NAD M33 Streaming Amplifier Review

[pogo]

Yes thats just what I did. My c658 was connected to a high quality amp with the same magnipan speakers. I made 5 filters using the same microphone "umk something" sound was great. No loss of base and no reduction of headroom.

If I understand you correctly, you have not made a DL calibration in this configuration:

Have you tried to use your C658 as preamplifier for the M33 and started a DL measurement on the C658?

If possible test this combination in order to identify the bottleneck.

 

[watchnerd]

I have downgraded my DL to a Devialet Sweet Room with better usability

Am I understanding that you like the Devialet PEQ better than DL?

I was considering the M33 as a side-grade from my Devialet Expert 400, but the gray zone of Roon support and the DL issues have caused me to sit tight with my Devialet.

I'd have to get the Core Infinity upgrade to get Sweet Room, though.

 

[Jbeck]

If I understand you correctly, you have not made a DL calibration in this configuration:



If possible test this combination in order to identify the bottleneck.

Yes I have 5 filters on the c658.

 

[Jbeck]

Yes I have 5 filters on the c658.

And none of them on the c658 results in diminished sound stage or a reduction of volume.

 

[pogo]

My c658 was connected to a high quality amp with the same magnipan speakers.

Which device type was used as 'high quality amp'?
By the way, take a look at your ASR 'Inbox'.

 

[pogo]

Am I understanding that you like the Devialet PEQ better than DL?

I was considering the M33 as a side-grade from my Devialet Expert 400, but the gray zone of Roon support and the DL issues have caused me to sit tight with my Devialet.

I'd have to get the Core Infinity upgrade to get Sweet Room, though.

I can't say whether I like sweet room better, as I haven't had the opportunity to try it out. I wanted to illustrate the correction function of DL, which is still possible after using my self generated flat curve. Through my procedure, I had suppressed the impulse response correction that Sweet Room does not offer at all.
I look hopefully towards to your side-grade (please post your impressions). The DL and Roon issue should soon be a thing of the past.

 

[pogo]

I'm going to research if I can somehow copy the filters from the c658 and transfer to the m33. Is that possible?

Even if this leads to an improvement, a limitation due to your old signal chain (e.g. power amp) can also be expected here. As you've already noticed, the M33 plays much faster and squeaky clean. Therefore, to get closer to the root cause, it would be interesting to find out how the auditory impression results when the C658 interacts for the M33 (Purifis) as a preamp with repeated DL correction on the C658.

 

[Jbeck]

I have connected the c658 as a pre amp to the m33 power amps. DL on the c658 sounds like it should. Full dynamics, headroom, great sound stage.
DL on the m33 is a poor performance.
Got a letter from NAD. They are not looking into any current DL problems with the nad 33 as opposed to that I was earlier lead to believe. They said that an issue was found in November and resolved. No updates are expected.

 

[Jbeck]

Even if this leads to an improvement, a limitation due to your old signal chain (e.g. power amp) can also be expected here. As you've already noticed, the M33 plays much faster and squeaky clean. Therefore, to get closer to the root cause, it would be interesting to find out how the auditory impression results when the C658 interacts for the M33 (Purifis) as a preamp with repeated DL correction on the C658.

Dl on the c658 sounds perfect when connected to the m33 purifi amplifiers. I want to copy the filters from the c658 to the m33 . Is that possible?

 

[Jbeck]

[QUOTE="pogo, post: 67. The DL and Roon issue should soon be a thing of the past.[/QUOTE]
Are you expecting a correction update? NAD told me they don't have plans to fix anything. They don't see any problem.

One big problem is how DL adjusts time and phase alignment across the full spectrum even tho I request correction in limited areas like 30hz to 100hz. The limiting curtain on my m33 has little effect . DL clearly does some processing outside my requested window of adjustment.
I want some correction between 30hz and 100hz but dirac live applies phase and time alignment across the whole band despite my limited settings.

 

[pogo]

Are you expecting a correction update? NAD told me they don't have plans to fix anything. They don't see any problem.

Here is my last status regarding the DL problem from NAD support from the beginning of December (excerpt):
...
The issue could not be corrected with the last firmware update. We therefore ask you to be patient - one of the next updates should fix the problem.
...

