Benchmark Stack

[dallasjustice]

Don’t hesitate to tell us about sound (vs. old gear) and features!

I’m not sure there are many features to discuss. The amps have variable gain which is very useful. I use the speakon connectors for the speaker wire. So I am using the cables Benchmark sells.

The only way to describe the sound compared to before with the Luxman amp and Lynx Hilo is that it’s the same level of detail but I get a more pleasant relaxed impression listening. That could be the expectation bias talking tho.

 

[dallasjustice]

My chain:
Roon to Jriver (apply filters and routing to make a 4 channel, 3 Way system with mono subs) to Lynx Hilo. Hilo AES out to Benchmark DAC 3 and Lynx Hilo monitor outs to 2 subwoofers. The benchmark goes out to each amp and then to the R/L speakers which are JBL 4367.

 

[dallasjustice]

They are good, the AHB2 replaced Mola-Mola here, and the Dac3 has been faultless.


Keith

Speaking of the Mola Mola gear:

One of the issues I was concerned about is making sure the benchmark DAC, which is connected to the Hilo over AES, remains in sync with the Hilo so that my crossovers don’t get screwed up. I tried the same setup once before with the Mola Mola DAC and asked Bruno about whether I could do that beforehand. I guess he forgot to mention to me that the Mola DAC has a strange jitter attenuation scheme that results in totally inconsisent propagation delay every time the signal locks over AES. I purchased the Mola DAC and setup my crossover. I checked the REW group delay and notice the big differences every time i recorded my sweep. It was a disaster and I was forced to get rid of the Mola DAC. I felt that Bruno was very unprofessional in how he handled the whole situation.

In stark contrast to that experience, I checked with Benchmark engineers about the propagation delay and explained my setup. They explained that there would be no shift in propagation delay and that I could use the DAC for crossovers. I ran numerous measurements checking group delay around the crossover. I even turned the DAC off and on and relocked the AES. Everytime I measured, the group delay remained the same. To me, Benchmark really is an elite engineering outfit and their gear represents them well.

 

[DonH56]

Looks fantastically austere, the year you spent meditating in you underpants up a Tibetan mountain with a bunch of thin bold geezers has paid off.

Please, please, PLEASE tell us you meant "old" or "bald"!!! The image of bold geezers in underpants anywhere is tough to handle...

 

[Thomas savage]

Please, please, PLEASE tell us you meant "old" or "bald"!!! The image of bold geezers in underpants anywhere is tough to handle...

I ment Bald But bold works too

 

[Sal1950]

Really nice setup! However don't underestimate the detrimental effect of stacking the amps, see Stereophiles recent discovery on the subject below ... ;-)
Amir, something to put on your ToDo list!

" Whoa! Everything came into more precise focus, with more detailed, more extended bass, cleaner highs, and greater dynamic ease. Going back and forth between stacked and unstacked while listening to other familiar recordings confirmed those initial impressions: The Stellar M700s sounded better when sitting side by side on individual stands than when stacked atop one another."

Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content...monoblock-power-amplifier#ieAqCPZ2JF3vzQEd.99

Another "stellar" case of ridiculous Stereophile pandering to the audiophool market and their spending dollar$.
If your going to cheap out on $3k amps, your going to absolutely need a pair of high end stands and set them on IsoAcoustics Orea Audio Equipment Isolators before they sound decent. Of course he uses Nodoz cabling and power cords exclusively.
I laughed my ass off when I read that review a week or so back.
What a freaking circus

 

[Sal1950]

The only way to describe the sound compared to before with the Luxman amp and Lynx Hilo is that it’s the same level of detail but I get a more pleasant relaxed impression listening. That could be the expectation bias talking tho.

Dallas, That "pleasant relaxed" feeling came from the money you saved.

 

[davkj]

My chain:
Roon to Jriver (apply filters and routing to make a 4 channel, 3 Way system with mono subs) to Lynx Hilo. Hilo AES out to Benchmark DAC 3 and Lynx Hilo monitor outs to 2 subwoofers.

I'm curious as to why the Benchmark is needed, doesn't the Hilo support 4 channels out? I'm very interested in trying something similar to what you are doing.

 

[svart-hvitt]

@dallasjustice ,

maybe a bit off-topic, but I have the impression that the Benchmark combo is (only!?) the latest stage on your route to audio heaven

I want to go back in time, when you played with HQ Player. I play with HQP myself now and am curious about your experiences with said software and Jussi, the programmer.

Intellectually, it makes sense to let a computer and software do the heavy stuff while keeping hardware as simple and clean as possible.

 

[dallasjustice]

Seas uses the AHB2 to test its drivers. There’s interesting info about how class D amps cause problems with drivers.
https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/ap...ory-use-of-the-benchmark-ahb2-power-amplifier

 

[dallasjustice]

@dallasjustice ,

maybe a bit off-topic, but I have the impression that the Benchmark combo is (only!?) the latest stage on your route to audio heaven

I want to go back in time, when you played with HQ Player. I play with HQP myself now and am curious about your experiences with said software and Jussi, the programmer.

Intellectually, it makes sense to let a computer and software do the heavy stuff while keeping hardware as simple and clean as possible.

I think HQP is really only useful if you believe upsampling is useful. I don’t have a use for it anymore. I do believe HQP convolver works well.

The Benchmark DAC 3 max sample rate is 192khz or DSD. I just use Roon to upsample everything to 192khz and route the output to Jriver ASIO line in through the Lynx mixer loopback. I use Jriver’s convolver and a plug-in called perfect declippper.

