Elections and voting (in general) ...

[amirm]

I was hoping this thread would be mostly about getting people to vote. Wanted to create a thread on that but saw this one and thought it could do the same. So please, let's not deviate much or I will have to close the thread. Like to post another review that I have finished measurements for than to deal with issues here.

 

[ex audiophile]

"Everything's political"

- Bob Marley

Well.. if Bob Marley said it it must be true.

 

[Ron Texas]

[Redacted] will win the election today. Someone asked me why the stock market was up today. He wanted to know if I believed there will be a quick resolution. My answer is the data is totally confusing. We might have a hint this evening, but probably not an answer.

 

[L5730]

So, a different question from the first two, but somewhat in the same thinking:

How about more public votes on things. Referendums if you will. Seeing how decisive it was in the UK last time and how many families and friendships broke down, what could go wrong having more of them, right?

I suppose, if there is a constant public voting nothing ever gets done and the cost has to be handled somewhere. "Hey folks, we were donna have a referendum on fixing potholes or building a bypass, but seeing as the cost of this referendum has eaten the funds, we're doing neither. Thanks for your interest".

Switzerland looks to have a few public votes quite often.

 

[pozz]

I suppose, if there is a constant public voting nothing ever gets done and the cost has to be handled somewhere. "Hey folks, we were donna have a referendum on fixing potholes or building a bypass, but seeing as the cost of this referendum has eaten the funds, we're doing neither. Thanks for your interest".

I don't know. This is how opinion polls work, and those go on constantly. There needs to be some input from the constituency to their representatives. Everyone cares about the basics, but specific input tends to determine the priorities.

 

[Martin]

Before we even discuss voter turn out and how to get people more involved we need to address why they are not.

<rant>
The major problem in American politics is MONEY.

Lobbying should be illegal. The supreme court ruling that money = speech was a huge mistake and needs to be over-turned.

Campaign donations should be severely curtailed, like $100 per person with no donations allowed by corporations. Campaign lengths need to be shortened immensely. The candidates for president have been running for 18 months - that is INSANE. Let's cap them at 3 months.

Then we need to enact strict term limits. 2 terms each for senators and representatives. Let's take professional politicians out of the game. There is a HUGE problem when public servants can become wealthy while they are in office, and an even bigger one when they rake in millions after they leave.

Unfortunately the greedy bastards currently screwing over the people they supposedly represent will never allow these controls to be put in place.
</rant>

 

[pozz]

The supreme court ruling that money = speech was a huge mistake

Can you post a link to the decision?

 

[Blumlein 88]

This makes no sense because when I click on "explore" I get a totally different picture. Trump has a very strong lead in search results. Are these average numbers?

Maybe you two are in different google bubbles.

 

[L5730]

@Martin That's not just a problem for the US, but seemingly everywhere.
As much as I am for keeping the UK in the EU, the whopping great building right next to the European Parliament building in Brussels does not paint a great picture.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_lobbying

Let's be real for a moment, if lobbying was illegal, does anyone really think it would stop? All that would happen is that the smaller lobbying firms would have less of a chance. The big ones would carry on business as usual.

I was going to mention something about honesty and decency, but remembered this is about politics!

 

[L5730]

Maybe you two are in different google bubbles.

Would Google manipulate data and present it in a different form based on the profile generated from the collected data of the individual?
(it's rhetorical)

 

[RayDunzl]

This isn't how it should be...

 

[L5730]

This isn't how it should be...

View attachment 91308

I was seeing this stuff in small online articles. It is quite sad, and frightening.

 

[AudioJester]

Aussie elections are compulsory - potentially face a fine for not voting without a good excuse.
However, they are fun events and very well organised and manned. No real long lines or waiting, easy to get to etc.
Usually most of the schools are turned into polling stations - with sausage sizzles, cakes, activities for the kids etc.
There is no "us" and "them", you will find people from both sides of the fence/politics conversing and enjoying each others company. Often catch up with people you havnt seen for a while. Probably find Mr March and RestorerJohn having a beer together!
There is definitely no boarding up of shops etc., in fact the opposite as everything opens up as everyone is out and about.

 

[SoundAndMotion]

Can you post a link to the decision?

Citizens United v. FEC

 

[L5730]

Aussie elections are compulsory - potentially face a fine for not voting without a good excuse.
However, they are fun events and very well organised and manned. No real long lines or waiting, easy to get to etc.
Usually most of the schools are turned into polling stations - with sausage sizzles, cakes, activities for the kids etc.
There is no "us" and "them", you will find people from both sides of the fence/politics conversing and enjoying each others company. Often catch up with people you havnt seen for a while. Probably find Mr March and RestorerJohn having a beer together!
There is definitely no boarding up of shops etc., in fact the opposite as everything opens up as everyone is out and about.

That sounds wonderful!
I watch a topical comedy news show on UK TV Channel 4 called "The Last Leg" with an Aussie presenter Adam Hills (did a KFC Fillet burger commercial in 1993). He said that voting day is like a big national day out. I've seen the democracy sausage selfie thing, that's great.

In England, it's like everything for us, a point to moan about Polling station too far away, weather too cold, hot, wet, dry, windy or boring.
Generally, with exception of the EU membership referendum vote, everyone is quiet and polite and respectful at the polling station. People always seem to hold the door open for the next person, or step aside. Everyone seems overly polite and not yobbish. Maybe I am in an area full of old people They got a bit rowdy over the EU vote, probably because the polling station was held at the local public house!

 

[Universal Cereal Bus]

And I think we have way too many people who are a net drain who vote for more benefits they can't afford.

One of the arguments for a robust social safety net is that it can have a positive impact on entrepreneurship and the free market. Solo businesses (sole proprietor, self-employed, contractor, etc.) can take greater risks, try things that are more unconventional, or simply invest more personal funds into their idea. This isn't limited to "business people" in the conventional sense; it applies equally to artists and such.

Just because someone is being a "net drain" doesn't mean that person is stuck that way forever. Children are a net drain until they grow up and contribute to society. Adults can "grow up" too.

 

[restorer-john]

What happens to someone who does not vote?

They get a fine in the mail. $133.45 in our state elections.

 

[Vini darko]

They get a fine in the mail. $133.45 in our state elections.

View attachment 91313

I think it's a good idea.

 

[JustAnandaDourEyedDude]

I guess a law making property ownership a prerequisite to being able to vote, would also include removal of all income taxes for those who do not own property? Because otherwise we run into that issue of "taxation without representation" about which we had a little difference of opinion with the Brits ... oh a while ago IIRC?

Edit: I guess we could go all Gattaca on this, and have different grades of citizenship, and one could buy one's way up if one were lacking the best genes.

Edit 2: Once such a law is passed, I suppose we could rely on the inherent goodness and naturally superior moral sense of the voting landed gentry to reject candidates for political office who promise "in the name of fairness and justice" to pass laws re-instituting income taxes on the non-landed non-voting-eligible feckless leeches that constitute the rest of society without giving them the right to vote. Politicians promising benefits if elected would hold zero appeal to landowners, I am sure.

 

[Inner Space]

And I think we have way too many people who are a net drain who vote for more benefits they can't afford.

Would you then support the idea that "taker" states should have their Congressional input withdrawn, so that the "maker" states could run internal politics unimpeded? Would seem to be a logical extension, but a slippery slope.