Here again to explain the further procedure that I would take if I had your options to narrow down the cause:
The C658 interacts for the M33 (Purifis) as a preamp with new measurement of the DL correction on the C658 in this configuration.
For example, if you should get a cloudy sound again, how the m33 does it, you should focus primarily on the measuring microphone as the cause.
We are dealing with a new amplifier technology and I have never heard an amplifier play so fast and squeaky clean before. And since this phenomenon only seems to occur on high-quality loudspeakers in connection with the purifis, the system limits of a UMIK-1 or the DL algorithms for a proper DL correction could have been reached here and lead to drowsy impulse recordings/inputs.

See also here:
Link

Extract from chapter ‘Das Messsystem‘
... for pulse measurements are at least two octaves (four times the frequency!) above the range to be measured. ...

And a UMIK-1 can't do that!!!

 

[watchnerd]

Roon issue should soon be a thing of the past.

I dunno about that.

The M10 took forever to get fully Roon certified.

And NAD would really prefer people use their own BluOS.

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

I wonder what we'd find if we measured the electronics of active monitors the way we measure external components...

+1

 

[Maru]

I received a text from Nad. They said that they did in fact see an issue with dirac live and BluOs on the m33. So now I can stop searching for solutions. But....... now my screen has blown out around the edges and I have clicking and popping . Not a smart purchase. Now after all this my screen is blown out

I had exactly the same screen issue yesterday, I have been told by NAD that its a software issue, hard to believe. Today it seems the corrupted screen is fading away. How is it yours ?

 

[pdxaudio]

I have an issue with my M33 that I’m hoping somebody could check on their system. I recently noticed that it’s cutting off the first few notes of a song, about a second or so, when choosing to play a song through BluOS. If you choose that same song again, it plays it fine but if you then choose a different song from a different album, the issue happens again. This also seems to happen with a different source connected through coaxial or optical input. But playing through Roon is fine, AirPlay also works well. I’m on the latest version of firmware and I have also performed Factory Reset and reinstalled the firmware but the issue is still there.

 

[Jbeck]

I had exactly the same screen issue yesterday, I have been told by NAD that its a software issue, hard to believe. Today it seems the corrupted screen is fading away. How is it yours ?

I'm not sure what you mean "fading away" do you mean the issue is no longer there?
I would have to agree that the screen issue is not software related. Mine has returned to normal operation. I still am experiencing digital audio artifacts within the music. Like goast pops or ticks almost as if it was part of the original recording but it follows all music. Then for a few days no issue.
I'm hoping these issues along with a fix for dirac live would happen. I am amazed at the sound quality and technology that the m33 has.

 

[osullis]

Would you say that, whatever weak points there are on this unit, they have more to do with the streamer/dac rather than with the amplifier section? Also, is it possible to use this (let's say to test it) as a digital source -- streamer and dac -- and run a different amplifier through that? Thanks!

 

[watchnerd]

So glad now that I didn't buy one of these, like I was planning to, when they first came out.

 

[Maru]

I'm not sure what you mean "fading away" do you mean the issue is no longer there?
I would have to agree that the screen issue is not software related. Mine has returned to normal operation. I still am experiencing digital audio artifacts within the music. Like goast pops or ticks almost as if it was part of the original recording but it follows all music. Then for a few days no issue.
I'm hoping these issues along with a fix for dirac live would happen. I am amazed at the sound quality and technology that the m33 has.

Yep fading away meant the screen issue started disappearing and after 2 days is back to normal.
Regarding your pops and ticks had something similar too as well but it was related to some songs on how they were recorded, not sure if the same issue

DL, confirm that it flattens the sound quite a lot not matter which pre-curve I use (e.g. NAD ones)
Sound quality overall is good but cant really say is exceptional, it depends a lot on the recording in my case.
I would say that from a software point of view im disappointed, blueos app seems to be written by some unix developers wiith little UX experience, some bugs here and there as well.

 

[SIY]

I have an issue with my M33 that I’m hoping somebody could check on their system. I recently noticed that it’s cutting off the first few notes of a song, about a second or so, when choosing to play a song through BluOS. If you choose that same song again, it plays it fine but if you then choose a different song from a different album, the issue happens again. This also seems to happen with a different source connected through coaxial or optical input. But playing through Roon is fine, AirPlay also works well. I’m on the latest version of firmware and I have also performed Factory Reset and reinstalled the firmware but the issue is still there.

I’ve had the same experience with both the M10 and M33. Only on the first selected song on a list, though- the transition to following songs is seamless. When measuring, I’d hit it with a sine wave for a couple of seconds before starting, just to wake up whatever circuitry was on hiatus.