 

[dallasjustice]

I'm curious as to why the Benchmark is needed

It’s not needed. But I’m happy to have it.

 

[dallasjustice]

Dallas, That "pleasant relaxed" feeling came from the money you saved.

You may be correct. I sold off all my expensive gear and replaced it all with relatively inexpensive gear. I can’t prove the Benchmark gear is better than any of the obscenely expensive gear I’ve owned over the years. But I’d be willing to bet money that it’s no worse. I guess that doesn’t sound like an endorsement. I just don’t want to overstate things.

Amir made a point the other day about peace of mind in knowing that the gear performs well enough that you don’t feel like you’ll be missing out on something else better (FOMO). Benchmark certainly checks that box. I’d put the DAC 3 or the AHB2 up against any DAC or any amp at any price. It’s that good. The best measuring amp I’ve owned was a solution 710. I have no doubt the AHB2 would perform as well or better.

What’s funny is that the Benchmark stuff is so inexpensive compared to the super high end stuff that it flies under the radar; the audiophile jewelry snobs would never consider it, just based on price.

 

[svart-hvitt]

I think HQP is really only useful if you believe upsampling is useful. I don’t have a use for it anymore. I do believe HQP convolver works well.

The Benchmark DAC 3 max sample rate is 192khz or DSD. I just use Roon to upsample everything to 192khz and route the output to Jriver ASIO line in through the Lynx mixer loopback. I use Jriver’s convolver and a plug-in called perfect declippper.

Thanks for answering!

I just recently started to use HQP with Roon. Genelec 8351 makes upsampling on its own to 24/96 and 24/48 so upsampling in software makes intuitive sense. Genelecs accept PCM only, so no DSD streaming.

I am also intrigued by all the filters in HQP, minimum vs linear phase, for example. It strikes me that digital products could sound different due to differences in filtering. I need to get a better grip on this. Just for curiosity. Any differences are subtle, but Archimago’s blind test some time ago supported Jussi’s claim that LP is better for acoustic/classical while MP is better for studio productions.

I would have liked to try the declipper myself. But I am streaming only and don’t use JRiver. Roon and HQP don’t take VST plugins.

Roon, BTW, is a keeper. I think userfriendliness is a must since the entire family uses the setup.

Next week I will start streaming everything from Apple TV=>Samsung The Frame and a Mac Pro.

 

[oivavoi]

There’s interesting info about how class D amps cause problems with drivers.
https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/ap...ory-use-of-the-benchmark-ahb2-power-amplifier

This is exactly what those Swedish engineers in the LTS are saying about class D. Now Benchmark of course have economic interests in touting their own design. Would really like to see some independent and thorough testing on this.

 

[Blumlein 88]

This is exactly what those Swedish engineers in the LTS are saying about class D. Now Benchmark of course have economic interests in touting their own design. Would really like to see some independent and thorough testing on this.

I think the main reason someone would choose Benchmark is the low distortion and SOTA noise levels. Then throw in that yes, you need not use ultrasonic filters or worry if there is interaction and easy choice. That however it not quite the same as saying class D is inherently a problem for playback. Besides my ESLs shunt high frequencies pretty much to ground. About a 1 ohm impedance at 20 khz and dropping as the frequency goes up. Class D sounds great on them.

 

[oivavoi]

I think the main reason someone would choose Benchmark is the low distortion and SOTA noise levels. Then throw in that yes, you need not use ultrasonic filters or worry if there is interaction and easy choice. That however it not quite the same as saying class D is inherently a problem for playback. Besides my ESLs shunt high frequencies pretty much to ground. About a 1 ohm impedance at 20 khz and dropping as the frequency goes up. Class D sounds great on them.

Yeah, I've also heard some setups with class d I really like. Not really sure what to make of this. Beyond my technical level of competence.

 

[March Audio]

Seas uses the AHB2 to test its drivers. There’s interesting info about how class D amps cause problems with drivers.
https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/ap...ory-use-of-the-benchmark-ahb2-power-amplifier

Whilst the the benchmark article seems to make sense, surely any intermodulation products that exist in the audio band would be measureable with the AP filter in circuit? The AP filter is to prevent issues with its input curcuitry so that it is not corrupting the results. That doesnt stop in band problems with the DUT being observed.

Its certainly a test I would be interested in performing. Im not convinced there is going to be much, if any, physical output from a tweeter fed with a 380kHz sine swiching output from a class d amp. The tweeter will act like a filter. So I struggle to see it as being a real problem.

Having said this, I think I have found a minor issue with the combination of my hypex amps and my Motu 8A dac. The motu outputs a strong tone around 700kHz and this may be causing a low level noise in the hypex output. But thats another thread after more investigation

 

[cjf]

Hello Dallas,

I was glad to see you list how you have your equipment chained together as I will soon be using a few pieces of gear you have shown (Lynx Hilo & Earthworks 1021). Of particular interest to me was how you are using the Monitor Outs on the Lynx to your subs. For that connection what are you setting the volume/output pots to within the Hilo?

I was also thinking of using the AES Outs of the Hilo to feed a different DAC. Do you find that connection pretty transparent given the signal is going thru an extra piece of gear before reaching a different end of line DAC compared to not using the Hilo as a Passthru?

As a side note, its good to see that the Earthworks 1021 does indeed exist in the flesh. I've been waiting for mine for over a month (backordered). What do you think of it?

Thanks

 

[dallasjustice]

I've been waiting for mine for over a month (backordered). What do you think of it?

I’ve got an extra one if you want to buy it.