep in mind, this goes for those studio-type situations where a person is in a foam padded room, but they're still having their mouth an inch away from the mic, or an inch away from whatever filter is between you and the mic.

Why would anyone use these sorts of mics? Is it honestly people not wanting to buy arms to hold up a mic off-screen. Because if it's all about the sound field pattern (i get that a shotgun mic can use the same one, and is highly directive), then to hell with that pattern because the hit to sound "naturalness" is just awful. I don't want to hear that muffled sound due to how close people have their mics in their face..

Many of them think that "throaty" sounds intimate and is desirable, but I feel more like someone is about to lick my ear at times. Yuck. It's uncomfortable intimate and sounds unnatural to me.

The other aspect is that microphones have sweet spots along with distances that varies strongly among them: Choose the wrong mic for the job and you get what you describe of the tonality changing when the person moves.

There is also "voicing" of mics in accordance with their intended use case, and that is a preference as well as practicalities.

 

[Chromatischism]

I also got a question about mics (well kinda).

You know how on Youtube and video podcasts/radio, everyone and their mother has desk mics. I see super expensive ones sometimes. But no matter what, all of them are actually garbage by the way they're being used. Firstly, they all sound like the person has a mic down their throat. Anytime they move the sound changes insanely.

But then you have people making videos with shotgun/boom mics (or whatever you call those that are off-screen and being held up by a mechanical arm slightly off camera.)

Almost EVERY single one of those microphones are far more consistent when watching peoples videos that use them.

So my question is, honestly besides seemingly these "throat" desk mics I suppose having a sound field pattern that doesn't have to take into account room reflections so much - what is honestly the wisdom behind using these stupid mics where your lips have to be borderline committing visual induendo with the mic? Keep in mind, this goes for those studio-type situations where a person is in a foam padded room, but they're still having their mouth an inch away from the mic, or an inch away from whatever filter is between you and the mic.

Why would anyone use these sorts of mics? Is it honestly people not wanting to buy arms to hold up a mic off-screen. Because if it's all about the sound field pattern (i get that a shotgun mic can use the same one, and is highly directive), then to hell with that pattern because the hit to sound "naturalness" is just awful. I don't want to hear that muffled sound due to how close people have their mics in their face..

I think that's part of why the NT1 sounds good to me - it's natural rather than someone trying to compensate for something. And it doesn't seem like you need to be right on top of it.