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Beyerdynamic DT 880 600 Ohm Review (Headphone)

Sharur

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what if headphone soundstage is just placebo? how can you blind test it?
 

maverickronin

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How do you know there isn't something that's inexplicable from measurements if you can't tell how a headphone sounds from measurements?

Because the electronics can easily be perfect well beyond the known limits of human hearing. Transducers are not. Therefore: gray area.

Besides that, there is disagreement about what target headphones should even aim for Electronics are obvious. They should be wires with gain. Headphones are a completely different story. Besides variation in preference for raw frequency response there is the problem that headphones are a binaural delivery system which is almost exclusively used to listen to stereo mixes. This causes disagreement as to whether headphones should attempt as far as possible to emulate the sense of space that comes from speakers or if the presentation should be entirely "in-head".

what if headphone soundstage is just placebo? how can you blind test it?

Just blind the tests as far as possible and ask people to report their perceptions. It's not any different from any other research of human senses
 
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solderdude

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so how are spatial qualities explained?

Because of the driver ear distance, inner cup dimensions, and driver angle as well as the driver membrane shape.
Also frequency response between 1kHz and 5kHz may have something to do with it.

Not every one hears spatial qualities similarly. Ear shape (all pinnae are unique like fingerprints) and how the brain interprets the incoming signals also matters as well as recording techniques. For some spatializers work, for others head tracking or crossfeed.

Can you see it in FR or time domain measurements ? I don't believe you can because of the above. I certainly have not but my measurements are pinna-less and that does have something to do with this.
 

Sharur

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Because of the driver ear distance, inner cup dimensions, and driver angle as well as the driver membrane shape.
Also frequency response between 1kHz and 5kHz may have something to do with it.

Not every one hears spatial qualities similarly. Ear shape (all pinnae are unique like fingerprints) and how the brain interprets the incoming signals also matters as well as recording techniques. For some spatializers work, for others head tracking or crossfeed.

Can you see it in FR or time domain measurements ? I don't believe you can because of the above. I certainly have not but my measurements are pinna-less and that does have something to do with this.
For IEMs, does this must mean frequency response is extremely close to the truth?
 

solderdude

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IEM's have other challenges like seal and insertion depth and the fact that the outer ear and part of the ear canal is bypassed and thus would have to be incorporated in the frequency response.
 

Sharur

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Speaker terminals have large noises. The noise although may not be apparently audible it's possibly over threshold and can color the sound.
You know, I think that's the case. I get more perceived width from the speaker terminals, but there's also a smoothing effect.
 

IdleTalk

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Dear Amir, please, stop describing impedance peak as "reality".
Such description is rather provoking superstition, not science.

If a headphone needed any higher voltage to reproduce same SPL at an impedance peak, a SPL dip should be seen at that frequency on the FR graph, because FR graph is about SPL response from same voltage input, not from same wattage input.
 

Sharur

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Screen Shot 2021-07-14 at 2.43.06 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-07-14 at 2.44.28 PM.png

@amirm am I missing something? why does it need more power in the bass when voltage is the same?
 
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solderdude

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@amirm am I missing something? why does it need more power in the bass when voltage is the same?

You may have missed that Amir did not say it needed more power. He stated the lack of subbass means it needs bass boost and given its high impedance it needs a high output voltage.

Bass is where we need power and here, we are above 720 ohm so you best have a headphone amplifier with very high output voltage.
 

Sharur

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You may have missed that Amir did not say it needed more power. He stated the lack of subbass means it needs bass boost and given its high impedance it needs a high output voltage.
What benefits would the power from a90 balanced bring over, say, a magni heresy when both have "distortion free power"?
 

Jimbob54

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What benefits would the power from a90 balanced bring over, say, a magni heresy when both have "distortion free power"?

Little to none if the HP you use at the levels you listen to dont need it.
 

solderdude

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What benefits would the power from a90 balanced bring over, say, a magni heresy when both have "distortion free power"?

6dB more headroom/power. That would mean modifying it as the DT880 has a fixed cable (3-wire AFAIK)
 

Sharur

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@amirm after reading this review and your other beyerdynamic reviews, all of a sudden I was able to hear "warbling" tones in some songs whereas they were absent on my Etymotic ER4XR.

This was the best I was able to get on the klippel test with the ER4XR:
Screen Shot 2021-07-31 at 7.02.29 PM.png


I can hear the warbling tones in the distorted track much easier on the DT880 600 Ω and am able to get a better score because of that?
Screen Shot 2021-07-31 at 7.03.01 PM.png
 

Sharur

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It doesn't seem to be audible in "high fidelity recordings" either.

At 0:45 in this song I am hearing some warbling noise and can't tell if it's the music or my headphones. I can hear it on low volumes as well.
.
 

Doodski

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It doesn't seem to be audible in "high fidelity recordings" either.

At 0:45 in this song I am hearing some warbling noise and can't tell if it's the music or my headphones. I can hear it on low volumes as well.
.
I hear a breathing type quality to the sound. Warbling breathing.
 
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